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Author Topic: Questions about jig tying  (Read 13004 times)

clarki

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Questions about jig tying
« on: November 01, 2018, 09:29:35 PM »

I started fishing jigs for coho with rubber grubs about 5 years ago, but it's only been in the past year that I've started tying my own. I've landed several on my home ties but I'm wanting to expand my repertoire. 

I've been tying with marabou, but I've seen some videos of tying jigs with shlappen.

What different effect does shlappen give you that you would use it instead of marabou? Under what conditions would you reach for a shlappen jig and not marabou?   

Is shlappen tied on jigs with techniques other that palmering?

Thanks, Newb Tier     
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RalphH

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Re: Questions about jig tying
« Reply #1 on: November 02, 2018, 06:09:29 AM »

Schlappen will add more volume than marabou in the water. It's a bit stiffer but is still soft. The individual fibres will also be visible vs marabou which is usually just a mass of material. Tie it as a collar use fibres as a tail or beard. Cut a V in the hackle and tie that in as a beard or build a collar. You can also use the tips to provide wings as is done with streamer flies such as a Spruce Fly

https://swittersb.wordpress.com/tag/spruce-fly/
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spoiler

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Re: Questions about jig tying
« Reply #2 on: November 02, 2018, 06:43:14 AM »

rabbit strips also make for great twitching jigs.
you can tie in a fairly long strip for the tail then palmer another one like you would with a hackle feather.
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Spawn Sack

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Re: Questions about jig tying
« Reply #3 on: November 02, 2018, 11:40:12 AM »

I'm no expert but here is my 2 cents.

Most typical jig ties use schlappen for the collar. For example, polar chenille body and schlappen collar, or rabbit body and schlappen collar, or marabou body and schlappen collar.

The only time I even tie a jig with schlappen only is if I intend to thread a worm or grub along the hook shank, so a body of whatever material would just be in the way. But a schlappen collar make the worm/grub jig look nice and add a bit of extra color + movement in the water.

Could you use schlappen for all or part of the body of a jig? I suppose, but your average schlappen feather is not going to be long enough to wrap the length of a jig hook shank.

So, IMO, there isn't really a condition where you would reach for a schlappen jig over a marabou jig, as most marabou jigs have a schlappen collar. However there are conditions where you might want to fish a jig with a schlappen collar and worm/grub body + tail. Such as for steelhead instead of salmon.

Don't over think it. Experiment with different body and schlappen collar combinations until you find something the fish really like. There are no set "rules" with jigs or flies, put whatever you think might catch a fish. Try adding various color combos of silly legs or legs cut off hoochies.
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dave c

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Re: Questions about jig tying
« Reply #4 on: November 02, 2018, 12:48:43 PM »

Ive been tying my own jigs for several years now.  My go to recipe is a marabou tail section a crosscut rabbit followed by schlappen collar. The shlappen collar is always a contrasting color to the rabbit strips.
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typhoon

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Re: Questions about jig tying
« Reply #5 on: November 02, 2018, 01:41:16 PM »

Marabou collapses in faster water. All my steelhead jigs have Schlappen over crosscut rabbit.
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RalphH

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Re: Questions about jig tying
« Reply #6 on: November 02, 2018, 04:49:53 PM »

marabou can be wound in front of a collar of schlappen, chinese neck hackle or spun arctic fox to add body, movement and keep it from collapsing. Streamer flies and intruders have used marabou for decades and are effective in fast water. Winding or spinning marabou in a loop increases it's body.

Rabbit and other fur strips, either standard or crosscut are also very effective. Standard fur strips can be wound like crosscut for extra body.

Most of the schlappen I have are several inches long so I don't understand how they are not long enough to wrap the length of a jig hook which most often has a relatively short shank.
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RalphH

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Re: Questions about jig tying
« Reply #7 on: November 03, 2018, 09:30:01 AM »

seems local jig tiers aren't experimenting with the classic bucktail jig:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IDhhcX65PEQ

great stuff that doesn't collapse in fast water.

I'd prefer flashabou type material rather than crystal flash used in this video
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4TheKids

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Re: Questions about jig tying
« Reply #8 on: November 03, 2018, 11:54:10 AM »

Awesome video Ralph. Thanks for sharing.
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Knnn

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Re: Questions about jig tying
« Reply #9 on: November 03, 2018, 02:10:34 PM »

Hey clarki, can I clarify that you are looking for information on twitching jigs rather than jigs you would float for, because this underlying assumption makes a big difference.

A lot of the info provided above is great stuff, however, I think it is more suited to conventional jigs you would drift under a float for chum or steel.  As you are aware, Coho have almost no interest in this type of presentation and are looking for big bold, in their face movement that will piss them off or spark their curiosity.

This is why curly tails work so well and I continue to use them today, particularly because they are cheap, easy and fast to make.

I never bother using shlappen, because I am not trying to bulk up the jig to get a certain profile, which is irrelevant when you have this demonic thing twitching up and down at a high rate of speed.

The main criteria I consider in twitching jig construction are as follows:

Jig weight - heavier weights for casting distance, penetrating quickly down into deeper water or getting down in faster flowing water.  The jig weight will also depends on rod length, sensitivity and action; its tough to feel a 1/8, 1/4 jig or even 5/16 on a long slow action rod.  Lighter jigs are better in shallower and slower water or if you need to hold the jig in a particularly depth horizon for a longer period of time.  Also the fish are sometimes sensitive to amplitude and frequency, which you can vary on the way you twitch, but will also be influenced by the weight and the materials you use to tie the jig with.

Materials - my goal is to achieve maximum movement, not create a certain profile.  I find marabou and rabbit create the best creating movement.  The dear hair in the bucktail jigs will move, but not as fluid as marabou or rabbit tail.  Marabou is the most fluid of the materials I use, however it collapses the most and is the most streamlined material.  This in off itself is not a problem with respect to volume or size, but it does allow the jig to sink faster compared to a bulkier material like rabbit that appears to have more friction and is therefore held up in the water column a little longer.  So for any given jig head weight, such as a 3/8 jig head, a maribou jig will sink faster than rabbit, it will penetrated deeper water more quickly and will generally require a faster twitching frequency and have a higher amplitude.  However, a similar weighted jig in full rabbit, i.e. with a long rabbit tail (zonker) and a cross cut rabbit body will sink slower and you can fish slightly shallower water and with a slower twitch speed. while still keeping the longer casting distance of the 3/8 jig head.  Obviously you can mix materials to fine tune the sink rate. 

Tail - try to make as long a tail as possible because that increases the movement as it flutters down.  However, the longer the tail the greater the chance it will wrap around the hook.  When using rabbit for my tails, if it is the usual narrow stuff, I keep the tail under 0.5 to 0.75 inches (12.5 to 19 mm) from the bend, however if I am using the wider magnum bunny then I often go longer.

Flash - because it is all about movement and attracting attention, always add a decent amount of flash to the jig.

The best combination I have found, to make cost effective and easy (i.e. fast) jigs is to tie, is a zonker rabbit tail and body wrapped with long hair UV chenielle.  The tail provides plenty of movement and the chenille provides movement and lots of flash.  I can tie one of these jigs in about 2-3 minutes and the chaneille goes a log way and is of a very uniform quality.

HTH


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RalphH

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Re: Questions about jig tying
« Reply #10 on: November 03, 2018, 02:55:59 PM »

hair wing flies have been catching coho for decades. The famous clouser minnow is basically a bucktail jig scaled to fly rod size. The coho blue & Mickey Finn are hair wing flies proven effective for coho and many other gamefish. Coho also go for slow presentations and small flies - little jigs should be deadly under the right conditions.
« Last Edit: November 03, 2018, 03:03:54 PM by RalphH »
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Hike_and_fish

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Re: Questions about jig tying
« Reply #11 on: November 03, 2018, 04:19:40 PM »

3/8 jig, rabbit tail, silly legs, flash the length of the rabbit, purple long chenille body, purple schlappen under a fuchsia schlappen collar. It works every year all the time for me. It's my all time favorite jig to twitch
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Gooey

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Re: Questions about jig tying
« Reply #12 on: November 03, 2018, 05:03:35 PM »

I have had success copying/supersizing coho flies into twitching jigs.  Christmas trees, wholly buggers, egg sucking leach, etc.

For twitching, I use marabou mostly, some rabbit and quite a bit of tinsel.  You might be surprised how a straight tinsel jig slays em!

Schlappen is something I might use as a collar but as a main ingredient, I'd only use it for jigs I intend to float.  Marabou is really all you need for twitching jigs.

I just cast up 300+ jigs.  1/8 and 1/4 w a size 1 hook for floating and 1/4, 3/8, and 1/2 w a 2/0 for twitching. If anyone is looking for quality blanks (matzo extra heavy sickle jig hooks) at a $1 each, drop me an email gkershawATshawDOTca. 

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clarki

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Re: Questions about jig tying
« Reply #13 on: November 15, 2018, 08:42:38 PM »

Thanks for your contributions to this thread, everyone. Sitting down tonight with a nip of Scotch and a laptop (for jig pattern ideas and cuz I forgot how to whip finish!) and having a go at some ties for the weekend.

Going to put some of Gooey's jig heads to the test.
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RalphH

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Re: Questions about jig tying
« Reply #14 on: November 15, 2018, 09:31:30 PM »

be sure to post some photos!
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"Two things are infinite, the Universe and human stupidity... though I am not completely sure about the Universe" ...Einstein as related to F.S. Perls.