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Author Topic: The real reason the Fraser is shut down.  (Read 16776 times)

Old Black Dog

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The real reason the Fraser is shut down.
« on: August 25, 2007, 04:12:14 PM »



Indigenous organization calls for protection of BC fishery

August 23, 2007 - by Joseph Quesnel

Indigenous groups in British Columbia are calling on the federal government to help them protect the sockeye fishery.

The First Nations Leadership Council, called upon Loyola Hearn, Minister of Fisheries and Oceans,to discuss the protection of the sockeye resource and Aboriginal fishing rights and work with BC First Nations on a priority basis to ensure the protection of the 2007 sockeye fishery.

“Without question the conservation of the sockeye fishery is the primary concern for all First Nations along the Fraser River. This has clearly been illustrated by the Tseil Waututh First Nation’s commendable decision to forgo their sockeye fishery this year in the name of conservation,” said Grand Chief Edward John, a member of the First Nations Summit political executive. “However, many First Nations are understandably frustrated with DFO’s inconsistent fisheries management and allocation methods which continue to put the fishery at risk.”

First Nations in the Fraser Basin are frustrated that DFO officials continue to allow a 2007 sport and commercial fishery. Despite low sockeye returns, DFO advised First Nations that conservation was not a concern and still proceeded to charge a significant number of Musqueam and Sto:lo fishermen. Meanwhile, alleged the press release, sport and recreational fishers continued to fish within view of the protest fishery, which they stated is a "complete contradiction of the rule of law according to the Sparrow decision."

“DFO has once again shown that they have absolutely no regard for First Nations legal and constitutional right to fish for food, social and ceremonial purposes, a right that is second only to conservation”, said Grand Chief Stewart Phillip, President of the Union of BC Indian Chiefs. “The First Nations Leadership Council are in full and complete support of First Nations Statements that “the Department of Fisheries and Oceans’ attempts to keep the First Nations off the fishing grounds are in violation of a Supreme Court of Canada decision” (Sparrow decision, 1990).

“We are calling for Minister Hearn to direct his officials to immediately halt all commercial and sport fisheries and to respect the rule of law by giving priority to the First Nations fishery after conservation needs are met”, said Shawn Atleo, BC Regional Chief of the Assembly of First Nations. “First Nations will not stand by and continue to allow the Government of Canada’s mismanagement of this valuable resource.

The First Nations Leadership Council is also calling on Minister Hearn to meet in person to discuss how DFO and BC First Nations can work in partnership to protect sustainable and healthy salmon stocks for all future generations.

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pikey

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Re: The real reason the Fraser is shut down.
« Reply #1 on: August 26, 2007, 08:10:57 AM »

You know, if the day even comes where the govt. tells me that I am not allowed to fish, EVER, and all the fish in the river belong to FN, then the rule of law is for all intents and purposes null and void.

An unfair law can't be enforced, people will just not comply.
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nosey

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Re: The real reason the Fraser is shut down.
« Reply #2 on: August 26, 2007, 08:23:20 AM »

Up until 1996 there was no sockeye fishery and people had no problem complying, everyone realizes that the fn pressure helped to get the river closed, but would th FN pressure been as great or as effective if the sports fishery had not totally ignored the DFO's request that we selectively fish for springs. The FN's may have pulled the trigger but the sports fishermen definitely gave them the ammunition.
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bentrod

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Re: The real reason the Fraser is shut down.
« Reply #3 on: August 26, 2007, 10:11:06 AM »

Do you think the FN will ever stop gravel mining their rivers?  You can get as many fish to the river as you want, but if the river is destroyed and they have no where to spawn and no side channels for rearing, all the fishing restrictions in the world won't help them.
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Old Black Dog

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Re: The real reason the Fraser is shut down.
« Reply #4 on: August 26, 2007, 11:05:51 AM »

Up until 1996 there was no sockeye fishery and people had no problem complying, everyone realizes that the fn pressure helped to get the river closed, but would th FN pressure been as great or as effective if the sports fishery had not totally ignored the DFO's request that we selectively fish for springs. The FN's may have pulled the trigger but the sports fishermen definitely gave them the ammunition.

The F/N tried through the courts to get us off the river and lost.
A small group of the sports angers raised their concerns in the press of flossing and the F/N then used this to get it closed.
We are wonderfull about fighting among ourselves.
There has been no science in all of this and till there is and real counts are done on the river it is so much speculation.

If there is an ethic problem then deal with that for what it is.

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Gooey

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Re: The real reason the Fraser is shut down.
« Reply #5 on: August 26, 2007, 07:02:06 PM »

Who knows whats goes on behind closed doors at these dfo and FN meetings but what it looks like to me so the same touble makers (cheam, sto lo, etc) are up to their same old tricks.  The thing that really pisses me off is that they (first nations) must know the sport impact on sockeye is small.  Especially when there is no sockeye opening.  Yes there is a by catch of sockeye in the chinook fishery but I think a majority of those socs are released.  There may be some small issues with sports poaching but really, the FN assembly are using the sports fishers as scape goats to justify their own poaching.  Those who refuse to stay off the water and fish have us to use as a bit of a "human rights" shield....ie ie sporties are fishing (who cares for what) then its the FN contstitutional right to fish for food and cerimonial purposes.

Even if flossing wasnt the issue it is right now i think DFO's position would be similiar simply due to the natives.  Until they gain control of this FN fishery and its associated problems, we are going to be held hostage season after season.
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fishherron

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Re: The real reason the Fraser is shut down.
« Reply #6 on: August 26, 2007, 07:54:16 PM »

If you guys think it's bad now wait untill all the settlements take place. Ask the guys up north.
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Nicole

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Re: The real reason the Fraser is shut down.
« Reply #7 on: August 26, 2007, 11:56:32 PM »

Apparently there were still people bottom bouncing today on the fraser... Gutsy!

DFO was towing an aluminum native boat, who was trying to do a drift... Maybe it was siezed? I have no idea.

Apparently they were going around in circles, it looked like they didn't know what to do with it...

Cheers,
Nicole
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BwiBwi

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Re: The real reason the Fraser is shut down.
« Reply #8 on: August 27, 2007, 12:32:02 AM »

Clean it up, drag it out to sea, sink it, use as an artificial reef.   ;D
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Rodney

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Re: The real reason the Fraser is shut down.
« Reply #9 on: August 27, 2007, 01:18:32 AM »

August 26th, 2007

Honourable Loyola Hearn, Minister
Fisheries and Oceans Canada
House of Commons,
Ottawa, Ontario
K1A 0E6

Dear Mr. Minister:

I am writing to you at this time to request you direct your DFO staff in Pacific Region to reopen the recreational fishery in the Fraser River between Mission and Hope at the start of the this coming week. Tthe target species to be Pink salmon and Chinook salmon. We make this request with the realization that you and your staff have an ongoing concern for the well being of this year’s Fraser River Sockeye returns. You may be assured that the recreational fishing sector shares those concerns and has worked hard over this summer to minimize if not eliminate any impact our fishery might have.

However the test fishing results over the past 4 or 5 days make it clear that the Fraser River Sockeye return for 2007 is virtually over. The fact that Canada approved the opening of commercial salmon fishing in the Pacific Salmon Treaty waters this past week, is proof positive that the numbers of Sockeye are going down and the concern over interception with it.

At the same time we are aware of the current estimate of a surplus of some 10 million Pink salmon already entering the Fraser River and they are now beginning to swamp the numbers of Sockeye in the river. The style of fishing for Pinks is totally different than that used to intercept Sockeye, but even if it were not, the simple numbers of Pinks in the river make it virtually impossible to get your fishing gear down to intercept Sockeye. Representatives in the recreational fishing community in the Chilliwack area have been advised by the DFO Area Director for the Lower Fraser River that he and his staff are prepared to sign off on an opening but he has not received the go-ahead from Vancouver DFO Headquarters. You have the authourity to order this approval and a duty to the people of Canada to see that this opening takes place.

We understand that there are not adequate Fraser River Sockeye stocks to provide for First Nations FSC requirements. We would suggest however that with a 10 million surplus in Pink Salmon returns to this river, there are more than enough fish to provide for any FSC needs. We would also strongly question the claim by for example representatives of the Cheam Band, that they are badly in need of fish. A number of your DFO staff and our members observed part of the Cheam gillnet fishery this past Friday and they also observed that when the nets were brought to shore and the fish taken out, many perfectly good Pink salmon, killed in the gillnet were simply thrown back into the river dead! If there is a need for fish for food, why are these perfectly good fish being thrown away? Most certainly all of us would rather eat steak for dinner than stew, but when there is no steak or no way to acquire some, and there is stew, we eat the stew. The point being Mr. Minister that while there may not be adequate stocks of the First Nations preferred fish. Sockeye, available for FSC, due to the quirks of ocean production, there remains more than adequate protein of equal food value in the 10 million Pink salmon and the million or so Chum salmon that are and will be returning.

The reopening of the river to the recreational angler will have no impact on the ability of Sockeye to pass through and reach the spawning grounds or be taken by the upriver First Nations, who have received little in the way of any fish this year and do not have the option of taking Pink salmon in their areas.

This closure has had a tremendous negative economic impact on the recreational fishing industry, a negative impact that will be felt through the loss of business of people who came in 2007 and were not allowed to fish and as a consequence will not be back in 2008, if ever.

We repeat, the opening of the river between Mission and Hope to the recreational fishery will have no negative impact on Sockeye stocks but a major positive economic impact on our industry.  We urge you to move immediately to bring about this reopening.

Yours in conservation:
 
Bill Otway, President
Sport Fishing Defence Alliance
P.O. Box 326, Merritt, B.C.
V1K 1B8

Cc – Hon Stockwell Day
Cc – Hon Chuck Strahl
Cc – Gary Breitkreuz
Cc – Randy Kamp
Cc – Paul Sprout
Cc – MLA’s
Cc – Members SDA

dennisK

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Re: The real reason the Fraser is shut down.
« Reply #10 on: August 27, 2007, 06:19:33 AM »

Apparently there were still people bottom bouncing today on the fraser... Gutsy!



Being a law school dropout (did 1 year at McGill) I'm curious what the legal standard for "intent" would be if a bottom bouncer was fishing on the fraser in the closed areas.  I would think simply saying that you were targeting non-salmon species, the burden of proof would reside on the DFO to prove their case. And unless you had a salmon in your possession, the court would throw the fine out. I don't think the DFO officer could say "everybody who bottom bounces MUST be fishing for salmon" and the court would blindly accept that as enough.

Interesting stuff anyways...
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bentrod

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Re: The real reason the Fraser is shut down.
« Reply #11 on: August 27, 2007, 06:55:11 AM »

The courts in Washington have given quite a bit of leeway to officers expert opinions.  In most cases, if it looks like a dog and barks like a dog, it is a dog. 
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nosey

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Re: The real reason the Fraser is shut down.
« Reply #12 on: August 27, 2007, 08:14:19 AM »

How has the recreational fishing sector worked hard to minimize if not eliminate any impact the fishery might have, by only dragging the sockeye they plan on releasing up the gravel bar one kick away from the river instead of two perhaps by only standing on them with one foot when removing the hook, how about only killling them and hiding them in the bush when they thought nobody was looking. Mr. Otway was obviously not fishing in between Hope and Rosedale in the last two weeks befor  the river was closed or he would have witnessed the crap that was going on, you can't just say that the recreational fishermen have cleaned up their act when in fact they were getting worse and worse as the summer progressed.
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dennisK

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Re: The real reason the Fraser is shut down.
« Reply #13 on: August 27, 2007, 08:58:10 AM »

or he would have witnessed the crap that was going on, you can't just say that the recreational fishermen have cleaned up their act when in fact they were getting worse and worse as the summer progressed.

So you witnessed recreational fisherman killing sockeye?
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Nicole

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Re: The real reason the Fraser is shut down.
« Reply #14 on: August 27, 2007, 09:04:09 AM »


Being a law school dropout (did 1 year at McGill) I'm curious what the legal standard for "intent" would be if a bottom bouncer was fishing on the fraser in the closed areas.  I would think simply saying that you were targeting non-salmon species, the burden of proof would reside on the DFO to prove their case. And unless you had a salmon in your possession, the court would throw the fine out. I don't think the DFO officer could say "everybody who bottom bounces MUST be fishing for salmon" and the court would blindly accept that as enough.

Interesting stuff anyways...

True, can you imagine the look on the officer's face when the guy blurts out that he's fishing for cutts...

LOL
Nicole
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