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Author Topic: Braided/No Stretch Lines etc.  (Read 21728 times)

otto

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Re:Braided/No Stretch Lines etc.
« Reply #15 on: June 23, 2004, 11:17:29 PM »

continued.....

These ‘Super lines’ can, of course, be used in the capacity of a shock leader in conjunction with mono if required. I would suggest the use of a ‘Grinner to Grinner knot’ for this situation if tying on a leader of similar size. If you are tying a very large diameter monofilament leader too much thinner Super line, I recommend the Albright knot.
A few ‘tips’ on using new age ‘Super lines’ –
Spooling Up – Leave at least enough monofilament to cover the bottom of the spool. When you put monofilament onto your spool, it stretches  significantly even with a very small amount of tension. This stretch makes the line squeeze the barrel of the spool, gripping it tight. The ‘Super lines’ don’t stretch, so you don’t get this gripping action on the barrel of the spool. Attach the mono to the ‘Super line’ using a ‘Grinner to Grinner knot’ as mentioned previously.
Getting a run – Exaggerated striking, even at big distances, such as you might require using monofilament is not
necessary. Remember that every inch you move the tip of your rod is an inch of movement at the terminal
arrangement (hook).
Following are some tips to reduce the incidence of whip knots while fishing with a spinning reel:
1. Do not overfill the reel - leave at least 1/8" of rim at the top.
2. Close the bail arm manually.
3. Before you begin your retrieve, pull on the line after you've closed the bail to make sure all the wraps are tight.
Pulling on the line only takes a second while you're waiting for the bait to fall. This will reduce 90% of the problems!
Coloring ‘Super lines’ – The color is simply there to encapsulate the fiber, and in time will wear off. This is
normal, and the strength and performance of the line will not be affected, If you want to re-colour the line, simply take a permanent marker and color the last few meters whatever color best suits the situation you are fishing in.
‘Super lines’ as a hook length?
So what about using these new ‘Super lines’ as a hook length material?
Well, the answer has to be a yes! However, before we come to this conclusion, there is always the alleged problem / potential that braids can cause mouth damage. Some suggesting braids refusal to stretch under pressure plus, the very thin diameter of the braid acting almost like a ‘cheese wire’. Personally I’m not convinced, I have caught dozens of carp over the years utilizing braided hook lengths and braid as a mainline, very big fish included, and have seen no resulting damage.
I would like here to quote Tony Davies Patrick, who responded with the following, when posed with the question recently.
"I have used the 50 lb test braid (Spiderwire Spectra 2000) for hook lengths on thousands of fish and have never had problems with mouth damage. I use it and trust it. Only problem is that I can only get it in USA, and the bulk spools I need, it means a big lump out of my wallet!
But this is counteracted by the fact that the line lasts, and lasts and lasts…"
Need I say more?? Well yes, the fact is that a 20 lb breaking strain super line is the equivalent of a 6 lb mono, a 50 lb ‘Super line’ equivalent to 12 lb mono, with diameters in mm being 0.15 and 0.36 respectively.
The ‘Super line’ is therefore significantly thinner in diameter than other conventional braids on the market at
present.
For knotting your hook to a length of ‘Super line’ the ‘Palomar knot’ or 5 turn ‘Grinner knot’ is recommended.
Power Pro, which is manufactured by Innovative Textiles, Inc. appears at present to be by far the best new age
‘Super line’ on the market, most of the bad qualities which have been described above have been eliminated from Power Pro line.
Be warned though, as Spectra became more and more popular, a lot the other companies started selling their own version of it. Unfortunately, to save on costs, some of these companies blended Dacron with Spectra. This resulted in the line breaking well below its Test Rating. The breakage was due to the fact that the Dacron fibers stretched, whereas the Spectra fibers did not stretch, thus causing the Spectra fibers to break due to the fact that they were taking the majority of the strain.
To summarize, the new age ‘Spectra Fiber super braided fishing lines’ are awesome and definitely the line to use if sensitivity, high strength, good abrasion resistance and mega distances (if required) is what you are after.

 :o :o :o

ow....my fingers are sprained..... :'( :'(
« Last Edit: June 23, 2004, 11:21:00 PM by otto »
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JigHead

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Re:Braided/No Stretch Lines etc.
« Reply #16 on: June 23, 2004, 11:37:24 PM »

nice copy and paste job otto ;) lol jk.. well maybe not ;D;D haha hehe

well i didnt read any of that... but i think hes recomanding that you first spool your reel with a layer of good quality mono... then braid line... that way. theres the mono to reduce ware on the spool. works for me :)
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Trout Slayer

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Re:Braided/No Stretch Lines etc.
« Reply #17 on: June 23, 2004, 11:43:38 PM »

Thanks for the great info, anyone try Power Pro?
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JigHead

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Re:Braided/No Stretch Lines etc.
« Reply #18 on: June 23, 2004, 11:51:00 PM »

memememe!!!... they have this very nice coating on the line which makes it run through the guides alot smoother.   get a nicer feel as your retreiving your line too.
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Last Cast

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Re:Braided/No Stretch Lines etc.
« Reply #19 on: June 23, 2004, 11:55:18 PM »

Great posts here.  Up until this year, I've used 30# Fireline for the Fraser (BB).  But this year decided to switch to 50# Tuff-Line XP.  Used it on two outings so far.  Just love it.  Far superior, ie. castability, knot strength, minimal line residue on initial use, etc., to Fireline IMHO.  Now thinking about switching my Vedder/Chehalis/Squamish gear over to Tuff XP as well.  I wonder if the early Vedder Coho will spook easily with this stuff?  A change of topic ... anybody see that great Cedar Planked Salmon recipe in today's Vancouver Sun ... yum  :Pyum :P!

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otto

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Re:Braided/No Stretch Lines etc.
« Reply #20 on: June 23, 2004, 11:59:07 PM »

yea i've currently got my baitcaster spooled up with 50# Tuff-Line Xp....i LOVE it!!!!!!  8)

(and yea that was a cut 'n' paste  ;D ;D)  whole wealth of info in that "paragraph"  :D)
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JigHead

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Re:Braided/No Stretch Lines etc.
« Reply #21 on: June 24, 2004, 12:01:25 AM »

i knew it! ;D :P hehehehe... woops... i thought last cast was long cast.. ahh  ???
« Last Edit: June 24, 2004, 12:15:05 AM by JigHead »
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Muddler

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Re:Braided/No Stretch Lines etc.
« Reply #22 on: June 24, 2004, 03:47:34 PM »

The power pro is nice stuff, so is the XP. However, the XP is fl. yellow and it seems to turn a lot of people off. I have been using the same TUF Plus for sturgeon for 2 years now and its great.
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Sandy

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Re:Braided/No Stretch Lines etc.
« Reply #23 on: June 24, 2004, 05:51:37 PM »

Hey Otto that line info should be worth a masters degree :)
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otto

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Re:Braided/No Stretch Lines etc.
« Reply #24 on: June 24, 2004, 07:10:08 PM »

nah...the prof would probably run it through "turnitin.com" and i would get booted out of university.... ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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Spudcote

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Re:Braided/No Stretch Lines etc.
« Reply #25 on: June 24, 2004, 07:32:53 PM »

Here's my take on the use of braid and "superlines",

I only use braid for Halibut fshing up north, I use 50 lb test TUFF line XP, the yellow stuff. Had no problems with it. When I go out with other people who use mono they have to keep positioning the biat to cope with line resistance in 300 ft of water, the braid stays straight up and down and feels everything, often too much, often you think you have a fish "bumping" your gear when it's just the bottom combined with the motion of the boat.

Braid can be very expensive, BUT consider this, you don't have to replace braid for years at a time, but mono SHOULD be replaced every couple of months for maximum performance. If you were to add up spoolng reels once with braid, versus spooling reels with mono a couple times a year, the costs should just about break even (no pun intended...).

Another issue that I have heard about (I have not personally encountered it, but it makes sense nonetheless) that braid lines will turn baitcaster reel drags to crap, these reels are not neccessarily designed for braided lines, or "superlines" so instead of the line absorbing any additional shock, it goes straight to the reel, forcing the drag gears to work overtime and essentially hurting the reels inner workings.

I appear to be the only one who has had line guide damage, the line has cut slightly into the tip top guide and created a small groove, but it doesn't effect the overall performance of the rod, nor the reel. I personally would rarely use braid for constant casting because it tends to burn my thumb (go ahead and call me a wuss...hehe).

Not to go out and call anyone "wrong", but I've actaully noticed the yellow in my line to fade a bit with constant use in direct sunlight. It may not have any structural effects on the line itself, but it fades regardless.

Also, one final note, are none of you guys concerned about thew warrenties on your rods ? I honestly have never seen a slmon rod rated for 50 lb test line, nor any reels rated for it.
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Spudcote

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Re:Braided/No Stretch Lines etc.
« Reply #26 on: June 24, 2004, 07:54:41 PM »

go with the tuff line XP the spider line and fire line are cupcakes in comparrison. Power pro is good too though
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FishKid

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Re:Braided/No Stretch Lines etc.
« Reply #27 on: June 24, 2004, 07:57:24 PM »

All very good points, spudcote.
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pinkwool

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Re:Braided/No Stretch Lines etc.
« Reply #28 on: June 25, 2004, 01:29:49 AM »

I have tried four different types of braid lines:
- Berkley whiplash 50 and 60 LB - too soft and flattens
- heard all bad things about PowerPro so did not even tried it
- Berkley fireline 30 LB - frays too quick, too thick, hard to untangle
- new stealth line 60 and 80 LB - good, but expencive, not available in Canada
- Tuff Line XP (yellow)  50 and 65 LB - my current choice. No fraying like fireline, not too soft, very thing (200' of 65LB fits onto 6500 spool if tightly layered). I have 50LB on my reel other since the middle of last season and it looks like new. They  now have 50LB and 65 LB in 200' spools and the price is comparable to Maxima - around $20. It is available now in most stores.

The main advantages of braid over the mono:
- line does not loose strength when pulling out snags (I have 80-90% recovery with 4oz, and 99% with 2oz)
- will quicker feel when fish is taking the hook :)
- can fit more line

Here is my BB setup perfected over 5 years of fishing.
1. Attach 4' - 5' of heavy braid (80-100LB) to your main line with blood knot and leave 1mm of each line after very tight pull. Carefully melt the ends with the lighter and quickly round with your fingers. This will create a good bind. A drop of crazy glue will secure the know as well. Tie the heavy braid to one end of the #3 3-way equal split swivel with palomar knot.

2. Attach a 6" steel looped leader to the other end of the swivel (you can buy them in 100 pack) and then tie mono leader to the steel loop.

3. Attach your betty to the third end of the swivel.

The purpose of the heavy braid is to protect your main line when your weight goes behind the rock and it pools like crazy. This way you have more chances to retrieve you setup. It's also more resistant to betty hits. The steel leader on the other end will protect your leader from the betty as well.

If more people use this setup, the less setups will be lost and the less fiish as well. Which will create a more enjoyable fishing experience for all of us. :)

One more advice to beginners. Do not pull the snag with your reel or rod (you will brake them easily). Have a friend to help you and wrap the line around the stick and loose the line from the reel while pulling it by the stick. For this purpose I carry a piece of plastic pipe with few layers of duct tape in my vest.  :)
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Trout Slayer

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Re:Braided/No Stretch Lines etc.
« Reply #29 on: July 29, 2004, 07:36:59 PM »

Just got 250 yards of Power Pro spooled on my reel, smooth, very smooth 8) Looking forward to use it Saturday. Thanks for all the advice.
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