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Author Topic: Anti-flossers  (Read 11107 times)

alan

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Anti-flossers
« on: August 08, 2010, 11:31:13 PM »

Here's a question:  Now that sockeye is open what are all the anti bottom bouncers gonna do to target them?  I'm not being smug or anything just want to know how else I can hook em
« Last Edit: August 08, 2010, 11:33:47 PM by alan »
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jon5hill

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Re: Anti-flossers
« Reply #1 on: August 09, 2010, 01:07:38 AM »

The stretch of river that is open on the Harrison river near Kilda is very slow moving water and there are plenty of fish running through there (the Harrison was extremely productive last year for Sockeye). This means that those who intentionally foul-hook sockeye will not be able to use bottom bouncing gear to do so, and will go join the other clowns on the bars. For those of us who like to actually trick fish, it is time to bust out your 8 weight fly rods! WOOHOO!
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alan

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Re: Anti-flossers
« Reply #2 on: August 09, 2010, 09:38:46 AM »

Why is it that those who consider bottom bouncing or flossing unethical, think its okay to do so when sockeye is open?  Isn't there another method?
« Last Edit: August 09, 2010, 11:49:14 AM by alan »
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Fish Slayer

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Re: Anti-flossers
« Reply #3 on: August 09, 2010, 09:52:08 AM »

ChomeKings: Does bottom bouncing have to be illegal for it to be wrong? Also you're saying you've never done it for springs?
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alwaysfishn

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Re: Anti-flossers
« Reply #4 on: August 09, 2010, 12:05:44 PM »

Illegal for it to stop..yes! Is it wrong....well that's for you to interpret, everyone has their own views on it.

Have I done it for Springs? Yup...3 times in 8-9 years with one those being last year and I barely fished due to the lack of space and constant bickering of the guys next to me. I went because of friends but I did not hook anything and I can tell you I can easily do without. If you enjoy casting all day in hopes of hooking a chinook by all means knock yourself out but that's not for me.

The only real time I bust out the the BB gear is for Socks because the regs have yet to state that I can not use that technique but that's it for me. My success rate for hooking chinooks while doing it is not very good plus I'm one of those people that get my 2 allowable Socks then goes home. I'm not gonna sit here and say that it's wrong because *technically* it isn't but I won't moan and groan if the regs change to outlaw it.

I don't think it's necessary for you to have to defend yourself for doing something that is legal.....  Unfortunately any answer you give will still make you guilty in some folks minds.  ::)
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Disclosure:  This post has not been approved by the feedlot boys, therefore will likely be found to contain errors and statements that are out of context. :-[

jon5hill

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Re: Anti-flossers
« Reply #5 on: August 09, 2010, 12:19:06 PM »

Quote 300 "Choose your next words carefully..."

JON-5-HILL...I strongly suggest you carefully word your post because although I myself am none to happy about BBing and only do it for Socks because it's not yet etched in stone that it is illegal.

If it has something to do with ethics of fishing then I can argue the same with what some people(not gonna mention names) on this site did this early spring on the Cap. I witnessed the same few guys using jigs on dark spawning steelhead, hooking them off their redds. Although many share the same view that it's not right to do that, it's not illegal so who am I to call those people out.

Choose my next words carefully...? Is that a threat?

Earlier this Spring I landed a Steelhead after a fairly long run in the Capilano and when it was docile I placed it on the shore to get a photo with my camera and off it went. Clearly placing a live fish on coarse wet substrate was a problem for some people on this forum as just about everyone and their dog lambasted me for several days. Mistake made, lesson learned, mistake never to be repeated again.

In comparing the above with intentionally foul hooking fish, by some warped rationale, you consider them morally equal enough to point out the error in my ways. This is both ridiculous and cheap. You are equating a one time incident which has no legal component to it with a repeated and conscious exploitation of the subjective nature of the regulations. And from the regulations I quote,

"It is illegal to catch or attempt to catch salmon by snagging or with snares."

and,

"It is illegal to wilfully hook a salmon on any part of its body other than in the mouth. You may not retain any accidentally foul-hooked salmon."

You are illegally fishing. The subjective nature of the rules, on the other hand, indicates that using a piece of wool, corkie.. etc is all the evidence you need to suggest you are angling lawfully. Also, the use of the word "wilfully" in the regulations points towards intention. Since intent is not something discernible by anyone other than the person doing said activity, you can verbally state that your intent is to trick them and you are no longer fishing illegally.

You and I and everyone on this forum know that the entire bouncing betty fishery exploits the subjectivity in the regulations outlined above and that every single rod bouncing huge hooks is fishing illegally.
 
Lastly, you say you witnessed "the same few guys using jigs on dark spawning steelhead, hooking them off their redds".  This is another shameless attempt to deflect attention from your dishonesty.

A friend of mine spent about an hour short floating above a spawning pair that were not even remotely interested in any of his offerings.. and that's all that happened. None were hooked off any redds. I carefully explained to him that he should leave fish alone if they are digging redds because it's not particularly productive anyway. The fish have one thing on their mind, sex. That error was part of his learning curve, and I'm sure he won't do it again. In any event, I remember who was there that particular day and know who you are. You have illustrated to me what type of person you are by your post, and it is consistent with your infatuation on said day with another angler and his ethics. Like I have said to you personally, I am interested in fishing for fishing's sake, I enjoy meeting other anglers and making friends as well. Nitpicking about someones handling of a fish is peanuts in comparison with a repeated conscious manipulation of the regulations to intentionally and illegally foul-hook fish.
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Fish Slayer

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Re: Anti-flossers
« Reply #6 on: August 09, 2010, 01:22:31 PM »

Illegal for it to stop..yes! Is it wrong.

If it is wrong why do you bottom bounce for sockeye?
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Fish Slayer

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Re: Anti-flossers
« Reply #7 on: August 09, 2010, 01:32:11 PM »

.
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ynot

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Re: Anti-flossers
« Reply #8 on: August 09, 2010, 01:49:15 PM »

Its my opinion that quite a few chums are flossed by the fly fishermen in the squamish river,sinking line with 20ft leader.correct me if this is wrong opinion and why.
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bbronswyk2000

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Re: Anti-flossers
« Reply #9 on: August 09, 2010, 02:30:47 PM »

Its my opinion that quite a few chums are flossed by the fly fishermen in the squamish river,sinking line with 20ft leader.correct me if this is wrong opinion and why.

20 foot leader? I like fishing the Squamish for those chrome bars but never use a 20 foot leader. Never usually longer than 6 feet and in most cases its around 4-6ft long.
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buncranabop

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Re: Anti-flossers
« Reply #10 on: August 09, 2010, 02:51:01 PM »

20 foot leader? I like fishing the Squamish for those chrome bars but never use a 20 foot leader. Never usually longer than 6 feet and in most cases its around 4-6ft long.
Yea 4-6ft sounds good on a sunken line, thats what I would fish too, with a polyleader usually. 20ft???? dunno about that, would be a mess to cast properly me thinks.
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ynot

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Re: Anti-flossers
« Reply #11 on: August 09, 2010, 03:46:09 PM »

ok would a 6ft leader floss fish. mind you the main line might go through its mouth first then the leader, is that possible. is the fly always in the mouth or can it be on the outside left on the squamish, just asking as i dont fly fish.
i was looking at the regs from the columbia river and they have openings for springs were it says snagging allowed. (
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Fish or cut bait.

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Re: Anti-flossers
« Reply #12 on: August 09, 2010, 03:51:51 PM »

A 20 foot leader? that's a hard cast with distance on a windless lake let alone a river for a lot people.
You can floss/snag with a stick, some mono, and a hook if you really want to.
Spinners can floss, pinners can floss, baitcasters can floss, anyone can floss...
BUT the method should not define the technique but rather the fisher.
A fly fisher has an instantly longer leader (taking line into consideration) than anyone using a wieight.
But the purpose/intent will vary with the fisher.
It's not so much technique as it is attitude.
Are you meat fishing or are you sportfishing?
Sockeye=meat for most....
( I don't bother, too much of zoo)
They paid for the license they want some return.
Perhaps a seperate sockeye tag/stamp?
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BBarley

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Re: Anti-flossers
« Reply #13 on: August 09, 2010, 04:36:40 PM »

3 foot- 15 pound leader on a 10 - 20 foot piece of T-14. (Depends on current and depth)

High-stick only with only the T-14 on the/in the water.

Find some fast flowing water and give'r

Looks better and more ethical than casting a 15 foot chunk of mono and a bouncing betty out there.
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Fish or cut bait.

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Re: Anti-flossers
« Reply #14 on: August 09, 2010, 05:34:02 PM »

Net or maybe a net? or a wier or a net casted out.....

Again!  
Purpose!!
Intent!

I can afford to buy fish.
I don't catch for food.
I sport fish.
« Last Edit: August 09, 2010, 05:36:07 PM by Fish or cut bait. »
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