Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[bbronswyk2000]

I agree with Todd that splitshot can hinder the detection of gentle takes on the descent and I can live with that. I use both splitshot and swivels and tungsten beads which is a byproduct of my impatience. All the weight has been the difference under tough conditions. Occasionally I like to quarter across my cast and the weight helps keep the fly down. I apply regular "rip-strips" to my retrieve and am confident that the fly will return to the zone directly.

Bryan, you have a knot where the tippet joins the leader and where the tippet joins the fly so one extra knot will not cause SNAFU.

Rick, gentle takes are as about synonymous as smashes that plunge the indicator 3 feet under so give and take.

Wrongo Bongo my good friend I dont use tippet I just use a leader so for me its two less knots. If you read all my posts about fishing I keep things simple, the simpler the better. So I am usually using 2 knots ( 1 to my fly line and one to my fly ) and if I were to use a swivel it would be 4 knots ( 1 to my fly line, one to my swivel and another from the swivel to the fly and than the final knot at the fly )

I used to do what you said using a leader and tippet but than got lazy and saw no difference in the amount of fish I caught. So I never went back. My leaders all depend on conditions and which waters I fish. BTW I have lucky horseshoes embedded in me which allows me to catch lots of fish so it rarely ever has anything to do with skill LOL

[wizard]

You don't like knots,,,that's valid.  All your points are valid.  It really comes down to personal opinion.  In this case, iMo there isn't a right or wrong way of doing it!  I like the swivel cause like I said earlier...You don't have to use 20 feet of expensive fluorocarbon.  Use 17 feet of mono, and 3 feet of fluorocarbon...also it's easy if I want to add 4 of extra leader.  Instead of blood knots or whatnot, simply extend it from the swivel.  I find this rigging easier to make adjustments on.  I've never had problems with my knots snapping at the swivel.   If anything, at the fly.   but keep doing what you do.  All input is valid. btw, I'm more worried that my fly is sitiing straigt, not so much about getting a possible on the way down.

[wizard]

Sorry. *I'm not so worried about detecting possible bites on the way down.

[skaha]

--although relatively expensive the reason to use fluoro all the way is many believe it will sink faster, hang straighter than regular leader... not just used for invisible properties.

[marmot]

Wizard if you're running 17 feet of mono to a swivel and then running 3 feet of flouro, your flouro is doing you no good.  You may as well be running mono the whole way.

As for the "adding line to the swivel" benefit...Typically you shouldn't be adding line when you are chironomid fishing.  The best way to find the feeding depth is to start a foot off the bottom and shorten in 6 inch increments if you're not getting hookups.  You're going to run out of flouro fast that way.

Flouro all the way from flyline to chronie works for me.  Nice and simple, easy to adjust length, fewer knots.

[johnk]

Wizard if you're running 17 feet of mono to a swivel and then running 3 feet of flouro, your flouro is doing you no good.  You may as well be running mono the whole way.

As for the "adding line to the swivel" benefit...Typically you shouldn't be adding line when you are chironomid fishing.  The best way to find the feeding depth is to start a foot off the bottom and shorten in 6 inch increments if you're not getting hookups.  You're going to run out of flouro fast that way.

Flouro all the way from flyline to chronie works for me.  Nice and simple, easy to adjust length, fewer knots.

I disagree. The attraction of fluoro is it's inability to refract light and not how quickly it sinks. My set up usually incorporates straight 8 lb. mono to the swivel and 7lb. fluoro below the swivel to the fly. If I'm fishing 17' and want to quickly switch to, say, 8' then if I'm running straight fluoro the section between the indicator and flyline is going to sink and affect my hookups.

[wizard]

Marmot, I add line when I am using dry line setup (leech/nymph/dryfly) with 10 foot leader for example, then want to chironomid fish in 18 foot of water.  Also in evenings when fishing near the surface, It's easier to use shorter leader.  I then add swivel...and more line,,then I can chirony fish in 18'.
I used 3 feet between swivel and chirony as an example.  I would be fine with 6 or 7 feet as well.
As for fluoro sinking faster, I agree it does.  After lightly stretching better quality mono leader, it straitens and sinks pretty good. 
I have and still do use strait leader setups, but often I find the swivel is a good device to make adjustments.   but like bbronswyck said, it depends on the conditions and scenarios.  everyone has reasons for doing what they do.  btw, good insight, it's good to hear others perspectives.

[marmot]

For sure guys, good points.  I fish mono when I don't have flouro and to be honest have never noticed that much of a difference besides the sink rate.  I use flouro mostly now because my fly gets to depth much faster and I don't have to wonder where in the column i'm actually fishing.  

I hear you on the big switch leaving too much between your indicator and your line.  After about 4 feet of difference I usually shorten my line to make casting easier anyways, but I can see your point if you're not wanting to trim your line.  One benefit of your chosen method is that it allows you to go drastically deeper more quickly than retying.  

Keep in mind that not everyone likes using flouro and there are a number of excellent chironomid fishermen out there that strictly use mono....also, it wasn't that long ago that flourocarbon would elicit a "flouro-what??" response... guys have been catching fish using chironies under little yarn or foam indicators for ages.

[johnk]

For sure guys, good points.  I fish mono when I don't have flouro and to be honest have never noticed that much of a difference besides the sink rate.  I use flouro mostly now because my fly gets to depth much faster and I don't have to wonder where in the column i'm actually fishing.  

I hear you on the big switch leaving too much between your indicator and your line.  After about 4 feet of difference I usually shorten my line to make casting easier anyways, but I can see your point if you're not wanting to trim your line.  One benefit of your chosen method is that it allows you to go drastically deeper more quickly than retying.  

Keep in mind that not everyone likes using flouro and there are a number of excellent chironomid fishermen out there that strictly use mono....also, it wasn't that long ago that flourocarbon would elicit a "flouro-what??" response... guys have been catching fish using chironies under little yarn or foam indicators for ages.

Well done. I'm appreciative of the fact that you understood I wasn't knocking your setup but, rather, describing my preferred setup which will vary depending on who you talk to. Cheers.

[skaha]

--fluorocarbon is very toxic to make and is mostly made in Japan by a few manufacturers for most companies.
--some environmentalist are concerned with both the toxic processing and the length of time it takes for the material to naturally break down after being discarded or unintentionally lost.
--not trying to preach here as I use it myself but something to conscider.

[marmot]

--fluorocarbon is very toxic to make and is mostly made in Japan by a few manufacturers for most companies.
--some environmentalist are concerned with both the toxic processing and the length of time it takes for the material to naturally break down after being discarded or unintentionally lost.
--not trying to preach here as I use it myself but something to conscider.

I had no idea skaha...thanks for bringing this up.

[marmot]

Well done. I'm appreciative of the fact that you understood I wasn't knocking your setup but, rather, describing my preferred setup which will vary depending on who you talk to. Cheers.

Yeah, of course!  The more input we all have the more options we have when we're out on the water.  I've been caught out there with less than 5 feet of flouro and a spool of mono left, knowing other guys are successful using a swivel setup gives another option if the need comes up.  Cheers right back

[Matt]

As I stated earlier, I use a split shot or a swivel.  Depending on the brand of fluoro, not all brands tie well to mono directly (no idea why).  In that case I use a small swivel.  Other times I might use shot.

I feel that by having my fly down where I know fish to be taking for the extra minute or whatever it takes for your fly to slowly sink is a minute where I am likely to be catching as opposed to chancing an encounter with a fish in the mid-depths.  Having the fly in the zone longer probably more than makes up for the number of takes I may or may not be missing.

I haven't found fish tend to take chironomids particularly softly, maybe some of you guys have coils in your leaders, are casting too far to properly watch the indicator or are using an indicator that's not visible enough  Once in a while there's a soft take, but usually its pretty obvious something is happening.

[grease line]

Definitely use some shot or a swivel, swivels are the best, they don't come off.

Sure, you may be missing extremely gentle takes as your fly is falling, but those will rarely be the big fish. You will get many more bites by getting your fly in the zone earlier and keeping it there than you may miss as it falls.

[skaha]

--some fly purists do not believe use of shot or weight external to the fly is really flyfishing but I never really thought much of chironomid or indicator fishing other than it is a very effective way to catch fish.
--I assume the swivel guys are using micro type swivels commonly used by center pin guys.
--Increased swivel size on long leader below swivel may increase the chance of breaking your rod tip if reeling in with some zeal and a high stick.