Obviously some people who comment on this particular discussion live in an alternate universe. Part of that alt-universe is accusing me of not citing any sources then not citing any themselves.

How great were the 70s? Just check out what an AI search says:

Real disposable income in Canada has experienced significant long-term growth since 1950, despite periods of stagnation, high inflation, and recent volatility.

Key Trends (1950–2025):

Long-Term Growth: From 1950 through the 1980s and 1990s, real disposable income generally rose alongside productivity and output per capita.

Post-2000 Rise: Contrary to some perceptions, the disposable income of the Canadian middle class has risen significantly (approximately +50%) since the early 2000s, even after accounting for inflation.

Recent Years (2020–2025): The COVID-19 pandemic caused unusual shifts, with a peak in 2020 followed by a decline in purchasing power due to high inflation. As of early 2025, real per capita disposable income was still roughly 6.0% below the 2020 peak, hovering around pre-pandemic 2019 levels.

2024-2025 Outlook: In 2024, disposable income showed a recovery of 7.5% in nominal terms, according to FocusEconomics. By the third quarter of 2025, total disposable personal income reached approximately 1.80 million CAD million.

Key Data Points:

1950s/1970s: Average salaries were low (e.g., $2,998 in 1950) but grew rapidly in real terms during these decades.
2020s: Despite high wage growth in 2024–2025, inflation-adjusted, per capita income remained constrained.

Income Inequality: The gap in wealth (which impacts net worth and disposable income) increased, with the top 20% of households holding nearly two-thirds of the net worth in early 2025
.
Factors Affecting Income:

Productivity: Over the past decade, income growth has lagged behind productivity, a structural issue for the Canadian economy.
Government Transfers: Recent growth in disposable income for lower-income households has been driven more by government transfers (EI, social assistance) than employment income.
Debt Levels: Household debt-to-income ratios remained high, at roughly 174-176% in late 2025, putting pressure on disposable income.

Interestingly enough the 70s  doesn't stand out in that summary.  I'd say your analysis that "I'll just mention one, the feminism idea that both wife and husband have to work for the man doing something they don't care about was a nail in the economic coffin. Industrialists saw that women are just as capable in the slave factory as men, so they devised a strategy how to lower the cost of labour by flooding the market with new labour." Is kind of hair wire. The problem isn't women  or feminism it's shifts in employment as many factory jobs have been replaced with automation. More jobs requires skills beyond being large & male, with a minimal education.

Another quick AI survey:

Canadian factory employment has significantly declined from its peak, shifting from a major employer in 1975 to a much smaller share of the workforce by 2025, with manufacturing jobs falling from around 17% of total employment in the mid-70s to roughly 9-10% by 2025, driven by automation, globalization, and a move towards service/knowledge economies, despite some recent job gains in Ontario.
 
1975 Snapshot (Approximate)

Significant Sector: Manufacturing was a substantial part of Canada's economy and employment base.
Higher Share: Manufacturing jobs represented a larger percentage of total jobs compared to today, likely well over 10% (e.g., 16.9% in 1985).

2025 Snapshot (Approximate)

Reduced Share: Manufacturing employment sits around 8.8% to 10% of total Canadian jobs, its lowest in decades.
Sectoral Shift: The economy has moved towards services (health, retail, tech), making manufacturing less dominant.
Job Losses: Significant losses in auto, machinery, and metal production contributed to Ontario's record low manufacturing employment.

Key Drivers of Change (1975-2025)

Automation & Technology: Increased automation reduced the need for manual labor in factories.
Globalization: Competition from other countries impacted Canadian manufacturing.
Economic Shift: Canada transitioned from an industrial base to a knowledge and service-based economy.

In Summary

While exact 1975 figures are harder to pinpoint in the snippets, the trend shows a stark contrast: manufacturing was a much larger employer in 1975, but by 2025, its relative share had shrunk dramatically as Canada's job market matured into sectors like retail, health, and technology.

Most of the 70s (1973 to 1979) were a period of high inflation with an average over that period of 9% a year. So on average something that cost $100 at the start of 1973 would cost over  $217  at the end of 1979.

I say again I said nothing about the 70s other than it was a period of "stagflation". That's not math it's verifiable fact. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stagflation


Adriaticum what was your experience of the 70s? I came of age in the 70s and I can tell you not many though highly of the decade at the time. Gary Trudeau, author of the Doonsbury comic strip called it "..a kidney stone of a decade!" as it turned into the 80s. It's like now that he is gone, Mulroney was a great Prime Minister. He was called the most hated man in Canada when he left office. The future reinvents the past. It's a recognized historical phenomena.

I have no experience in the 70s here. And that's probably a good thing.
I read the historical accounts and data and make up my mind based on that. It's is probably better not to have been there and be jaded.

This is not to say that your specific experience is not true. You may feel you are better off today, then you were in the 70s.
But I don't know you personally, so I can't say that you are able to extricate yourself from what the data says and be objective.

In every economy at any point in time there are those who do well. But we should take the top and bottom 10 percent out to be able to look at the data.

70s were the peak for the majority in terms of standard of living and disposable income. Everything from there was downhill for the majority. I stand by that.
The ideologies we have embraced since then have ruined our standard of living.
I'll just mention one, the feminism idea that both wife and husband have to work for the man doing something they don't care about was a nail in the economic coffin.
Industrialists saw that women are just as capable in the slave factory as men, so they devised a strategy how to lower the cost of labour by flooding the market with new labour.
We are reaping the "results" of these failed policies.
But we are not getting the benefits of better standard of living because the labour has been outsourced and there is nobody at home to raise our children to be raised properly.
We have outsourced that too.
I could write for days.
The fact that you can buy a new phone and tv every year for cheap is not standard of living. It's a distraction which we will pay for later.

Okay, Cariboo fishing, eh? Rainbow trout sounds divine. Solid rainbows, now we're talking! One fish enough, I wonder? Well, this video definitely brings back memories! Once, trying to untangle a fishing line felt as frustrating as trying to navigate Slither io with lag. Spent ages on it, eventually just snipped the line. Sigh.

This is terrible looking at previous derbies. Tomorrow will be the 20th and still not a single steelhead recorded since the late derby...

Deadline for any input/feedback is January 23 2026 according to the BCWF website.
https://bcwf.bc.ca/salmon/

there are definitely no roads along Pitt Lake. While there are roads in the valley above the lake, vehicles and equipment are barged up the lake. Stave has roads along both sides. The roads on the west side terminate at the Alouette hydro tunnel exit and are gated just north of Florence Lake. While there are roads in the upper Stave Valley you'd have to find other sources of info to determine if they are accessible but it appears not to be.

https://www.bc4x4.com/threads/stave-river-fsr.22528/

https://www.facebook.com/groups/4wdabc/posts/10160401684161009/

https://backroadstatus.com/road/ften-1421431?view=49.451187/-122.220918/9

if you have google earth (it's free) you can take a look at roads in the area, many of which are washed out or decommissioned.

Anyone know if it is possible to drive up to the top of Stave or Pitt lakes? I know Harrison has a road but not the other two?

Buddy just got a nice overlander so we want to do some fishing trips

Thanks in advance

5 fish... is this good compared to previous years or not?

The Derby sort of just squeaked into a window of decent weather and water flows! Evacuation alerts issued for some homes along the river this morning. Graph for the crossing is straight up.

Sounds like a challenge. Seriously, though, halibut deserves better, or maybe potato chips deserve a more worthy companion. I once tried to pair a delicate Riesling with spicy tacos. It was a complete disaster. I should become Slice Master to better understand culinary art. The flavors clashed so terribly.