Fishing with Rod Discussion Forum

Fishing in British Columbia => General Discussion => Topic started by: Darko on November 16, 2022, 07:19:55 PM

Title: 30lb Braid vs 50 lb Braid for Float Fishing
Post by: Darko on November 16, 2022, 07:19:55 PM
Hello everyone, I have heard many different things from different people about whether to use 30lb braid or 50 lb (mainline obv) while float fishing for salmon or steelhead. Some say 50 lb is overkill, some say it is easier to mend. What is your experience. Also have any of you noticed a difference of green braid vs high vis like yellow? Does the yellow spook the fish more? Has a shock mono leader been a game changer for you? Is it worth the extra visibility vs the spook factor? Keep in mind I float fish with a spinning reel.  I found this thread has lots of good info but necessarily much info on the difference between 20lb & 50 lb. I guess my question is more concerned with getting the best drift possible.
http://www.fishingwithrod.com/yabbse/index.php?topic=38078.msg358507#msg358507 (http://www.fishingwithrod.com/yabbse/index.php?topic=38078.msg358507#msg358507)
Thanks in advance, looking forward to your opinions.
Title: Re: 30lb Braid vs 50 lb Braid for Float Fishing
Post by: coastangler on November 17, 2022, 10:02:00 AM
You'll probably won't get a lot of feedback since I doubt many float fish with spinning reels around here. I do think that spinning reels are superior when it comes to hardware so my feedback would be: use 15lb or 20lb PowerPro Spectra as it will allow you to cast much further when using hardware and it will be more stealth. I never heard about the mending point but honestly, if you want the most perfect drift, then you should considering investing in an actual float setup for next season. You can probably find decent deals in FB marketplace or even ask in this forum as I'm sure many have spare setups they want to get rid of!

Hope this helps
Title: Re: 30lb Braid vs 50 lb Braid for Float Fishing
Post by: vancook on November 17, 2022, 10:29:11 AM
I'd say 50 is extreme. If you must have braid definitely tie in a section of mono. I use braid on my spinnnig reels for tossing hardware and tie in 10 ft of mono.

Spinning rod for float fishing..like our neighbours in the south. If its in your budget I do suggest in investing in a float rod set up for a more natural drift. Also I imagine drifting with a spinning reel is a pain in the butt.
Title: Re: 30lb Braid vs 50 lb Braid for Float Fishing
Post by: armytruck on November 17, 2022, 12:02:39 PM
I'm spooled up with 20lb. braid on the 2500 spinner . Seems plenty strong enough  .and with like vancook says , run a 10 ft. mono  line . I use a 12 lb. fluorocarbon .
As mentioned , a good drift setup rod and reel if your floating .
Title: Re: 30lb Braid vs 50 lb Braid for Float Fishing
Post by: Phronesis on November 17, 2022, 12:26:56 PM
For my spinning setup, I use 20lb as well and have landed chum and chinook with no issues, I have tried both - float fishing and for tossing spoons/spinners....I didn't like it for float when I started out, so currently I only use it for tossing metals with 2-3 ft of 15lb fluorocarbon as leader

For float fishing with the spinning setup, the best drift you get is from your 10 to 2 oclock, I have had good success when the fish is right in front, but with baitcasting or centerpin I could drift it bit longer, I used dark green braid. I have seen people using high vis yellow braid and still catching them, but at that time there was overcast and raining so idk it might spook them on a sunny day maybe
Title: Re: 30lb Braid vs 50 lb Braid for Float Fishing
Post by: cabro on November 17, 2022, 02:29:08 PM
I would agree with the above, especially the points that 20lb is more than enough and will get you the most casting distance and add a 10 ft bumper of 15lb-17lb mono or floro. The main reason you want the bumper, aside from being more stealthy is that it's really hard to pin your float on thin braid as rubber float stop slide too easily on it due to being super thin and slippery. You often have to add 2-3 stops on the top of the float to get it to stay put properly, much easier to do on thicker mono.

Thinner braid is also more likely to bind up on your spool vs heavier braid.

In regards to mending, braid floats so isn't as big of a deal to mend it vs mono but that being said, IMO it's slightly easier to mend heavier braid vs 20lb but not by much.

For me personally I run the following:

Baitcaster Float Rod

- 65lb Braid to 17lb 10ft floro bumper to 18" 12lb or 15lb floro leader (depending if white Chinook or Chum are in the system)

65lb is total overkill but I find I get less tip wrap with it so that's why I go so heavy.

Spinning Rod

- 20lb Braid to 15lb 10ft Floro bumper to 18" 12lb floro leader

So definitely some pros and cons either way, much of it comes down to personal preference vs right and wrong.
Title: Re: 30lb Braid vs 50 lb Braid for Float Fishing
Post by: Fish Assassin on November 17, 2022, 02:36:26 PM
30 lb. braid yellow
Title: Re: 30lb Braid vs 50 lb Braid for Float Fishing
Post by: Darko on November 17, 2022, 02:40:30 PM

65lb is total overkill but I find I get less tip wrap with it so that's why I go so heavy.

This is one thing thats been frustrating for me using 30 lb braid. That dam thing always seems to get wrapped, I was wondering how to reduce it.[/list]
Title: Re: 30lb Braid vs 50 lb Braid for Float Fishing
Post by: cabro on November 17, 2022, 03:05:18 PM
    thanks for all the responses! This is one thing thats been frustrating for me using 30 lb braid. That dam thing always seems to get wrapped, I was wondering how to reduce it.

Bumping up to heavier braid definitely helps reduce tip wrap (which normally happens to me when I miss setting the hook) but only to a certain point. Only way I completely get rid of all tip wrap is moving back to mono main line and with mono, I just run 20lb.
Title: Re: 30lb Braid vs 50 lb Braid for Float Fishing
Post by: Wiseguy on November 17, 2022, 09:07:36 PM
A spin cast reel for float fishing? Let’s get reel (pardon the pun)! Invest in a level wind or a Center pin reel. Spool up either with some 15 pd maxima ultra green mono. I only use braid on my spin cast rod for chucking spoons. Casts way farther then mono.
Title: Re: 30lb Braid vs 50 lb Braid for Float Fishing
Post by: Darko on November 17, 2022, 10:22:00 PM
A spin cast reel for float fishing? Let’s get reel (pardon the pun)! Invest in a level wind or a Center pin reel. Spool up either with some 15 pd maxima ultra green mono. I only use braid on my spin cast rod for chucking spoons. Casts way farther then mono.
  I will get a centrepin but I know that setup will cost me at least 250$ for a budget rod and reel so just working with I got. I want to master what I have and as I get more experience upgrade and move and try new things like centrepins and fly fishing. I just dont feel like I dont have the time currently to get as good with using those as I wish I could.
Title: Re: 30lb Braid vs 50 lb Braid for Float Fishing
Post by: Darko on November 17, 2022, 10:24:46 PM
Bumping up to heavier braid definitely helps reduce tip wrap (which normally happens to me when I miss setting the hook) but only to a certain point. Only way I completely get rid of all tip wrap is moving back to mono main line and with mono, I just run 20lb.
I think part of the reason is because I'm currently using 4 strand braid, Im ordering 8 strand blue braid. I read that blue braid is best of braid in clear water which seems like it will be more and more common in the future.
Title: Re: 30lb Braid vs 50 lb Braid for Float Fishing
Post by: Wiseguy on November 18, 2022, 08:25:15 AM
  I will get a centrepin but I know that setup will cost me at least 250$ for a budget rod and reel so just working with I got. I want to master what I have and as I get more experience upgrade and move and try new things like centrepins and fly fishing. I just dont feel like I dont have the time currently to get as good with using those as I wish I could.
Fair enough young man. We all got to start somewhere. I started with a Spin cast reel as well but quickly moved up to a Level wind. A few years later I purchased a Center pin reel. You will get there eventually. Tight lines.
Title: Re: 30lb Braid vs 50 lb Braid for Float Fishing
Post by: cabro on November 19, 2022, 04:45:08 PM
I think part of the reason is because I'm currently using 4 strand braid, Im ordering 8 strand blue braid. I read that blue braid is best of braid in clear water which seems like it will be more and more common in the future.

I was using Sufix 832 (8 strand) 30lb and from my experience, still lots of tip wrap. Moved to 65lb and it was better but not nearly as big of a difference as just using mono which completely gets rid of the problem for me.

One thing I haven't tried is a different brand of braid though. Might try next season and see if that makes any difference.
Title: Re: 30lb Braid vs 50 lb Braid for Float Fishing
Post by: Darko on November 19, 2022, 06:45:15 PM
I was using Sufix 832 (8 strand) 30lb and from my experience, still lots of tip wrap. Moved to 65lb and it was better but not nearly as big of a difference as just using mono which completely gets rid of the problem for me.

One thing I haven't tried is a different brand of braid though. Might try next season and see if that makes any difference.
thanks for sharing! I need 8 strand braid anyway. My current one has almost sawed into my hands a couple times XD
Title: Re: 30lb Braid vs 50 lb Braid for Float Fishing
Post by: psd1179 on November 19, 2022, 07:20:59 PM
min 40lb braid as main line. first it is easier to deal with wrap or tangle, and it is slightly better to avoid break.

But the floating rig, the float, weight etc are all in 5-7ft 25lb mono. the most annoying tangle is the weight and float or hooks twisted together and ruin everything. with the mono, this issue is not present.

It is also easy to switch float rig to lure, simply replace the floating rig as a set.
Title: Re: 30lb Braid vs 50 lb Braid for Float Fishing
Post by: jim on November 20, 2022, 08:18:25 AM
I have been trying the 45lb Camo braid from Suffix. fine product but the tip wrap when you break off is irritating!!!
I have some 20lb braid to try on the spinning reel, but have yet to do so.
A friend has been fishing this fall (newbie) using 9.5 foot rod and spinning reel ,mono line, has caught a coho and springs and lots of chums. He is now sick and tired of the loops, backlashes, and line maintenance. He is ready to try out his new entry level center pin reel and 10.5 rod. His learning curve on how to cast it is slowly happening.
 My question is when you look at a rod, new or old, how to tell if the line guides are going to handle the braided line. cheap guides get deep ruts in them in no time at all.
 Maybe I should start my own thread...
Title: Re: 30lb Braid vs 50 lb Braid for Float Fishing
Post by: DanL on November 20, 2022, 06:25:27 PM
re: mending, it is easier to mend lighter line vs heavier and that should apply whether it's mono or braid. Having more weight that must be managed/lifted out of the water can only have a greater effect on the drift. Doubly so for those who like to hold the whole line out of the water; the heavier the line for a given length, the greater the drag that must be transmitted to the float

FWIW braid doesnt actually float (ie its density is not less than water) but it can be light enough to sit in the surface film without breaking surface tension and thus floats under the right conditions. If something makes it break the surface tension (like turbulence), then it will sink.

Has a shock mono leader been a game changer for you? Is it worth the extra visibility vs the spook factor? Keep in mind I float fish with a spinning reel. 

The greatest benefit of the mono shock section (IMHO) is to have a break point weaker than the main line so if you snag up then you have somewhere that will fail and not potentially leave a huge length of braid behind. Particularly useful for spinning applications where you may not otherwise really need an actual leader.

Quote
I guess my question is more concerned with getting the best drift possible.

I guess it comes down to what factor is the most important to you in the 'best' drift, but I assume you mean trying to get drag-free as possible. From that perspective, the lightest mainline you are willing to use will perform best. Yes, there are compromises like more propensity for tangling, but that's a separate issue.

To be fair, if you're goal is the 'best drift possible', a spinning reel is not going to be the best tool for it (but you seem cognizant of that already). People can and do successfully float fish with spinning reels, but you're sacrificing a lot of finesse and ability to manage your line.  Just my $0.02

Do you use your spinning rod for actual spinning applications like spoons/spinners/etc? If so, then even more reason for going as light as possible. You'll be needlessly sacrificing a lot of distance going too heavy on mainline.
Title: Re: 30lb Braid vs 50 lb Braid for Float Fishing
Post by: Darko on November 20, 2022, 10:36:04 PM
re: mending, it is easier to mend lighter line vs heavier and that should apply whether it's mono or braid. Having more weight that must be managed/lifted out of the water can only have a greater effect on the drift. Doubly so for those who like to hold the whole line out of the water; the heavier the line for a given length, the greater the drag that must be transmitted to the float

FWIW braid doesnt actually float (ie its density is not less than water) but it can be light enough to sit in the surface film without breaking surface tension and thus floats under the right conditions. If something makes it break the surface tension (like turbulence), then it will sink.

The greatest benefit of the mono shock section (IMHO) is to have a break point weaker than the main line so if you snag up then you have somewhere that will fail and not potentially leave a huge length of braid behind. Particularly useful for spinning applications where you may not otherwise really need an actual leader.

I guess it comes down to what factor is the most important to you in the 'best' drift, but I assume you mean trying to get drag-free as possible. From that perspective, the lightest mainline you are willing to use will perform best. Yes, there are compromises like more propensity for tangling, but that's a separate issue.

To be fair, if you're goal is the 'best drift possible', a spinning reel is not going to be the best tool for it (but you seem cognizant of that already). People can and do successfully float fish with spinning reels, but you're sacrificing a lot of finesse and ability to manage your line.  Just my $0.02

Do you use your spinning rod for actual spinning applications like spoons/spinners/etc? If so, then even more reason for going as light as possible. You'll be needlessly sacrificing a lot of distance going too heavy on mainline.
yea I have 7 ft medium weight spinning rod for casting lures. I use a 10'6 Shimano Convergence for float fishing. My reel is a quantum blue runner. I just want my drift to be smooth which I have gotten good at letting the line out relatively smoothly. I just wanted to hear other's experiences with the different braids. Thing I don't like about braid is sometimes the floating line and also the tip wrap. I'm not sure mending is the same because the braid is way thinner so I think the heavier does make a difference though the mending part is the part im not the most knowledgeable about. Keeping just enough out is really hard, especially when its cold.
Title: Re: 30lb Braid vs 50 lb Braid for Float Fishing
Post by: Wade on March 03, 2023, 09:51:36 AM
Hey Darko, I started float fishing for salmon on the Vedder with spinning setup (10'6 Gloomis + Shimano Stella 4000xg). I used 20lb Powerpro yellow high vis braid, with a piece of 8-feet 20lb seaguar fluorocarbon bumper and 12lb seaguar fluorocarbon leader. The rig works well, landed a 30lb chinook in the past season. I also tried 40lb powerpro braid, no significant difference, only that it's easier for thicker line to catch wind which could be a little annoying on windy days.

I also started fishing with baitcasting setup in the past season (just wanted to try if this would be easier for my wrist and I have very bad wrists because of working on computers) with same rig...All I can tell from just one season's experience is that, if you've been enjoying float fishing with spinning setup, just stick to it, no need to change. The baitcaster won't give you better results. My landing ratio with spinning setup is 90% but only 50% for baitcaster setup although the rods are almost identical at 10'6 rated 6-12lb, and the reels have almost same retrieve speed (41inch for spinning and 42inch for baitcaster).
Title: Re: 30lb Braid vs 50 lb Braid for Float Fishing
Post by: obie1fish on March 03, 2023, 10:25:57 AM
I fully understand the co$t factor of a new setup. While using a baitcaster or centerpin setup is best, note that a lot of float fishing in Washington and Oregon is done with spinning setups- just check the YouTube posts! You might want to keep the drifts shorter, as keeping slack line off the water is a definite challenge. It makes for a better hookup ratio anyways!
As the others have said, 20-30 lb. 8 strand with 5-12 ft. of 12-17 lb.mono and 8-12 lb leader. My problem is that my friend and I have trouble with the 10-12 lb. shock line breaking at the knot when casting lures, and can't figure out why.
Title: Re: 30lb Braid vs 50 lb Braid for Float Fishing
Post by: Phronesis on March 03, 2023, 11:21:36 AM
Hey Darko, I started float fishing for salmon on the Vedder with spinning setup (10'6 Gloomis + Shimano Stella 4000xg). I used 20lb Powerpro yellow high vis braid, with a piece of 8-feet 20lb seaguar fluorocarbon bumper and 12lb seaguar fluorocarbon leader. The rig works well, landed a 30lb chinook in the past season. I also tried 40lb powerpro braid, no significant difference, only that it's easier for thicker line to catch wind which could be a little annoying on windy days.

I also started fishing with baitcasting setup in the past season (just wanted to try if this would be easier for my wrist and I have very bad wrists because of working on computers) with same rig...All I can tell from just one season's experience is that, if you've been enjoying float fishing with spinning setup, just stick to it, no need to change. The baitcaster won't give you better results. My landing ratio with spinning setup is 90% but only 50% for baitcaster setup although the rods are almost identical at 10'6 rated 6-12lb, and the reels have almost same retrieve speed (41inch for spinning and 42inch for baitcaster).

Whatever setup works for you - is the best.......I started with spinning setup too with little success but when I switched to baitcaster/ centerpin I caught a lot more than I used to but my experience is nowhere near what others here have.