Fishing with Rod Discussion Forum
Fishing in British Columbia => Fishing-related Issues & News => Topic started by: chris gadsden on October 26, 2010, 10:07:19 AM
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http://thecanadian.org/k2/item/337-campbell-future
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What?
With only the following issues in the last few years:
1) drunk driving conviction
2) HST hidden agenda
2) BC Rail/Basi/Virk plea deal
4) "Run of the River" bs
and many more
I think he will be kicked out by recall before then.
And the new government will call for an inquiry in the BC Rail issue when they are elected.
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We can only hope! You are talking about a very arrogant man who listens to no-one but himself, a true dictator and they do not leave office gracefully. He declared publicly early last summer that he would going for another round. I hope that when he finally does leave that he take Colin Hanson with him.
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There are basic rules in life, and one of them is knowing when to stay and when to leave a position. A perfect time to exit for Campbell would have been to step down after the 2010 Olympics. But the man is so power hungry he will stay right up to the bitter end. Never been much of a fan of his, but always have to shake my head when I see things like this.
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Don't let the door hit you on the way out! :D
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Will tears flow? :'(
with a little smirk ;)
*edit* you forgot
5) 54 percent pay raise = annual salary of $186,000.
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the sad part is, while i hate the man, if the NDP win, it will be just as bad :P
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the sad part is, while i hate the man, if the NDP win, it will be just as bad :P
In respect I disagree, no one can be as bad as this government has been the last few years.
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how quickly we forget!!!
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There is a line in Chris's reference that really resonates with me: 'the man who has savaged everything I hold dear in my beloved British Columbia'.
I think it fair to say in Gordo's defense that he and his crew have been competent managers in working towards their objectives. I just I don't like their objectives because I don't like seeing all our heritage sold for a few dollars. We may have to sell much of it eventually to survive in the very long term but it has been happening far too fast.
He and his crew don't believe in government and it follows that everything in the public realm should be sold. So why would we put people like that in charge of government?
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The most like scenarios:
#The Liberals will be funding Green party members to help split the vote in there favor.
#Gordon will change his name before the next election.
#Gordon will summon creatures from h3ll and use them as citizens to vote for him.
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# Liberals dump Campbell and win a squeaker, can't see NDP winning with Carole James.
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# Liberals dump Campbell and win a squeaker, can't see NDP winning with Carole James.
I agree. Campbell is on his way out, however there are not enough voters in the province that will be willing to hold their noses and vote for the NDP..... :D
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9, nearly 10 years is too long for any party to be in power, no matter who the leader is. time for some balance and some new ideas. change in this case imo is healthy for the province, and the province needs it right now.
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“If a student did this, I would say this is deceptive, maybe intentionally deceptive,”
http://www.globaltvbc.com/world/Premier+charts+deceptive+experts/3746753/story.html
No Surprise here... ::)
Cheers,
Nog
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Lieberals for a good reason.
Luckily for Gordo his best political friend is still around. Carole James guarantees a win for the non-left party.
I'll try to find a link providing James and the NDP actually still exist. Can't believe I'm saying this but sure miss the Zalm / Moe days.
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You miss Zcalm, or is fried spam is playing tricks on your tastebuds. :)
To say the other party is worse is a Campbellism.
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9, nearly 10 years is too long for any party to be in power, no matter who the leader is. time for some balance and some new ideas. change in this case imo is healthy for the province, and the province needs it right now.
yeah but who???
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He's done!
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Good to see Bill Bennett who is a fisher and hunter tell it like it is in Campbell's government the last number of years. Took some backbone to do that.
Also resinding the 15% tax cut announced a few days ago shows how the party is falling apart within.
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Good to see Bill Bennett who is a fisher and hunter tell it like it is in Campbell's government the last number of years. Took some backbone to do that.
Also resinding the 15% tax cut announced a few days ago shows how the party is falling apart within.
Amen brother!
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Best part is Gordo playing dumb saying he can't understand why Bill would say such things; must be cause Bill is bitter.
Even better is Hanson saying in these uncertain time major changes can't go in place. Pretty obvious the implied msg is no tax cut but new taxes like HST is fine and dandy. Too bad the sinking Lieberal ship is taking the rest of the Province with them.
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Please pass some of those bananas here. This isn't even funny any more. Why do I feel like I'm watching a Monty Python skit?
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-- I'm not in favour of flogging a dead horse.
--I don't understand how our elected leaders morph into dictators. There has to be something fundamentally wrong with the system which needs to be fixed. Perhaps we need more free votes on issues of concern. If the inner cabinet has made a correct decision they should be able to convince enough or their party members and members of the opposition to pass a free vote.
--I find the notion of an opposition party equally distasteful and inherently disfunctional... once elected they should be working towards concensus decisions as a whole to govern the province.
--Effective concensus decisions require their be no willful suppression of opposing information the motions should pass on their own merit rather than be rammed through based on the leaders sphere of influence.
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"You have almost a battered wife syndrome inside our caucus today, inside our cabinet."
Bill Bennett
:-X :-X :-X
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-- I'm not in favour of flogging a dead horse.
--I don't understand how our elected leaders morph into dictators. There has to be something fundamentally wrong with the system which needs to be fixed. Perhaps we need more free votes on issues of concern. If the inner cabinet has made a correct decision they should be able to convince enough or their party members and members of the opposition to pass a free vote.
--I find the notion of an opposition party equally distasteful and inherently disfunctional... once elected they should be working towards concensus decisions as a whole to govern the province.
--Effective concensus decisions require their be no willful suppression of opposing information the motions should pass on their own merit rather than be rammed through based on the leaders sphere of influence.
What we need is STV (Single Transferable Vote) http://www.fishingwithrod.com/yabbse/index.php?topic=20633.0 (http://www.fishingwithrod.com/yabbse/index.php?topic=20633.0)
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The lies never stop- from all of them- the spin on Bennet being fired was it was a cabinet choice.According to today's paper the order was signed by Gordon Campbell. Apart from the fact that cabinet can't fire anyone, the lies are fast and furious. They all need to be fired.
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I loved how some in the party said that Gordo does not have a temper and some say he does. Then Christy Clark comes on and says he has a bad temper but that was not the reason she left. Typical Liberal party, you never know who is telling the truth.
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I loved how some in the party said that Gordo does not have a temper and some say he does. Then Christy Clark comes on and says he has a bad temper but that was not the reason she left. Typical Liberal party, you never know who is telling the truth.
Who really cares whether he has a temper or not? Next we'll be discussing whether he has a hangnail on his left big toe...... ;D ;D
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Who really cares whether he has a temper or not? Next we'll be discussing whether he has a hangnail on his left big toe...... ;D ;D
I don't care about his temper, but I do care about the never ending stream of bovine pies that come quicker and easier than the truth. Didja ever get around to disproving that stuff in another thread AF??? ;)
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Who really cares whether he has a temper or not? Next we'll be discussing whether he has a hangnail on his left big toe...... ;D ;D
Well I am sure when he does he will find a way to blame someone for causeing it, then give himself a big raise so that he can hire his own person to give pedicures once a week ;D ;D
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Along that thought who cares if they drinks/drives out of country; or does VanderZalm style business dealings. Remember to apply this "Who really cares" attitude towards the NDP (reminisce of fast ferry, Skeena bailout, who really cares) ;)
Who really cares whether he has a temper or not? Next we'll be discussing whether he has a hangnail on his left big toe...... ;D ;D
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Being a self confessed political junkie- BEST WEEK EVER! Stupidity has risen to soaring new levels on all sides.The true colours are showing on all sides.
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Being a self confessed political junkie- BEST WEEK EVER! Stupidity has risen to soaring new levels on all sides.The true colours are showing on all sides.
Its almost unbelievable but it is British Columbia after all.
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I'm sure leading the country in child poverty - AGAIN - is one of the mitigating factors of Campbell's proudest achievements. One in 7 kids living below the poverty line in a province as wealthy as BC is disgusting.
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I'm sure leading the country in child poverty - AGAIN - is one of the mitigating factors of Campbell's proudest achievements. One in 7 kids living below the poverty line in a province as wealthy as BC is disgusting.
Firstly child poverty is a problem.... Any poverty is a problem.... However to throw out a comment like you have without some background raises more questions than information.
World wide average child poverty is 1 in 2 kids. Average Canadian child poverty is 1 in 8 kids. Child poverty is on the decline in both BC and Canada as a whole.
http://www.globalissues.org/article/26/poverty-facts-and-stats (http://www.globalissues.org/article/26/poverty-facts-and-stats)
http://www.conferenceboard.ca/hcp/details/society/child-poverty.aspx (http://www.conferenceboard.ca/hcp/details/society/child-poverty.aspx)
While 0 child poverty would be wonderful, most of us realize that is an impossible statistic.
Attacking Campbell by suggesting that he is so heartless and uncaring because we have a marginally higher child poverty rate than the rest of Canada is just irresponsible.
There are many many factors that contribute to child poverty (primarily parent poverty) including having concentrated populations in large urban centers and the high costs of housing in BC relative to other provinces To suggest it is a BC government policy to keep child poverty at a high level is naive.
On the other hand it could be that you are reading too much left wing political rhetoric and should balance that out by reading some actual facts and maybe a little right wing material.... :D
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Aw Crabcakes AF- That's baloney. This is how many years now that BC has led the country in childhood poverty rates? As far as the "background" goes, I volunteer with youth at risk and the cuts in funding were as obscene as some of the homes they came from.So tell me what has your hero done to help this out? Besides cutting funding? Since he insists that raising the minimum wage will hurt his pals , they get to continue on in poverty.
Does he even care or have a heart?
BTW- STILL patiently waiting for you to disprove some points I made in another post that you said were wrong, but all I hear are crickets. ;D
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Hey AF, you should change your name to alwaysGordo. What has the dude done for you to garner your kind of undying support? Talk about naive support.
I have to shamefully admit I too naively voted for him for the first two term before the excuses ran out for the lies. ;D
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Hey AF, you should change your name to alwaysGordo. What has the dude done for you to garner your kind of undying support? Talk about naive support.
I have to shamefully admit I too naively voted for him for the first two term before the excuses ran out for the lies. ;D
Perhaps you can point out where I have ever said that I support Gordon Campbell. I have said I support some of his government policies and have said that under his leadership BC has prospered economically....
If someone was assassinating your character, I would "support" you. That's not naive, it's just the decent thing to do..... ::)
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Perhaps you can point out where I have ever said that I support Gordon Campbell. I have said I support some of his government policies and have said that under his leadership BC has prospered economically....
If someone was assassinating your character, I would "support" you. That's not naive, it's just the decent thing to do..... ::)
More bologna AF- You tell me I'm wrong consistently, but when you're asked to back it up, I get nothing but crickets. Facts are facts, ideology is something else. Since you seem to feel it's OK to say I'm spreading lies or misinformation or maligning someone's character, feel free to explain that to me as I'm at a loss to understand how that works. Or is the "decent" thing to do.
I hear crickets.
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campbell on his way out?....i heard today that he mite run for the NDP leadership...holmes*
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Although I never voted for Campbell I do see running the province as a business. I feel like he made dramatic cuts that have impacted some but people who seem to be most hit by it are the unionized work force. I have no problem with this as for the most part the unionized force could afford to improve it's efficiencies. Some of the program cuts may seem harsh and I realize there is more to consider than just dollars but we can't just keep printing money and funding programs that don't generate any revenue. It's hard to argue with the financial responsiblity of his government when compared to other leaders. From what I've seen over the years all elected governments have failed to keep their pre election promises.
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Although I never voted for Campbell I do see running the province as a business. I feel like he made dramatic cuts that have impacted some but people who seem to be most hit by it are the unionized work force. I have no problem with this as for the most part the unionized force could afford to improve it's efficiencies. Some of the program cuts may seem harsh and I realize there is more to consider than just dollars but we can't just keep printing money and funding programs that don't generate any revenue. It's hard to argue with the financial responsiblity of his government when compared to other leaders. From what I've seen over the years all elected governments have failed to keep their pre election promises.
It's refreshing to finally hear a voice of reason using a little logic...... I didn't vote Campbell in the last election either, but apparently we see things the same way.
Thanks for you input gordc!
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Although I never voted for Campbell I do see running the province as a business. I feel like he made dramatic cuts that have impacted some but people who seem to be most hit by it are the unionized work force. I have no problem with this as for the most part the unionized force could afford to improve it's efficiencies. Some of the program cuts may seem harsh and I realize there is more to consider than just dollars but we can't just keep printing money and funding programs that don't generate any revenue. It's hard to argue with the financial responsiblity of his government when compared to other leaders. From what I've seen over the years all elected governments have failed to keep their pre election promises.
Excellent post
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Although I never voted for Campbell I do see running the province as a business. I feel like he made dramatic cuts that have impacted some but people who seem to be most hit by it are the unionized work force. I have no problem with this as for the most part the unionized force could afford to improve it's efficiencies. Some of the program cuts may seem harsh and I realize there is more to consider than just dollars but we can't just keep printing money and funding programs that don't generate any revenue. It's hard to argue with the financial responsiblity of his government when compared to other leaders. From what I've seen over the years all elected governments have failed to keep their pre election promises.
More bologna- we're deeper in debt and have had a steep reduction in services. They inherited a surplus and peed it all away- Fact- We're deeper in the hole because of Campbell's financial "prowess".B.C.’s public debt went from $36.1 billion in 2001 to $55.9 billion by the end of the budget forecast 2010. Quit drinking the Kampbell Kool Aid- it's toxic and causes hallucinations, makes the truth disappear along with public holdings (BCR, Hydro), and makes lemmings leap off of cliffs while creating disillusions of grandeur.
Again AF - Prove me wrong- Proof, not supposition or rhetoric, actual facts.What's that noise? Crickets again?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A9peZ5WOtL0&feature=related
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Our entire staff had an excellent laugh at that Novabonker. thank you for that on a day when we really need it. If you are going to make that statement like that then show the rate at which the debt grew under previous leadership. Of course the debt has grown.
Thanks again for the laugh. My stomach hurt for the first time in a long time.
PS Do you belong to a union?
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Our entire staff had an excellent laugh at that Novabonker. thank you for that on a day when we really need it. If you are going to make that statement like that then show the rate at which the debt grew under previous leadership. Of course the debt has grown.
Thanks again for the laugh. My stomach hurt for the first time in a long time.
PS Do you belong to a union?
No I own a service business. Am I the only person that bothers to research what they post and not rely on belittling rhetoric
Gord C? (Is your last name Campbell?j/k)By the way- How many more equalization payments did BC receive during the Liberal reign? But only one during the NDP tenure...Which only saw ONE year of negative growth.
17 billion under the SoCreds by 1990
33 billion under the NDP 91 - 01 - up 16 billion - 10 years
55.9 billion and counting presently.- up 22 billion - 9 years ( Not even adding in the Federal welfare. Or today's "revised" forecast of -1.7 billion)
Now - do you want to talk economic growth since that theory is dismissed. Still laughing?
It won't matter after the Libs start getting recalled. Say good night Ida!
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Yes still laughing. You have enough political sense and business sense to know that the growth in debt reletive to the era shows he was, if nothing else, very responsable financially and that's my only point. Keep in mind infrastructure developments etc. It's not just a decade to decade comparrison. I'm not on his Kool laid but I'm overall comfortable with the job he's done and the state of our province. Not everything is perfect but it never will be. You voted for him... what were the reasons why? Could someone else of done better for less?
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Yes still laughing. You have enough political sense and business sense to know that the growth in debt reletive to the era shows he was, if nothing else, very responsable financially and that's my only point. Keep in mind infrastructure developments etc. It's not just a decade to decade comparrison. I'm not on his Kool laid but I'm overall comfortable with the job he's done and the state of our province. Not everything is perfect but it never will be. You voted for him... what were the reasons why? Could someone else of done better for less?
I never have and never would have voted for Campbell. I have a friend that worked within his sphere and warned me about pathological liars and that was the peg he nailed Campbell on. You see Gord, I saw first hand the heartless and gutless cuts to the poorest. A senior's residence I do work in had funding cuts that took money from those existing on little money. These folks had to chose between eating or increased living costs. I do volunteer work with youth in at high risk situations. You need to hear some of the horror stories of the homes they came from and the courage they exhibited to try and rise above that. 50% cut in funding. That equals some being left out on the street and most ended up in trouble again. I don't measure "success" by having a few more dollars in my wallet and believe that as a society we have a responsibility to help those that can't help themselves. Think about the couples with decades of marriage being seperated for a tax cut. That's what grinds my gears.
BUT
What really disgusts me is the way his political donors just happened to profit the most from his party being in power- Do you want to see that in black and white? If so, I can dig it up.It's there and stinks like a dead chum. The selling off of public assets was wrong. The lies , and yes lots of lies to facilitate the sale of BC Rail. How about those sweetheart deals for overpriced "green power"? My Hydro bill is increasing 33% because of the subsidy that Campbell gave them. The constant stream of lies and there;s a ton I can show you are a watermark on his ability to govern.
Do you think ANY politician should get away with a stream of never end BS and get away with it?
495 million maximum- Well, now that we're elected....Hansen knew it was a lie, but did sweet boom all to tell the truth., sorry it's going to be way higher. The recent desperate tax cut (what tax cut?) and wasting 200,000 or so to try and cling to power was pathetic at best. It might have been funny, but it wasn't. What I want for BC is an honest and forthright political party that goes down the middle of the road, not stepping on those that can't do anything about it. And puts HONESTY as their platform I nor you should put up with liars, yesmen and scumbuckets running our affairs. The Liberal house of cards got hit with a gust of wind.
Tell me how you feel about the honesty of our present government. Do you think they've been forthright with the electorate? How do you feel about the Basi - Virk payoff with all the cuts to legal aid, these guys skate , keep their properties and they get 6 million in legal fees forgiven. Don't you get a whiff of that chum again? How about the lobbyist registry? Assistant Ministers leaving the energy portfolio and jumping right into jobs with energy companies? Despite guidelines that say otherwise? The tree farm licence being converted to real estate? That might be a spring carcass you smell.
Do you want me to continue with this? I can show you lots of facts that are on the public record of other rotten fish odours, emanating from Campbell's rein.
Still laughing?
BTW - Thank you for responding and not doing the drive by smear.
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No use going any further with this as we see it totally differently. I don't let my emotion play any role in the matter and am not caught up in any compassion. I feel that it's just business. You would like, no matter what the cost, for tax payers to share the burden others bring on to themselves. I feel like the user should pay. I feel like we need to take care of our children and prepare for our senior years. I don't feel it's the responsibility of the goverment to look after me.
The increase to hydro is also greatly due to increased demand, (which the user can control) and much needed updating of current damns along with construction of new ones. In fact with this in mind the selling of this public asset may have relieved taxpayers of a future burden.
The tax cut thing was just a scramble, what the hell kinda thing and I agree that was a bit of a joke on the way out but it wasn't a simple as "gust of wind" that occured. And don't ever expect much honesty in politics as politics is war and we all know the truth is the first casualty in any war.
You mention issues where you feel the goverment has wronged but I can promise you that you'll find that in any goverment, even if the one you vote for is elected.
And finally I comfortable with the current goverment and hate the thought of NDP leadership.
Oh yeah, I got to take my family to share in the Olympics!!!
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So no compassion at all? Wow. I just can't be that cold. But to be content with liars is something no one should accept. Ever. Would you allow your employees to lie like that?
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I feel that you could call any political leader a liar and be correct in saying so 100% of the time.
I would hope my employees don't lie to me or others in their lives but I bet some do. It's not like I could remove them from their position for it either.
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No use going any further with this as we see it totally differently. I don't let my emotion play any role in the matter and am not caught up in any compassion. I feel that it's just business. You would like, no matter what the cost, for tax payers to share the burden others bring on to themselves. I feel like the user should pay. I feel like we need to take care of our children and prepare for our senior years. I don't feel it's the responsibility of the goverment to look after me.
The increase to hydro is also greatly due to increased demand, (which the user can control) and much needed updating of current damns along with construction of new ones. In fact with this in mind the selling of this public asset may have relieved taxpayers of a future burden.
The tax cut thing was just a scramble, what the hell kinda thing and I agree that was a bit of a joke on the way out but it wasn't a simple as "gust of wind" that occured. And don't ever expect much honesty in politics as politics is war and we all know the truth is the first casualty in any war.
You mention issues where you feel the goverment has wronged but I can promise you that you'll find that in any goverment, even if the one you vote for is elected.
And finally I comfortable with the current goverment and hate the thought of NDP leadership.
Oh yeah, I got to take my family to share in the Olympics!!!
WOW WOW WOW
Sell off BC HYDRO as it may be a future financial burden.
I have heard it all.
LMFAO
You probably think ROR projects are swell as well. ;D
Thanks for the laugh. HAHAHAHA
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I feel that you could call any political leader a liar and be correct in saying so 100% of the time.
I would hope my employees don't lie to me or others in their lives but I bet some do. It's not like I could remove them from their position for it either.
But my point was if you caught one telling whoppers constantly, being a business man and owner you'd toss them, with just cause. You see politicians work for us and we sit like contented cows saying "It's all OK" while being fed a complete and constant stream of utter and unmitigated bullspit.And that's from all corners as no party or even fewer politicians understand truth as they face no consequences. I do make one exception, that being Chuck Cadman as he served with candor and a dignity that many of us would be lucky to have half of.There's nothing about liars that I accept when I discover it in my personal or business life so why should we expect it from our employees. I pretty sure the HST revolt has a lot to do with the electorate finally standing up and firmly stating that they're fed up with being played for a sucker/fool combination, and I applaud that because it represents democracy. It;s time to demand and receive honesty and not a 140 million dollar Public Affairs Bureau or spin machine. Unearth and end wasteful things like that and we could easily afford better social programs. Just sayin' ;)
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Bluesteele please be careful in reading my statement as it is merely an angle and not at all related to my opinion of the sale. My persoanl business sense would not allow me to let go of such an asset as my long term view is that any investment or capital costs associated with keeping it public would be well worth it. That being said I am not privy to the information Campbell is and believe that there was other driving factors prompting the decision and not a conspiracy of sorts.
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This wouldn't have had anything to do with those highly profitable IPP's would it? I will not show the CN Rail donations - yet
1. Pristine Power 95150
2. Teck Cominco Metals 75000
3. Plutonic Power 69100
4. Peter Kiewit and Sons 62500
5. Brookfield Asset Management/Renewable Power 60000
6. NaiKun Wind 24650
7. Cloudworks Energy 16050
8. Donald McInnes 15550
9. Pacific Bioenergy 14500
10. Ledcor CMI 12600
11. Syntaris 12300
12. Nexterra 11000
13. Golder associates 8488
14. Ledcor construction 8000
15. Canadian Hydro Developers 7000
16. Jeremy P. Haile 6400
17. Run of River Power 6000
18. TransAlta Utilities 5850
19. Capital Power Corp - See Epcor 5700
20. Pinnacle Pellet 5320
21. Fred Olsen Renewables 5000
22. Fortis ----Aquila (2002) 4670
23. AMEC EARTH AND ENVIRONMENTAL LTD. 4500
24. National Public Relations (Joined IPPBC 2008?) 4450
25. Alterna 4000
26. Aeolis Wind Power 4000
27. Epcor Utilities 3876
28. ELEMENTAL ENERGY INC 3500
29. Ainsworth Lumber company 3050
30. Kleana Power 3000
31. General Electric 3000
32. AltaGas 3000
33. Ledcor power 2500
34. Glacier Power 2400
35. Juergen Puetter 2010
36. Renewable Power 2000
37. Peter Kewitt 2000
38. Sea Breeze Power 1975
39. PG & E 1832.25
40. HEMMERA ENVIROCHEM INC 1650
41. Innergex 1500
42. GEOFFREY PLANT 1360
43. Robert Poore 1321
45. Enbridge Wind Energy 1300
46. Regional Power 1000
47. R. Stuart Angus 1000
48. CRAIG ASPINALL & ASSOCIATES 900
49. R.G. 'Jako' Krushnisky 750
50. HAWKEYE Energy 750
51. Fries Creek Hydro 700
52. Rupert Peace Power 650
53. PRINCE GEORGE INTERIOR WASTE TO ENERGY 650
54. Walter Segsworth 500
55. GLOBAL ENERGY HORIZONS 500
56. CRAZY CREEK POWER COMPANY 500
57. LEVELTON CONSULTANTS LTD. 400
58. NATURAL POWER CONSULTANTS ASSOCIATION 350
59. PRINCETON COGEN LTD 306
60. Tom Syer 300
61. Dr. Alexander Eunall 300
Total 2009 contributions to
BC Liberal Party from IPP
related interests:
$598,608.25
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And, just for good measure, let's stifle democracy-
http://www.donewithdalton.com/2010/11/25/proof-that-elections-bc-added-number-of-words-in-proponent-statement-on-november-24/
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And, just for good measure, let's stifle democracy-
http://www.donewithdalton.com/2010/11/25/proof-that-elections-bc-added-number-of-words-in-proponent-statement-on-november-24/
See below ;D :D
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See below ;D :D
??? ??? ???
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And, just for good measure, let's stifle democracy-
http://www.donewithdalton.com/2010/11/25/proof-that-elections-bc-added-number-of-words-in-proponent-statement-on-november-24/
--Interesting and may indicate something but maybe not... often the statement on line will indicate that it is not the official version and that the official written version is available.
--I don't know if the word count issue is common practice in court documents, however I do know that the limits are strictly adhered to.
--I would only be suspicious if the word count rules are not standard practice for court documents.
--The web site could just be a clarification rather than a fabrication.
--I am certain that for court of appeals applications the word count is strictly enforced and if more words are used they must have a justification that will be ruled on an if rejected the appeal has to be rewritten withing the allowable.
--Thus I would only be upset if the rules for counting words used by elections BC have been changed as suggested or are different from common practice used by the courts of BC.
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--Interesting and may indicate something but maybe not... often the statement on line will indicate that it is not the official version and that the official written version is available.
--I don't know if the word count issue is common practice in court documents, however I do know that the limits are strictly adhered to.
--I would only be suspicious if the word count rules are not standard practice for court documents.
--The web site could just be a clarification rather than a fabrication.
--I am certain that for court of appeals applications the word count is strictly enforced and if more words are used they must have a justification that will be ruled on an if rejected the appeal has to be rewritten withing the allowable.
--Thus I would only be upset if the rules for counting words used by elections BC have been changed as suggested or are different from common practice used by the courts of BC.
I appreciate your input, skaha.
Just because someone posts something on the internet doesn't necessarily mean that it is true. It's important to be aware that everybody has an agenda and they will post whatever they feel will further that agenda.
However it tends to be much more intriguing when the post includes a conspiracy.... ;D
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RAFE HERE - HERE'S PROOF THAT CAMPBELL & CO ARE DELIBERATELY BANKRUPTING BC HYDRO.
PLEASE, IF YOU NEVER WATCH ANOTHER VIDEO, I BEG YOU TO SEE THIS ONE AND PLEASE PASS IT ON AS WIDELY AS YOU CAN! http://www.vimeo.com/16944794
Victoria Community TV Presents:
Face to Face
with Big Trouble at BC Hydro
Retired economist Erik Anderson discusses a troubling and possibly sinister financial situation at BC Hydro. And he asks: Is BC Hydro being put in financial jeopardy in order to privatize it. This is shocking and almost unbelievable stuff and must be seen by all. Once again we see the Media and the NDP silent, the government corrupt, and our future being put at great risk. The stage is being set for something that may make the BC Rail fraud look small.
This show can be viewed online at: http://www.vimeo.com/16944794
and in order to really get what he is saying, you should watch this more than once...
Produced by Lazarus Productions
Also watch Pasifik.ca: usually Saturdays and Sundays at 8:30PM
ICTV can be reached at jetkino@yahoo.ca
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Wow, if Campbell is such an irresponsible Premier, then Canada is sure in a lot of trouble..... ??? ???
VANCOUVER, B.C.—British Columbia Premier Gordon Campbell ranks as the best of 10 provincial premiers at managing key aspects of fiscal policy including government spending, taxes, and debt and deficits, according to a new peer-reviewed study released today by the Fraser Institute, Canada’s leading public policy think-tank.
The study, Measuring the Fiscal Performance of Canada’s Premiers, ranks Campbell first overall with a score of 89.1 out of a possible 100. Former Manitoba premier Gary Doer ranked second with a score of 78.2. Newfoundland and Labrador Premier Danny Williams scored 71.0 and ranked third. Premiers Ed Stelmach of Alberta (66.4) and Brad Wall of Saskatchewan (57.9) followed in fourth and fifth positions respectively, giving Western Canadian premiers four of the top five spots in the overall rankings............
http://www.fraserinstitute.org/uploadedFiles/fraser-ca/Content/research-news/research/publications/measuring-fiscal-performance-of-Canadas-premiers.pdf (http://www.fraserinstitute.org/uploadedFiles/fraser-ca/Content/research-news/research/publications/measuring-fiscal-performance-of-Canadas-premiers.pdf)
Here is an example of how people get so wrapped up in listening to the left wing and the press that they stop seeing reality.....
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The Fraser Institute is reality??????....
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The Fraser Institute is reality??????....
For some.....
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The Fraser Institute is reality??????....
Totally right wing organization, had a buddy who worked there and noticed a severe personality change in him and his politics.
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VANCOUVER, B.C.—British Columbia Premier Gordon Campbell ranks as the best of 10 provincial premiers at managing key aspects of fiscal policy including government spending, taxes, and debt and deficits, according to a new peer-reviewed study released today by the Fraser Institute, Canada’s leading public policy think-tank.
Watch this http://vimeo.com/16944794 (long, about 30 minutes) wherein is explains how Campbell's policies are likely to bankrupt BC Hydro. It raises a big question about whose interest the Fraser Institute represents.
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Totally right wing organization, had a buddy who worked there and noticed a severe personality change in him and his politics.
I find your comments amusing about how the Fraser Institute is a right wing organization. jimmywits buddies personality probably changed for the better because he finally saw the truth... ;D
A report like this would never be created if a left wing organization was asked to write it. This is because most left wing organizations haven't a clue on how to balance a budget and often question why a budget is even necessary... If you actually read the article you would see that all 10 premiers were measured using the same economic measuring stick and Campbell came out head and shoulders above any other premier in terms of his ability to manage the BC economy. The point being that comparing BC to the other provinces, we have been fortunate enough to have the best manager over the last number of years.
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Watch this http://vimeo.com/16944794 (long, about 30 minutes) wherein is explains how Campbell's policies are likely to bankrupt BC Hydro. It raises a big question about whose interest the Fraser Institute represents.
It is a fact that publicly (government) owned and managed businesses do not run efficiently when compared to private businesses. The reason is simple. Government businesses have no incentive to earn a profit, in fact if they show a loss they know that government will throw in more money. Private business on the other hand is fighting for survival. In order to grow their business they need to be well run and profitable. If they don't manage their business well they go bankrupt. Why do you think the potash and uranium companies in Saskatchewan were privatized?
Perhaps privatizing BC Hydro would be the best thing for them! I have a friend who knows a supervisor at the BC Hydro yard in Surrey. Any time he needs some type of building supply, tool etc. he asks the supervisor and a few days later it is delivered to his door.... no charge. Apparently there are no controls on materials at BC Hydro. Can you imagine the huge cost to us the taxpayers as a result. There is no way a private enterprise would allow that kind of thing to happen!
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"I have a friend who knows a supervisor" Second hand hearsay. Report the "friend" if he's involved in theft. What kind of people do you hang with AF? Oh, yeah - The Fraser Institute....... ;D
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It is a fact that publicly (government) owned and managed businesses do not run efficiently when compared to private businesses. The reason is simple. Government businesses have no incentive to earn a profit, in fact if they show a loss they know that government will throw in more money. Private business on the other hand is fighting for survival. In order to grow their business they need to be well run and profitable. If they don't manage their business well they go bankrupt. Why do you think the potash and uranium companies in Saskatchewan were privatized?
Perhaps privatizing BC Hydro would be the best thing for them! I have a friend who knows a supervisor at the BC Hydro yard in Surrey. Any time he needs some type of building supply, tool etc. he asks the supervisor and a few days later it is delivered to his door.... no charge. Apparently there are no controls on materials at BC Hydro. Can you imagine the huge cost to us the taxpayers as a result. There is no way a private enterprise would allow that kind of thing to happen!
So I guess your in favor of privatized health care too. I worked for a very reputible privatly owned logging equiptment manufacturing company and we all got stuff done or parts its not just public run ventures.
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So I guess your in favor of privatized health care too.
Yup! Let people who can afford it, buy it if they want. It would take some pressure off the public funded system....
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I find your comments amusing about how the Fraser Institute is a right wing organization. jimmywits buddies personality probably changed for the better because he finally saw the truth... ;D
A report like this would never be created if a left wing organization was asked to write it. This is because most left wing organizations haven't a clue on how to balance a budget and often question why a budget is even necessary... If you actually read the article you would see that all 10 premiers were measured using the same economic measuring stick and Campbell came out head and shoulders above any other premier in terms of his ability to manage the BC economy. The point being that comparing BC to the other provinces, we have been fortunate enough to have the best manager over the last number of years.
"jimmywits buddies personality probably changed for the better because he finally saw the truth... ;D"
He definitely did not change for the better, it was almost like he had been brainwashed, he is negative about everything. Also, it is no great feat for Campbell to come out on top of the likes of his predecessors, especially Glen Clarke.
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"jimmywits buddies personality probably changed for the better because he finally saw the truth... ;D"
He definitely did not change for the better, it was almost like he had been brainwashed, he is negative about everything. Also, it is no great feat for Campbell to come out on top of the likes of his predecessors, especially Glen Clarke.
You really should read the article..... ::)
If you read it you'll see that it didn't evaluate Clarke. It compared Campbell to the other 9 provincial premiers.....
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You really should read the article..... ::)
If you read it you'll see that it didn't evaluate Clarke. It compared Campbell to the other 9 provincial premiers.....
The source has issues with bias and has been caught more than a few times omitting certain facts that didn't suit it's agenda.Speaking of facts AF - Did you ever get around to disproving what I posted or was I telling fibs as you inferred?
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You really should read the article..... ::)
If you read it you'll see that it didn't evaluate Clarke. It compared Campbell to the other 9 provincial premiers.....
I never said the article did evaluate Clarke.
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muslim style fraser institute sampler
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oV-cY-g1PA8
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muslim style fraser institute sampler
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oV-cY-g1PA8
wow ??? are you serious?? :o ::) You can't possibly believe that the Fraser Institute is remotely similar to the radical Muslims....
I'm also guessing you've probably never read any of their research papers!
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smells the same to me. :-*
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--where's the Re: Is Carole James on The Way Out thread?
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--where's the Re: Is Carole James on The Way Out thread?
Too many people are in denial to post anything like that!
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http://thetyee.ca/Opinion/2010/12/06/OttawaTransfers/?utm_source=daily&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=061210
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http://thetyee.ca/Opinion/2010/12/06/OttawaTransfers/?utm_source=daily&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=061210
It's funny how the left wing press can turn a positive to a negative!
The fact is the reason BC has paid so much to the Feds in the last 10 years is that the current government took an NDP run have-not province and turned it into a have province. Under the terms of the provincial/federal rules (equalization payments) provinces that are doing well pay the Feds more than provinces that are not doing well.... You should see what Alberta pays the Feds each year!
Perhaps we should put a government in place like Quebec has. ??? There's a have-not province who has never contributed to Canada and has continually taken!
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It's funny how the left wing press can turn a positive to a negative!
The fact is the reason BC has paid so much to the Feds in the last 10 years is that the current government took an NDP run have-not province and turned it into a have province. Under the terms of the provincial/federal rules (equalization payments) provinces that are doing well pay the Feds more than provinces that are not doing well.... You should see what Alberta pays the Feds each year!
Perhaps we should put a government in place like Quebec has. ??? There's a have-not province who has never contributed to Canada and has continually taken!
Horse biscuits AF- Again, do your research- ONE year under the NDP there was a payment and the Libs had how many?4?5?6? Man, you post a lot of stuff that the FACTS don't back up. It's almost hilarious and speaks volumes about not backing up what you posted, but it's really sad when you post outright, well, bologna and tell everyone it's tenderloin. Don't let the truth get in the way......
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2010 Games put over $2-billion in B.C. coffers: report http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/british-columbia/2010-games-put-over-2-billion-in-bc-coffers-report/article1842581/ (http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/british-columbia/2010-games-put-over-2-billion-in-bc-coffers-report/article1842581/)
..... and the Olympics came in on budget. It's a shame that Campbell isn't getting a little credit for that....
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2010 Games put over $2-billion in B.C. coffers: report http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/british-columbia/2010-games-put-over-2-billion-in-bc-coffers-report/article1842581/ (http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/british-columbia/2010-games-put-over-2-billion-in-bc-coffers-report/article1842581/)
..... and the Olympics came in on budget. It's a shame that Campbell isn't getting a little credit for that....
But Colin Hansen clearly stated in Feb 09 it would be 10.7 billion..
Also things like road upgrade with no tolls for the rich, convention centre, Canada line (which was scaled back due to lack of money and will cost billions to expand so the stations can hold more than two car trains) then Olympic village, did not include costs of building new facilities so I call bull..
We will need a non liberal government in office (not necessarily the NDP or another low wage conservative party like we have now) to tell us the truth. I expect horrors from not just the Olympics either..
I would be more inclined to believe this if former Auditor General Shelia Fraser were to review the books and give a report as I do not believe anything these low wage conservatives masquerading as Liberals say...With the BCLiberals/Socreds/Low Wage Conservatives it is like the boy who cried wolf once to often....
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2010 Games put over $2-billion in B.C. coffers: report http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/british-columbia/2010-games-put-over-2-billion-in-bc-coffers-report/article1842581/ (http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/british-columbia/2010-games-put-over-2-billion-in-bc-coffers-report/article1842581/)
..... and the Olympics came in on budget. It's a shame that Campbell isn't getting a little credit for that....
And I read this in the same article........
$925million plus $1 billion in Security
Plus $3 billion in transportation Sea to Sky plus Transit line
Plus BC Hydro $15 million
ICBC $9 million
BC Loteries $15 million
$30 million BC Place
$300 million Bonus pay for employees contracts
and $36.1-million went to First Nations and municipal governments.
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But Colin Hansen clearly stated in Feb 09 it would be 10.7 billion..
Also things like road upgrade with no tolls for the rich, convention centre, Canada line (which was scaled back due to lack of money and will cost billions to expand so the stations can hold more than two car trains) then Olympic village, did not include costs of building new facilities so I call bull..
We will need a non liberal government in office (not necessarily the NDP or another low wage conservative party like we have now) to tell us the truth. I expect horrors from not just the Olympics either..
I would be more inclined to believe this if former Auditor General Shelia Fraser were to review the books and give a report as I do not believe anything these low wage conservatives masquerading as Liberals say...With the BCLiberals/Socreds/Low Wage Conservatives it is like the boy who cried wolf once to often....
WELL STATED
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RAFE HERE - below is my blog for December 20 on www.thecanadian.org
Alex Tsakumis has uncovered memos from David Basi setting out the shenanigans surrounding the Campbell government's breach of promise and sale of BC Rail. I'm much indepted.
PLEASE LET'S BE OUT OWN MEDIA AND PASS THIS ON!
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Alex Tsakumis is a courageous journalist in the practiced in days of yore, when political reporters were expected to hold the “Establishment’s” and especially government’s feet to the fire. The days when there was incisive reporting with columnists staying with the story until the end are, alas, of a bygone era. Journalists were like pit bulls that you could not easily dislodge from the seat of your pants. Where are the fearless fighters for the truth that seemed to vanish after the NDP were defeated in 2001?
Because those days are gone, the Campbell government and others’ fear of exposure of wrongdoing were minimized, if not eliminated - were it not for the Basi-Virk trial. Now it’s gone.
Alex has come into possession of four memos-to-file by David Basi which were certified by lawyer George Jones, QC. That doesn’t mean the contents were true, of course, but it does raise serious questions about the role played by a number of people both inside and outside of the BC Cabinet. It has not been denied that Crown Counsel had possession of those documents.
I urge everyone to go to Alex’s website and read the memos from David Basi to the file. If they are true, serious misconduct by the government occurred during the sale period.
I must say from the outset that I’m not accusing specific people of any wrongdoing. What I am going to do is deal with the settlement of the Basi-Virk case and ask some pointed questions. Absent a court case, it is you, the jury of citizens who must decide.
The issues started shortly after the 2001 election in which Premier Campbell pledged he would not privatize BC Rail. With the election behind him, Campbell asked for bidders and three came forward.
Let’s try to look at this 7 year case in a nutshell.
Nearly a year after police raided the offices of Gary Collins, then Finance Minister, Mr. Basi and Mr. Virk were charged with multiple counts of fraud and breach of trust. The two men were said to have, amongst other things, accepted benefits from one of the bidders for the Roberts Bank spur line in return for handing over confidential documents. The defendants maintained that they had instructions from Cabinet ministers to keep the bidding going because while CN was the favoured bidder and Campbell wanted the bidding to look good because CN was run by one David McLean, long a Liberal bagman and bosom buddy of his. Indeed that’s the essence of Basi’s memos.
The list of witnesses in the trial for the Crown included two Cabinet Minsters with several powerful public servants. To add to this murky pond was a $300,000 payment by BC Rail to Liberal eminence grise, Patrick Kinsella, for “consulting fees during the bidding process." Not surprisingly, this prompted the other bidders to holler foul, claiming that the government favoured CN all along and that the others were just window dressing to make the bidding look real and mask the truth that CN had a slam dunk.
Let’s look at two things – why Crown Counsel stopped the case just as important witnesses were to be heard, and what the crash of the case meant.
The short answer is that the accused men wanted to "cop a plea" and plead guilty to a couple of charges, getting away without going to jail and having their $6 million legal bill paid by the government.
This raises, to me at any rate, the obvious question: why did Special Counsel Bill Berardino, QC, accept?
Berardino knew he had a strong case, obviously fortified by the fact that defence counsel were admitting, off the record, that their clients were guilty, and the strongest part of his case was yet to come.
Asked if there was any government pressure to end the trial, which had so far contained embarrassing allegations for the B.C. Liberal Party, Berardino said: "This is my decision. I made it on my own by myself."
I’m sorry, I don’t believe that and subsequent statements bear out my skepticism. When I and others expressed our incredulity at Berardino’s statement, it was then admitted that, of course, the Assistant Deputy Attorney General, knew about it but he was by statute removed from the politics and that we should recognize that “cast in stone” independence the Crown Counsel Act vested in him.
It’s impossible for me to accept that the Premier didn’t instruct Crown Counsel to seek terms and, after the terms were given, order their acceptance. I don’t say that Crown Counsel was untruthful, just that I don’t believe his story.
I’ve been in government, folks, and I know governments don’t pay out $6 million, plus another $12 million in legal expenses without knowing why.
Indeed, a bit of further prodding and the Deputy Attorney-General was admitted to be part of the deal, and shortly after that we learned that the Deputy Minister of Finance was also involved. Now, instead of Crown Counsel being the only one involved, the proposed settlement meant that payment would have to be authorized by Treasury Board, meaning that if Campbell didn’t know all about it before, he sure as hell did now. To me, all suspicions were confirmed - the key point being not what Mr. Berardino said or did, but the irresistible inference that Gordon Campbell and his flunkies not only knew about the deal but gave the instructions to settle.
Let’s look at it from another angle – why would Campbell want this trial to end ingloriously when victory was as assured as such can ever be? He knew it would look like hell to the public. Obviously this means he knew it would be even worse if he and others were forced to testify. The only possible reason Campbell could have for stopping this 7 year legal odyssey was to avoid the damage surely to come if he and former Finance Minister Gary Collins had to testify and if Basi and Virk had a chance to give their version of events.
Here’s where Alex Tsakumis' dogged determination to discover the truth comes in. He learned that Dave Basi wrote at least four memos-to-file certified by a prominent lawyer and got possession of them. If you read them - and they are available on Alex’s website - it’s all there. The bribery, the deals, the lies, and the sleaze. Could one not infer from Campbell wanting the case to end that Basi’s memos are truthful? Doesn’t this make it pretty clear that Campbell knew what was in those memos?
If that’s the case, Campbell knew that further testimony could place him, former ministers Gary Collins, Judith Read, and even the untouchable Patrick Kinsella in serious legal jeopardy?
In the famous words of Emile Zola in the Alfred Dreyfus case, “J’accuse” the government of BC, and Premier Campbell of perverting the course of justice, then stonewalling an Independent Commission to look into this entire sordid mess. Assuming he and his colleagues' hands are clean, wouldn’t they want to demonstration before an independent commissioner?
Surely, if they are innocent they would be begging to have a hearing.
But they aren’t. The former deputy premier during the sale of BC Rail, Christy Clark has made it clear she wants no scrutiny into her acts at the time.
If the Campbell government does not instruct a Judicial Inquiry, one can only conclude that Basi is telling the truth.
That being so, other heads should roll - but of course they won't.
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The thing about Rafe is at least he tries to be honest about his reporting as opposed to the drivel that Bill Tieleman writes in that rag...... ;D
I like this statement right at the beginning of his article...... "Alex has come into possession of four memos-to-file by David Basi which were certified by lawyer George Jones, QC. That doesn’t mean the contents were true, of course....... "
If the information in the memos is not true why bother writing an article about it? ???
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Will McMartin Shoots Down Squawking Gaggle of Campbell Praisers
A 'great' premier whose fiscal skill made BC 'great' for business? The facts say no.
By Will McMartin, 8 Nov 2010, TheTyee.ca
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Is it ironic, or just plain weird, that while only nine per cent of British Columbians currently hold a positive view of Gordon Campbell, close to 100 per cent of the mainstream media remain deeply infatuated with our soon-to-be ex-premier?
Consider the editorial published in the Globe and Mail on Nov. 4, one day after the deeply unpopular premier announced that he was quitting politics. "Gordon Campbell," the Globe bleated, "will be judged as one of the great premiers of British Columbia."
Seriously? By whom? The great unwashed certainly don't hold that view, and no political historian could claim with a straight face that Campbell's accomplishments in office compare favourably to those of such provincial giants as W.A.C. Bennett, John Hart, or Richard McBride (or even Duff Pattullo or John Oliver).
Heck, even Dave Barrett (in just three and a half years) left a more substantive legislative catalogue than did Campbell (over 10 years), had a better surplus-deficit record and left a smaller taxpayer-supported-debt-to-GDP ratio (seven per cent compared to Campbell's 17 per cent).
Maybe the Globe editorialists, headquartered as they are in distant Toronto, just don't know much about B.C., our politics, or our history.
Yet, on the same day as the Globe head-scratcher appeared in print, a Vancouver Sun editorial gushed that Campbell was "one of B.C.'s great leaders." And the Sun's opinion leaders actually reside in this province. Hmmm.
Less surprising was the morning-after-resignation paean by CKNW radio talk-show host Bill Good. Reciting a list of the premier's alleged feats, Good had the gumption to include the Vancouver Trade and Convention Centre, which was built without a business plan and at a cost $346 million higher than B.C. taxpayers had been promised. (Original budget: $495 million. Final bill: $841.2 million.)
Remarkable. Truly, Gordon Campbell must be one of the "great" ones.
Praise, but no proof
A closer look at the encomia for Campbell from the media elites reveals that their minority view is based almost entirely on his fiscal record.
The Sun praised Campbell's "sound fiscal management," and claimed that his efforts made British Columbia "a better place to live and work." The paper also stated that he had convinced investors that B.C. was "a great place to do business." No empirical evidence was offered to support any of these assertions.
The Globe took a similar path, but made the bizarre claim that Campbell had "transformed the province's finances." Again, not a jot nor a tittle of empirical proof was provided.
As for Good, he repeated the hoary myth that Campbell "took over a province that had achieved 'have-not' status under the NDP" and then restored it to greatness.
It actually is shocking how loathe are the mainstream media to undertake even a minimal amount of research -- especially when so much of B.C.'s fiscal information is readily available online or in public libraries. Would it have been so very difficult for the Globe, Sun or Good to spend even a few minutes analyzing Campbell's fiscal accomplishments before declaring that he belongs in the pantheon of B.C. "greats"?
Apparently, it is. And so The Tyee will boldly go where the mainstream media elites refuse to venture, and conduct an objective examination of B.C.'s fiscal performance from the spring of 2001, when Gordon Campbell became our province's 34th premier, to the spring of 2011, when he'll be replaced as leader of the BC Liberal party.
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Where the facts reside
We'll primarily use two documents: the 2010 British Columbia Financial and Economic Review (70th edition), and the Campbell government's Budget and Fiscal Plan 2010/11 - 2012/13. Both are published by the Ministry of Finance.
The starting point for our analysis is March 31, 2001, the date that marked the end of the 2000/01 fiscal year. (Campbell's BC Liberals won election to government on May 16, 2001, and he was sworn in as premier on June 5.)
The end point is March 31, 2011 -- the end of the current fiscal year. (It is expected that the BC Liberal party will choose Campbell's successor some time in the spring of 2011.)
Now, some of our more-astute readers -- that is, those who don't work in the mainstream media -- will note that two important developments have taken place since the 2010/11 budget was published.
First, the province announced on Sept. 14 (in the first quarterly report for the year) that Ottawa had advised that corporate income tax receipts were going to be much higher than originally forecast. Corporate income tax revenues now are expected to hit $1.521 billion in fiscal 2010/11, an increase of $674 million over the budgeted number of $847 million.
Second, on Oct. 27, Campbell made a televised address to the province and announced a 15 per cent cut to personal income tax rates. The tax cut will cost the provincial treasury $568 million (or about 85 per cent of the windfall corporate income tax receipts) in the current fiscal year.
We'll start by looking at Victoria's revenues over the last 10 years, then review expenditures, deficits and debt, and conclude by examining B.C. as a "have-not" province.
Revenues grew slightly, but declined as proportion of BC's economy
The 2000/01 fiscal year ended with Victoria collecting tax revenues of $14.3 billion, while the 2010/11 budget calls for tax receipts of $17.4 billion (since boosted to $18.1 billion in the first quarterly report). The composition of taxation revenue changed considerably over the 10-year period.
Two of the biggest sources of tax receipts -- personal-income tax and corporate-income tax -- were surprisingly flat over the decade, given population growth of about 500,000 and inflation. The reason? The many and on-going tax cuts unveiled by Campbell since 2001.
PIT revenues slipped from $5.963 billion to $5.861 billion, while corporate-income tax revenues dropped from just over $1 billion to $847 million for the current year. (Again, the first quarterly report boosted the latter figure to $1.5 billion.)
Tax revenues from retail sales rose from $3.6 billion in 2000/01, to an expected $5.2 billion in 2010/11. The former figure was generated by the provincial sales tax (officially known as the Social Service Tax) alone, while the latter is an amalgam of the PST and the new (and much-hated) Harmonized Sales Tax, which replaced the PST on July 1.
One levy, the corporation capital tax, was whittled away to nothing under Campbell's stewardship, while a new one, the carbon tax, was introduced in 2008. The former generated $459 million in 2000/01, and zero in the current year; the latter is expected to produce $727 million in Campbell's last year in office.
The biggest gain in tax receipts over the decade was due to world-wide low interest rates, which sparked a housing boom (and bubble) in much of the western world. Property-transfer revenues totaled $262 million in our base year of 2000/01, and are expected to hit $900 million at the end of the current fiscal period.
In total, Victoria's tax receipts grew by just $3.1 billion (or $3.8 billion, based on the first quarterly report) while Gordon Campbell was premier. As a proportion of B.C.'s economy, provincial tax revenues fell from 10.8 per cent of gross domestic product (GDP), to about 8.9 per cent.
Given that the 2010/11 budget estimates that B.C.'s GDP this year will hit $196.3 billion, the annual revenue lost to tax cuts is about $3.7 billion.
Explosion in federal transfers, MSP premiums and tuition
Natural resource revenues were surprisingly anemic -- given the boom in global commodity prices -- during Campbell's premiership. Ten years ago, forests revenues totaled over $1.3 billion and natural gas revenues were in excess of $1.2 billion. This year, however, forests are expected to generate a mere $491 million, while natural gas will produce just $698 million.
In total, natural resource receipts will have fallen from $4.0 billion in 2000/01, to $3.2 billion in the current fiscal year.
But even as Victoria's receipts from taxation and natural resources deteriorated or weakened over Gordon Campbell's decade in office, many other revenue sources showed surprising strength.
Foremost among them were transfers from the federal government. In 2000/01, Ottawa sent a mere $3.3 billion to British Columbia; in the current year that figure is expected to hit a whopping $7.7 billion.
As a proportion of the provincial economy, federal transfers under Campbell will have exploded from 2.5 per cent of GDP, to more than 3.9 per cent. Simply, Ottawa's largesse over the last decade has done much to replace provincial revenues lost to Campbell's persistent tax-cutting.
Crown corporation net income also has seen significant growth over the last decade, rising from $1.6 billion, to $3.0 billion.
The biggest gains originated from gaming profits at the BC Lottery Corp. (from $554 million to $1.1 billion); alcohol profits at the Liquor Distribution Branch (from $642 million to $974 million); and insurance profits at ICBC (from a loss of $14 million to net income of $303 million).
But the biggest revenue gains which offset the losses from Campbell's tax cuts were in two areas well-known to low and middle-income British Columbians -- Medical Services Plan premiums and post-secondary tuition.
In 2000/01, MSP premiums generated $894 million for the provincial treasury, but in the current year the comparable figure is expected to hit an eye-popping $1.741 billion.
And over the same period, tuition fees recovered from post-secondary students will have nearly tripled, from $440 million to $1.135 billion.
In total, provincial GAAP (generally accepted accounting principles) revenues under Gordon Campbell will have grown from $29.689 billion in 2000/01, to $39.190 billion in the current fiscal period.
Yet, as a proportion of the B.C. economy, Victoria's revenues will have declined from 22.6 per cent of GDP, to just 20.0 per cent. Again, with provincial GDP expected to be $196.3 billion this year, that's a loss of about $5.1 billion.
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Big declines in spending outside health, education and general government
Not surprisingly, even though Victoria's current-dollar spending rose under Campbell -- from $28.439 billion to $40.605 billion -- expenditures also will have fallen in relative terms. A decade ago, provincial spending represented 21.7 per cent of GDP, this year the comparable figure is pegged at 20.6 per cent.
Health spending under Campbell will have increased from $9.430 billion to $16.474 billion; education (K-12 and post-secondary), from $7.216 billion to $10.820 billion; and social services, from $3.214 billion to $3.454 billion.
These "big three" areas of government expenditure will have seen combined growth from 15.1 per cent of GDP in 2000, to 15.7 per cent in the current period.
Nearly every other area of Victoria's annual expenditure budget -- law enforcement and justice, economic development, transportation and the environment -- has declined over the last decade. One exception is "general government," which, under Campbell's leadership, has exploded from $435 million in 2000/01, to an estimated $1.376 billion in 2010/11.
Five surpluses, five shortfalls for premier who 'outlawed' deficits
Gordon Campbell and his BC Liberals won election to government in 2001 with a pledge to "outlaw" budgetary deficits. Indeed, one of the first statutes passed by the new government was the Balanced Budget and Ministerial Accountability Act, although its ban on provincial deficits did not kick in until 2004.
And so the Campbell Liberals -- after "inheriting" a GAAP surplus in excess of $1.2 billion from the defeated New Democrats -- promptly racked-up shortfalls of $1 billion (in 2001/02), $2.6 billion (2002/03) and $1.2 billion (2003/04), before recording a succession of sizeable surpluses.
Over the four fiscal years between 2004/05 to 2007/08, the Campbell government had surpluses of $2.7 billion, $3.7 billion, $4.3 billion and $3.2 billion. A fifth, but much-smaller residue of $57 million appeared in 2008/09, but then the deficits reappeared.
Last year, 2009/10, saw a shortfall of $1.8 billion, and the current fiscal year is expected to end with another $1.8 billion (or $1.4 billion, according to the first quarterly report) deficit.
Gordon Campbell's record of surpluses and deficits? Five of the former, and five of the latter.
Capital spending exploded and debt soared
For much of B.C.'s history, Victoria's operating and capital expenditures were combined in the provincial budget. That changed in the late 1990s under the NDP, and was confirmed with the BC Liberals' implementation of GAAP.
Put simply, our provincial budgets capture 100 per cent of the government's annual operating outlays, but just a fraction of capital charges. It's become much-easier, in other words, to balance the budget when only some, not all, of the capital outlays are counted.
Not surprisingly, British Columbians have seen an explosion in capital spending under Gordon Campbell. In 2000/01, total capital expenditures added up to $3.3 billion; in the current fiscal period, $8.2 billion.
And so, despite the appearance of sizeable budget surpluses in the middle part of the past decade, B.C.'s debt has grown dramatically. Ten years ago, on the eve of Campbell's first election victory, total provincial debt stood at $33.788 billion. By the end of this fiscal year, the comparable number is expected to hit $47.757 billion.
The picture improves slightly when total provincial debt is measured as a proportion of the B.C. economy. In 2000/01, total provincial debt was 25.7 per cent of GDP; by next March, that number should be 24.3 per cent.
Campbell inherited surplus of $1.2 billion, leaves similar shortfall
This is Gordon Campbell's fiscal record. An objective observer might describe it as so-so: not egregiously awful (as was that of John Herbert Turner in the 1890s), but hardly stellar (as was John Hart's in the 1940s).
And yet the mainstream media elite gush and fawn and celebrate Campbell as one of the "greats."
They do so, of course, because they have dedicated years to denigrating the fiscal record of Campbell's predecessors; that is, the two New Democratic Party governments of the 1990s. Good gave away the game with his claim that Campbell inherited a "have-not" province in 2001.
What, exactly, is B.C.'s record as a recipient of equalization payments from Ottawa, the hallmark of "have-not" status?
In the 1980s, Social Credit governments led by Bill Bennett and Bill Vander Zalm received three special equalization payments from Ottawa. Bennett got the first such payment, for $139 million, in 1983/84, and a second for $35 million in 1984/85. Vander Zalm obtained $360,000 in 1986/87.
The NDP garnered a single equalization transfer, of $125 million, in 1999/2000.
Gordon Campbell's BC Liberals, in contrast, received five such payments: $158 million in 2001/02; $543 million in 2002/03; $979 million in 2004/05; $590 million in 2005/06; and $459 million in 2006/07. (So huge were these transfers, that B.C. actually had to re-pay an overpayment of $330 million in 2003/04.)
The New Democrats got a total of $125 million in equalization; Gordon Campbell's BC Liberals, a total of $2.4 billion. Which one did Good say made B.C. a "have-not" province?
In the end, there's one easy way to review Gordon Campbell's fiscal record. In 2001, when he became premier, Campbell "inherited" a $1.2 billion surplus from the defeated New Democrats. In 2011, when he bequeaths his office to his successor, he'll leave a shortfall of exactly the same size: $1.2 billion.
One of the giants? Did Gordon Campbell truly "transform" B.C.'s finances? Only if one lives in the fairly-tale, fantasy world of the mainstream media elites.
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"By Will McMartin, 8 Nov 2010, TheTyee.ca"
You've gotta start reading more than the Tyee, Chris....... They aren't going to say anything positive about anybody..... except the NDP. ;D
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"By Will McMartin, 8 Nov 2010, TheTyee.ca"
You've gotta start reading more than the Tyee, Chris....... They aren't going to say anything positive about anybody..... except the NDP. ;D
Don't you just hate it when all those nasty fiscal facts get in the way of a good political spin story?
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Don't you just hate it when all those nasty fiscal facts get in the way of a good political spin story?
Depends who is doing the spinning......
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Guest column: Working families being slammed by taxes in '11
By Gregory Thomas, for The Province January 6, 2011 Comments (3)
B.C. families face tough challenges making ends meet in 2011.
A suddenly hostile government in Victoria has unleashed a host of nasty hikes in payroll taxes and fees. Factor in the HST, the carbon tax, and rising Canada Pension Plan and Employment insurance deductions, and an average family of four with a couple of wage earners will be paying governments an extra $500 to $600.
This news is especially tough to stomach after the B.C. cabinet overturned the 15-per-cent personal income tax cut that was supposed to go into effect Jan. 1.
Politicians in Victoria should have got the hint that taxpayers were looking for some relief when more than half a million British Columbia voters signed the anti-HST petition.
They clearly didn't.
The B.C. government, under the leadership of Gordon Campbell, deserves tremendous credit for getting government off the back of business: with the introduction of the HST and the Jan. 1 general-business-tax cut, B.C. employers get a better tax deal on their capital than competitors in the U.S., Germany, Japan, Ontario, Quebec and even Korea. And we're neck and neck with Alberta and other HST provinces in Atlantic Canada.
But competitive tax rates for business shouldn't come with a Kegsized provincial deficit — $1.7 billion this year — and a swarm of tax bites, stings and grabs that have wage-earners reaching for the referendum repellent.
Just consider what we've had to put up with in the past 12 months: B.C. Hydro hiked electricity rates 7.3 per cent and plans to raise them another 10 per cent this year, a yearly jump of $84 for the average Hydro bill. Victoria expects to reap $608 million this year from B.C. Hydro, a hidden tax increase of 36 per cent from last year, when it collected $447 million. And in Metro Vancouver, the cost of monthly transit passes went up $96 a year for one-zone ($180 a year for three zones) — an 11-per-cent hike.
Pensioners got some good news from Ottawa. Canada Pension Plan benefits rose $25.83 a month from last year starting Jan. 1, to $960 a month, Old Age Security up $7.27 a month from a year earlier to $524.23. A couple getting the maximum annual CPP and OAS benefits are receiving $794.40 more annually from a year ago.
But the B.C. government raised Medical Service Plan premiums $84, or six per cent, to $1,308 annually per couple. And whether they forgot, or whether they planned to ignore it, the politicians in Victoria didn't bother to raise the income levels for premium assistance to keep pace with inflation this year.
So if a couple of pensioners happen to see their adjusted income rise above $30,000 because of the pension increase, their medical premiums will go up $328.80 this year — a 33-per-cent increase.
That kind of hike should put them in just the right frame of mind to be "the minister of finance for a day," as Premier Campbell put it, when HST referendum day rolls around.
Gregory Thomas is the B.C. communications director for the Canadian Taxpayers Federation.
Read more: http://www.theprovince.com/life/Guest+column+Working+families+being+slammed+taxes/4068261/story.html#ixzz1AIhBcSgc
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Just for you AF.....
http://thetyee.ca/Opinion/2011/01/10/BaloneyDetector/
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Just for you AF.....
http://thetyee.ca/Opinion/2011/01/10/BaloneyDetector/
When you have some time why don't you post the NDP record over the period they were in government so we can put the Liberal record in perspective.
Don't forget to include the little details about fast ferries, fudge-it budgets including transferring debt from provincial books to crown corporations, slowest growth in GDP for the province, premiers getting decks built in exchange for granting casino licenses, etc.
Oh and don't forget to include the data on how many jobs were lost over that period as a result of corporations moving out of the province and/or halting new investments due to the NDP's anti business, pro union stance.
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When you have some time why don't you post the NDP record over the period they were in government so we can put the Liberal record in perspective.
Don't forget to include the little details about fast ferries, fudge-it budgets including transferring debt from provincial books to crown corporations, slowest growth in GDP for the province, premiers getting decks built in exchange for granting casino licenses, etc.
Oh and don't forget to include the data on how many jobs were lost over that period as a result of corporations moving out of the province and/or halting new investments due to the NDP's anti business, pro union stance.
I see 22,000 jobs were lost in December, must have been the HST. ;D ;D
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No sense replying to 'alwaysfishing' and his lies, he is a neocon to the core.
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When you have some time why don't you post the NDP record over the period they were in government so we can put the Liberal record in perspective. What exactly does that have to do with the Liberal record? Poor governance is just that.
Don't forget to include the little details about fast ferries, fudge-it budgets including transferring debt from provincial books to crown corporations, slowest growth in GDP for the province, premiers getting decks built in exchange for granting casino licenses, etc.
Convention center, the last election "fudge it budget"(remember 495 million MAX?, raping Hydro, ICBC, etc for money for the coffers, premiers giving railroads to friends, giving IPP's away to friends - Do you really want me to post ALL of the corrupt acts of the Liberals?And where on the face of this green earth did you see that casino license actually granted? The Liberals just hand out cheques to casinos- that were solemnly sworn to not expand. Of course it makes more sense to give money to casinos while we STILL have the highest child poverty rate in the country .
Oh and don't forget to include the data on how many jobs were lost over that period as a result of corporations moving out of the province and/or halting new investments due to the NDP's anti business, pro union stance.
What did Chris post? Something about 22000 jobs lost...Lots of jobs at $8 an hour. Or 6 if you're just starting. I offer a challenge to you. You live for a month on the take home of $8 an hour and see how it is.Of course it's much easier to point a finger than actually see first hand.
Yeah AF - point to the sky to divert attention, ROFLOL - HILARIOUS! ::) ::) ::) ::)
Gord's serving martinis in the Ivory Tower- hurry up before he drinks them all.
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No sense replying to 'alwaysfishing' and his lies, he is a neocon to the core.
Always good to hear his views even though we may not agree with all of them.
Anyway he is a good angler. ;D ;D ;D
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Always good to hear his views even though we may not agree with all of them.
Anyway he is a good angler. ;D ;D ;D
There may be hope for him if we keep up with his education in the right direction and correct all those confused misconceptions. And DeFraser Institute him. Probably not, but we can only hope he comes out of the Gordoheroworship coma.:o ;D ;)
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No sense replying to 'alwaysfishing' and his lies, he is a neocon to the core.
By neocon I assume you mean neoconservative and I am flattered by the compliment. Suggesting that I lie is a considerable stretch that I'd like to challenge you to prove. If you can't prove it a simple apology would be acceptable.
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By neocon I assume you mean neoconservative and I am flattered by the compliment. Suggesting that I lie is a considerable stretch that I'd like to challenge you to prove. If you can't prove it a simple apology would be acceptable.
I'm sorry you're a neocon? ;D ;D ;D
Here's some good readin' fer ya AF- Dig in and enjoy!
http://lailayuile.com/100-reasons-gordon-campbell-must-go/
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The first person ever to be flattered to be called a neoconservative, I think... well, besides Ann Coulter...
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The first person ever to be flattered to be called a neoconservative, I think... well, besides Ann Coulter...
pees in a pod, birds of a feather, etc.... ;D
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Re: Is Campbell On The Way Out?
After thinking it all over for an extended period, I've reached the following conclusion - I may be wrong, but I don't think so.....
Probably ;)
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Gone for good.
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(http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t82/Willy1956/438643266_4c18db3477.jpg)