Fishing with Rod Discussion Forum
Fishing in British Columbia => General Discussion => Topic started by: dennisK on September 24, 2017, 05:30:56 PM
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So I spoke to a friend who was on the vedder Friday and the DFO was out checking licenses. He says he had his fishing license but was car pooling with buddies and he did not bring any photo id. DFO officer gave him ticket even though he had a fishing license. My friend is from the Philippines and his english is not best - but does this make any sense to anyone? Do you need both fishing license AND photo id? Thanks all
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As far as I know, you need to produce a valid fishing licence if asked. I've been checked by DFO and the checking officer asked for my birthdate and address to see if it is consistent with the licence I produced.
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I guess an angling license without ID could be just shared between several guys - you can print copies.
I never gave it much thought before but where does it say you must carry photo ID?
I usually do but not always have my wallet with me on the water but always have a copy of my FW license in my waders, vest , truck, boat and tackle bags.
Come to think of it, I have never been asked to produce photo ID with my FW license.
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... car pooling with buddies and he did not bring any photo id. DFO officer gave him ticket even though he had a fishing license.
Odd, never heard of this nor have ever been asked to produce ID in addition to the license. What was the actual violation cited on the ticket?
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Kinda makes sense u need photo I D, don't you think?
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Odd, never heard of this nor have ever been asked to produce ID in addition to the license. What was the actual violation cited on the ticket?
The violation was not having a valid fishing license. This guy I work with and he's totally legit. He just did not have id since there were 4 of them carpooling and he's a terrible driver lol.
But yeah - bizarre.
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I have never been asked to produce ID when being checked.
Is your friend a non resident or is he actually a Canadian who lives in BC? Small shot but I'm asking if somehow he got issued the wrong license?
Not sure how he can be cited for not having a license if he produced one? Easy to fight this one what's the date of issue on the license?
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sport fishing guide under understand your licence---- must be produced if requested by a fishery officer,conservation officer. or fishing guardian (keep your licence with you while fishing and transporting your catch).
I have never been asked for any id in 40 yrs of fishing. fight it in court if you produced your licence.they will probably drop it before it gets that far.
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BC conservation officers have been on the flow quite consistently this year checking licenses. Have not seen any DFO officers on the vedder yet but with the license....never been asked for I.D. I guess he can contest that if he wants to. My cell phone wallet has several sleeves so having I.D is never an issue for me anyway. Sounds like like he was targeted a little harshly from the officers.
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BC conservation officers have been on the flow quite consistently this year checking licenses. Have not seen any DFO officers on the vedder yet but with the license....never been asked for I.D. I guess he can contest that if he wants to. My cell phone wallet has several sleeves so having I.D is never an issue for me anyway. Sounds like like he was targeted a little harshly from the officers.
I almost said I wonder if he was stereotyped... but wasn't sure i wanted to go there. I'm pretty sure the officer would be more professional then that. These guys deal with dirt bags from every ethnic background.
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The violation was not having a valid fishing license.
I think he should contest it, if he can afford the time.
Also something doesnt make sense. If he didnt have any ID, thenwho was the ticket issued to and how did the officer verify the name/address info. Did he cite the angler# or similar on the ticket? If so your friend should be able to easily demonstrate that the license was valid.
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Maybe he had a fishing license but didn't have it on him at the time he was asked to produce it. Then when he was asked for photo ID he didn't have that on him either. I'm thinking your friend has won himself an expensive lesson if he couldn't produce the fishing license when asked. I think the photo ID was just to ensure the CO got the name and address correct on the ticket.
There will be no mercy on the river.
No fish for him.
Personally I think there should be a grace period of time where the individual must produce the ticket at the CO office like they way it used to be. I guess the fine is to stop wasting CO's time in the field and at the office.
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You need photo ID for hunting with your license or tags now, don't see why it would be different for fishing, but they may not ask for photo ID all the time,it's up to the officer.
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Always need both. I've been asked to prove my ID along with my license a few times over the years.
In the chuck, and in the fresh. Even ice fishing on Tunkwa a couple years ago. The license means nothing if it can't be corroborated.
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You need photo ID for hunting with your license or tags now, don't see why it would be different for fishing, but they may not ask for photo ID all the time,it's up to the officer.
Makes sense. ID is good to have when a CO or RCMP sees you have a firearm or bow with you.
It won't be long before we all have a readable ID chip imbedded under our skin or retina scan for official tracking or verification. buy a license and the info gets uploaded to your readable database. Then they can scan you from above by drones or even satellite. Maybe they already can. Did you ever get a dental filling? Do you ever experience ringing in your ears? All possible signs you may be tracked without your knowledge.
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Makes sense. ID is good to have when a CO or RCMP sees you have a firearm or bow with you.
It won't be long before we all have a readable ID chip imbedded under our skin or retina scan for official tracking or verification. buy a license and the info gets uploaded to your readable database. Then they can scan you from above by drones or even satellite. Maybe they already can. Did you ever get a dental filling? Do you ever experience ringing in your ears? All possible signs you may be tracked without your knowledge.
Ok now, time to put the pipe down and breath some air, 😂
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Makes sense. ID is good to have when a CO or RCMP sees you have a firearm or bow with you.
It won't be long before we all have a readable ID chip imbedded under our skin or retina scan for official tracking or verification. buy a license and the info gets uploaded to your readable database. Then they can scan you from above by drones or even satellite. Maybe they already can. Did you ever get a dental filling? Do you ever experience ringing in your ears? All possible signs you may be tracked without your knowledge.
I hear voices in my head...does that count? ???
Staying on topic, the fishing license means nothing without proof of residence (Govt. Issued ID). I was checked three times in my 16 years fishing in Canada. Two times I was asked to produce ID. The CO was following procedure.
Your buddy is SOL.
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I have been checked numerous times by both CO, DFO and even the RCMP. Not once have I been asked to produce ID
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Ok now, time to put the pipe down and breath some air, 😂
;D ;D ;D
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Interesting. I reviewed both the freshwater regulations synopsis and the tidal sportfishing guide. Both make mention (in almost the same wording) of needing to produce a license if requested by an officer, but no mention of also needing to produce ID. Maybe it's located in the actual Acts or Regulations, and not in the synopsis or guide, but that would be surprising. Sounds like there's more to this than meets the eye and as DanL said, it would be interesting to find out what section of the act or regs he was cited to be in violation of.
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What if you do not have a driver's license?
Does this mean you can not fish or hunt?
I think that that is bogus!
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What if you do not have a driver's license?
Does this mean you can not fish or hunt?
I think that that is bogus!
Don't be childish. You have to have government issued ID. Nobody said it has to be a driver's license. It can be a BC service card, health card, PR card or passport.
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The purpose of asking anglers to produce a photo ID with the licence is to ensure non-residents are not buying licences for residents.
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Makes sense. ID is good to have when a CO or RCMP sees you have a firearm or bow with you.
It won't be long before we all have a readable ID chip imbedded under our skin or retina scan for official tracking or verification. buy a license and the info gets uploaded to your readable database. Then they can scan you from above by drones or even satellite. Maybe they already can. Did you ever get a dental filling? Do you ever experience ringing in your ears? All possible signs you may be tracked without your knowledge.
Are you the guy I see drinking the water out of mill lake while he's fishing?
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From passed ecperience, though not exactly the same as this, thr ticket should be for failure to produce ID not fishing without a license. To seperate charges. I woukd fight it.
But as others have said, the intent is to show residency. But it raises a valid question. I have all sorts of ID without my address on it (passport, birth certificate, PAL, and other stuff) that is legal. What would happen if, say if bought a bc residents license as well as salmon/steelhead tags but only had my passport. The difference between a residents cost and a non residents is close to $100.
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Who brings a passport fishing ? ;)
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Unfortunately it is written somewhere on the synopsis. I remember coming across it when I purchased my tidal license online. I think though they should have it written directly on the license if they deem it mandatory.... also the ticket should be allowed to be retracted or reduced upon proof of id at a later date....They do it with the driver's license so why not with fishing.
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A few years back had to show my license ....forgot to sign it.
CO had me sign it...then asked for Drivers Lic. ....he stated it was "to compare signatures....anyone could have printed this".
He checked and was on his way..
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If he had no ID, then is hard to prove the license belonged to him.
The way I would think/hope it goes is.... the CO is hedging a bet.
No ID so the CO gives a ticket for fishing without license.... you prove it was you later and it gets reduced or voided... If one produced a license and no ID because they knew the ID would not match....then they are by default.. busted.
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Who brings a passport fishing ? ;)
Us 'Mericans! That's who! I have been asked for ID with my fishing license before, but I always assumed it was because I was a non-resident (although considering I am already purchasing the most expensive license, it wouldn't be to make sure I am buying the correct fishing license). I have also been asked for my fishing license when crossing the border.
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Who brings a passport fishing ? ;)
Actuallt an old girlfriend of mine. She didn't drive but travelled a lot for work so in most cases her only form of ID was a passport. But my question was more, what is stop someone from say Alberta driving buying a residents license and tags then producing a passport when asked for ID. Now I don't think this is a major problem but a lot more has been done to save $100.
Eitherway, I would fight this ticket as the charge, fishing without a license doesn't apply.
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The purpose of asking anglers to produce a photo ID with the licence is to ensure non-residents are not buying licences for residents.
Maybe the reverse Rodney? :)
Frank
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I did a bit of digging (because I'm a nerd!) and sure enough, it is an offense to not produce ID.
You need to keep mind that the freshwater fishing regulations synopsis is just that, a synopsis. It's a summary of the regulations, it's not the regulations themselves. If you want to understand the synopsis fully, you need to dig back into the regulations themselves and the underlying act.
The synopsis says that "you must carry your license while sportfishing....under the Wildlife Act"
The Wildlife Act http://www.bclaws.ca/Recon/document/ID/freeside/00_96488_01#section12 (http://www.bclaws.ca/Recon/document/ID/freeside/00_96488_01#section12) prescribes that you need a license to fish in non-tidal waters in section 12. In section 97 it states the license holders must state their name and address and produce prescribed photo identification.
To learn more about how the act is applied, you go to the Wildlife Act General Regulations. http://www.bclaws.ca/civix/document/id/complete/statreg/340_82/search/CIVIX_DOCUMENT_ROOT_STEM:(%22photo%20identification%22)%20AND%20CIVIX_DOCUMENT_ANCESTORS:reg96488?1#hit1
(http://www.bclaws.ca/civix/document/id/complete/statreg/340_82/search/CIVIX_DOCUMENT_ROOT_STEM:(%22photo%20identification%22)%20AND%20CIVIX_DOCUMENT_ANCESTORS:reg96488?1#hit1) In section 20.04 you learn more about what is "prescribed photo identification".
Interesting. So it is a violation to not produce photo ID, even if it is not readily apparent in the synopsis.
Sometimes, I lock my wallet in my glove box and just take along my license. Now, I'll be tucking "prescribed photo ID" into that baggie.
We're hearing this second hand from the OP, and so it's all speculation, as to what violation of the act/regulations was cited, but to answer the OP's question, yes, you need to produce both a license and photo ID, if requested by an officer.
And just when I thought I might not learn anything new this week :)
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I did a bit of digging (because I'm a nerd!) and sure enough, it is an offense to not produce ID.
Thank you clarki. Education rules!
Actuallt an old girlfriend of mine. She didn't drive but travelled a lot for work so in most cases her only form of ID was a passport. But my question was more, what is stop someone from say Alberta driving buying a residents license and tags then producing a passport when asked for ID. Now I don't think this is a major problem but a lot more has been done to save $100.
A passport is NOT proof of citizenship within the country of issuance. It only becomes proof of citizenship when you travel abroad.
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To the letter of the law, you can actually be detained (read jail) until such time as you can prove who you are. I thought that most people would consider carrying their ID with them a no brainer.
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Blair is our recent regulation expert so hopefully he chimes in soon in CAPs and colorful writing.
I also have never been asked to provide photo ID. I am sure your friend got wrongfully stereo typed.
Personally I would say just pay the 100$ fine. For me the stress of dealing with court, having to take days off from work ect are just not worth it.
If not have a look though the act, I could not see anything about needing to have valid ID. However I am pretty sure you can have all your fishing gear seized if you cant produce a valid ID and you can be detained the police can be called and then you have to deal with them. You are also required to provide them with accurate details such as your address or you can be charge with obstruction of justice.
http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/SOR-96-137/ (http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/SOR-96-137/) British Columbia Sport Fishing Regulations
http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/f-14/ (http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/f-14/) Fisheries Act
http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/SOR-93-53/ (http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/SOR-93-53/) Fishery (General) Regulations
Inspection
49 (1) Subject to subsection (2), for the purpose of ensuring compliance with this Act and the regulations, a fishery officer or fishery guardian may enter and inspect any place, including any premises, vessel or vehicle, in which the officer or guardian believes on reasonable grounds there is any work or undertaking or any fish or other thing in respect of which this Act or the regulations apply and may
(a) open any container that the officer or guardian believes on reasonable grounds contains any fish or other thing in respect of which this Act or the regulations apply;
(b) examine any fish or other thing that the officer or guardian finds and take samples of it;
(c) conduct any tests or analyses and take any measurements; and
(d) require any person to produce for examination or copying any records, books of account or other documents that the officer or guardian believes on reasonable grounds contain information that is relevant to the administration of this Act or the regulations.
Your Photo Id I would also say is relevant to enforcing part D
PS: i was writing this while Clarki posted, The thing is im pretty sure you can fight and win because the officer did not cite the correct part of the ACT. You had a valid fishing licence
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The purpose of asking anglers to produce a photo ID with the licence is to ensure non-residents are not buying licences for residents.
From this perspective (or rather vice versa, a resident buying a cheaper license for a visitor), and the OP says the guy's english is not very good maybe that's what happened.
Routine license check, guy cant answer officer's questions very well due to language barrier. Officer asked for ID for which he isnt carrying = red flag.
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Blair is our recent regulation expert so hopefully he chimes in soon in CAPs and colorful writing.
Blair is NO LONGER with us. He was cited for being in violation of FWR section 2.8. The penalty was applied SWIFTLY and JUDICIOUSLY.
Not doubt he is reading this as a guest, and just vibrating.
The thing is im pretty sure you can fight and win because the officer did not cite the correct part of the ACT. You had a valid fishing licence
Officers are pretty good a citing acts and regs. It's a core competency for their job. We're hearing this second hand. Maybe the fishing license wasn't valid (maybe he didn't sign it?)...
But is fun to engage in shameless speculation. :)
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But is fun to engage in shameless speculation. :)
It's true we don't no if they signed it? if they had the correct licence residence or non residence, Tidal vs no tidal ect..
However, Lets assume everything on the licence was correct and it was valid. Did the officer correctly site the act?
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Thank you clarki. Education rules!
A passport is NOT proof of citizenship within the country of issuance. It only becomes proof of citizenship when you travel abroad.
Totally off topic but interesting. It appears you are right about passports not bring proof of citizenship within Canada. I find that odd as I recently purchased property and used my passport as proof because a DL doesn't cut it.
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K, I'll carry my birth certificate in a ziplock bag in my wader pouch.
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A passport isn't a prove of citizenship in Canada,I would post the write up but have no idea how to lol, go to the government site.That being said, I'm sure if you pulled your passport out the Co is going to use it as prof.
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Documents Canada accepts as proof of citizenship
http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/citizenship/documents.asp
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K, I'll carry my birth certificate in a ziplock bag in my wader pouch.
A birth certificate is not photo ID.
A passport isn't a prove of citizenship in Canada,I would post the write up but have no idea how to lol, go to the government site.That being said, I'm sure if you pulled your passport out the Co is going to use it as prof.
Yes a passport is one of "prescribed photo identification" as it is photo ID issued by the gov't of Canada. For myself, I think I'll start carrying my PAL with me. It's federally issued photo ID and in case of accident, I value it less than my BC enhanced driver's license
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K, I'll carry my birth certificate in a ziplock bag in my wader pouch.
C'mon now. Citizenship has nothing to do with your fishing license.
Not all BC residents are Canadians, nor are all Canadians BC residents.
Just carry your DL or Service Card with you. That's all it takes to prove you are a BC resident angler, which is what the OP's friend wasn't able to do and, as a result, got ticketed for it.
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I'd carry my DL over my PAL, lol, it's Easyer to get a DL
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I lived in Calgary for 2 years when i would visit family here i would have to get a canadian citizen not bc resident license, big cost difference between the 2 licenses so i can understand why they would give you that ticket. it also states you have to have your i.d. on your fishing license. A PAL does not have your address on it so it would not work, its a Canada i.d. not b.c.
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Hey very true, I just looked and no address, I didn't even think of that.
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it also states you have to have your i.d. on your fishing license.
I am looking at my non tidal license (e-license issued) right now, and see no mention of the ID requirement. Where are you seeing that?
. A PAL does not have your address on it so it would not work, its a Canada i.d. not b.c.
If you refer to the Wildlife Act and Regulations that I posted earlier, there is no requirement to produce ID with an address. You are required: (1) to be able to state your name and address and (2) to produce photo ID that was issued by the gov't of Canada or your province of residence. A PAL is Canadian gov't issued ID so it would be acceptable.
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This isn't a legal point, but any time you go somewhere these days, whether out for a trail walk with friends or even if you happen to be fishing a crowded, low water area, be sure to carry ID on your person. There are many reasons why from a lot of angles
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...be sure to carry ID on your person. There are many reasons why from a lot of angles
I always carry my ID on me in case I fall over and die. It'll help people figure out who to notify. Cheery thoughts :D
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Are you the guy I see drinking the water out of mill lake while he's fishing?
Mmmmm - brackish. :P
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You should carry your bc services card. I bumped my head bleeding all over my clothes, as soon as I went to emergency they wouldn't even check me in without it or a credit card. Blood dripping at the checking desk....on the seat... etc..
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I'd carry my DL over my PAL, lol, it's Easyer to get a DL
--I don't like using the PAL for id, don't want to give an excuse for a strip search for weapons. I have a fishing vest made or at least marketed in USA, which has a concealed carry pocket in it. I thought it would be a good place to securely carry a bulky wallet... just don't reach for it to fast in front of people with real guns.
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Blair is NO LONGER with us. He was cited for being in violation of FWR section 2.8. The penalty was applied SWIFTLY and JUDICIOUSLY.
Not doubt he is reading this as a guest, and just vibrating.
Just here to say thank you for this, clarki. Unexpected laughs.
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it also states you have to have your i.d. on your fishing license.
I can't find that on either licence, could you show me where it is? Or only Yukon or NWT licences either.
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I always carry my ID on me in case I fall over and die. It'll help people figure out who to notify. Cheery thoughts :D
Considering my age and deteriorating "athleticism", I'd say it makes more and more sense every year that goes past. ::)
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I think it is time to put this topic to rest....
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I think it is time to put this topic to rest....
I was resting quite nicely until you woke me up.
Signed: The topic
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Having worked with people in frequent 'conflict with the law' I can't believe that people would seriously go out without proper ID. Ask any of them for id when required and they don't have any. It's obvious why; negates the phony alias.
If your objective is to be regarded with high suspicion during any contact with Police etc - just continue. I won't even walk around the block without my id.
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A birth certificate is not photo ID.
Yes a passport is one of "prescribed photo identification" as it is photo ID issued by the gov't of Canada. For myself, I think I'll start carrying my PAL with me. It's federally issued photo ID and in case of accident, I value it less than my BC enhanced driver's license
until some of the security improvements brought on by 9-11, Passports were not considered terribly reliable as they were easily produced via counterfeit means. At that time they would not, for example get you admitted into any high security institution whereas a DL or Provincial Id would provided it was backed by a 2nd piece of id.