Fishing with Rod Discussion Forum
Fishing in British Columbia => General Discussion => Topic started by: chris gadsden on September 21, 2015, 04:18:53 AM
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I know it is like kicking a dead horse but when checking the Vedder yesterday morning to check some garbage bags that are placed out there it was so sad to see the way the pinks are being treated.
Many were hauled way up on the rocks and sand and then put back in the water, especially the bucks as some people were just looking for does and their roe and so many anglers just linning and snagging them in the less than ideal water conditions.
I know this will never change now,education may help a few but who is going to do that, anyway there is too many of them to fit in a classroom, a sad state of affairs continue with the recreational sector.
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There are so many cretins fishing these days,I agree. unfortunately budget for DFO officers is low and there is no way to curb such behaviour.
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I can't understand why the ethics on the Vedder seem so much lower than on other rivers.
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It's not just the vedder. Say something to these people.
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Grip it and rip it season is in full swing, thats for sure. Last week I stopped by the crossing and the whole far beach was just a rip fest, pulling pinks in by the back and tail and bonking them.
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Chris
As we discussed, the Vedder River should be non-retention for pinks, sockeye and chum. This would go a long way in curbing some of the ongoing problems. Why DFO opened this fishery in the first place is a mystery. Enforcement seems to be of little importance and it is not up to anglers who are fishing properly to enforce the rules. One could be in
confrontation with fishermen all day long which doesn't make an enjoyable outing.
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It's insane , I drove past Flood Hope Saturday . Seen at least 100 + floosers on the bar in the Fraser >:(
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It's disgusting! Went out sat am (I usually stay away on the weekends) and the total lack of respect for the fishery, the surroundings or anything for that matter is appalling.i was there for 1.5hrs and witnessed full on snagging, dragging across rocks kicking back in, I yelled across river at two young guys (20-25) snagging 5-10 ft from shore, people keeping everything they hooked and on my way out came across a bag in bushes with 4 pinks rotting away. I called rapp and was told "well there's a lot of pinks in the system" like that somehow makes it ok... Brutal state
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So many people just dont give a crap. Leave your cupcakes on the river, snag and kick back fish, slit fish for roe and throw in the bush, get called on for doing an illegal act and your the one told to fu ck off. Some people...
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I can't understand why the ethics on the Vedder seem so much lower than on other rivers.
Its all about numbers thats why. Biggest hartchery produced river in the lower mainland. Plus the easy access to the river. Hence the reason I rarely ever fish it.
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Saw a guy rip the gills out of one side of a pink on the Vedder a week back and toss the fish onto the ground and walk away to carry on fishing, while the fish flopped around and slowly bleed out on the beach. I asked him if I could bonk the fish to put it out of its misery and was told to F##king mind my own business. I now know why some angles give up on rivers like the Vedder. It's tough to stomach. :( >:(
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tell me about it was walking a trail with my shepard today by a small spawning creek. when i saw this guy snagging salmon right at the mouth poor pinks. went on the hatchery website and saw that this year was the first in 10 years a pink salmon school had come in good numbers. I reported him and the officer said we will try to get someone down there in the next few hours . waited 30 min went up to the man and first thing he said exuse me im fishing here ur in casting way and thats when i noticed a treble hook.
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Confronting people on the river can always be a dicey situation, but as fishing community members we all need to say something to try and educate people. It really is sad to hear stories and see first hand what goes on out on the river.
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I agreed that DFO should close the pink and chum fishery. Most of these fish are not edible anyways when they get up to the Vedder.
It will reduce many of the SNAGGERS. They will not want to fish for coho because its not so easy to snag them and someone is bound to scream at them for doing it.
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Its hard to talk to people; everyone thinks there a "pro" fisherman. its even harder to talk to people when you're 17 years old.... nobody wants to listen.
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Confronting people on the river can always be a dicey situation, but as fishing community members we all need to say something to try and educate people. It really is sad to hear stories and see first hand what goes on out on the river.
well said
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Ive seen a kid snagging fish just to catch a fish i went over and told him not gonna report you but buddy ill setup ur rod for float fishing. gave him a jig and put a nice float and bam was hitting chums like crazy
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Good on you man! I've offered to do the same for others on the river and they always appreciate it. Someone did that for me once and it got me started down the right path. I've found that people are generally appreciative when I inform them of ways to not snag fish. My goal this year is to do at least one positive thing for the river and fish each time I go out, be it picking up garbage or educating noobs.
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I was fishing couple weeks ago at the canal and a well dressed fly fisher walked in with his kid. Looked like a decent fly fisher when he started to cast but I was flabbergasted when the kid started to snag pinks. He had a long leader and at the end of each drift he would yank on the rod. Fish was coming hooked at the tail and back but the fly fisher dad did nothing to change his behaviour.
I just did not think it was my place to teach a kid how to fish with his flyfisher dad around.
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... was told to F##king mind my own business.
In my dreams this would be a great time to be an undercover CO.
"Excuse me sir, I believe retaining foul hooked fish is not permitted. You should probably release that fish."
"Go EFF yourself and mind your own *$^&$'ing business" -BONK
*flashes badge*
"Come with me sir, we're going to have a nice chat with some of my colleagues. And gather up your gear, you wont be needing it anymore."
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Hahah that would be awesome
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Yes things are bad. And while I do admire people that say something to these losers without actual enforcement little will change.
Having more closures to retention will go along way to reducing this behaviour and the numbers of people fishing this way and managers could do this by acknowledging the impact on the stocks that a large number of people snagging 20 or 30 fish in a day can have.
Also it might be beneficial as well because it will bring out more people on the river who don't just fish to snag and kill.
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does anyone think it was any different when just coho and springs were open? You want people to do this exclusively to those species? Oh wait the fall white springs are introduced & were never native so it would be just coho to get such fine treatment.
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The river is easy to access, cheap to fish, allowed to keep fish, hence the you get all the riff riff from everywhere around lining its banks. I take my son down to watch the spectacle to teach him how not to fish. It's very educational for him.
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Having more closures to retention will go along way to reducing this behaviour and the numbers of people fishing this way and managers could do this by acknowledging the impact on the stocks that a large number of people snagging 20 or 30 fish in a day can have.
This defeats the entire purpose of the Vedder... Its a fishery meant to give opportunites to large volumes of people from the Lower Mainland, sell licenses, and so on. The pink fishery probably helps taper the crowds for later in the season anyways. Let them get their pinks..lots of kids out there enjoying the pinks too.
That said, more enforcement/ethics could go a long way. My feeling is its kind of open season on the Vedder and enforcement dont even bother with it for the most part.
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#pinklivesmatter
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#pinklivesmatter
;D awesome
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This defeats the entire purpose of the Vedder... Its a fishery meant to give opportunites to large volumes of people from the Lower Mainland, sell licenses, and so on. The pink fishery probably helps taper the crowds for later in the season anyways. Let them get their pinks..lots of kids out there enjoying the pinks too.
That said, more enforcement/ethics could go a long way. My feeling is its kind of open season on the Vedder and enforcement dont even bother with it for the most part.
I disagree on the "helps taper crowds" part... I wouls be willing to bet a lot of people will be drawn into fishing from the pink fishery and then transfer the habits/ways of "fishing" they learned to other species later. As did IMO the sockeye harvest last year
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Make the Vedder (below the crossing) fly fishing only Sept 1st to 30th ... at least, preferably till Oct 15th. That solve the problem. Absolutely guaranteed. 8)
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Make the Vedder (below the crossing) fly fishing only Sept 1st to 30th ... at least, preferably till Oct 15th. That solve the problem. Absolutely guaranteed. 8)
That's a great idea, but I'm a fly fisherman at heart. ;)
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and make it spey-only 8)
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I think I'm becoming one...
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Of course some use fly chucking as a great flossing tool, we all know that. :-X :o ::)
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Of course some use fly chucking as a great flossing tool, we all know that. :-X :o ::)
those who don't do it know all about it eh Chris ?... wink wink say no more say no more
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Of course some use fly chucking as a great flossing tool, we all know that. :-X :o ::)
It can be tiring throwing a Betty all day. Relaxing with a Deep 6 line and a clouser sounds like a dream. More effective, and you look good to boot. What more can a person ask for.
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I think Zackattack hit the nail on the head about the Vedder.
I had the opportunity to tour the upper Vedder with someone from the salmonid enhancement program earlier this year and was told that all the habitat creation works along the river have doubled the number of pinks returning over the last 20 years, as well as increasing other runs substantially.
The impression I got was that DFO is mandated to provide recreational opportunities in this region (including retention) and the strategy so far has included focusing fishing pressure on the Vedder because it is already urbanized and degraded, has decades of data available, and has heavily augmented conditions that essentially guarantee continued viable populations.
I'm not sure whether this strategy encourages more people to fish all season and elsewhere, or satisfies some fishing angst that would otherwise be directed at more vulnerable fisheries, but I think the strategy is a good way to provide recreational fishing opportunities nonetheless.
Of course more enforcement and education would be better (and DFO knows this), but our current federal government has eliminated that possibility through budget cuts in 2012 and 2013. Maybe next year... ::)
P.S. If you ever get a chance to walk through the trails around the fish habitat works it's absolutely gorgeous, textbook perfect spawning habitat stretching many kilometers. 8)
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It can be tiring throwing a Betty all day. Relaxing with a Deep 6 line and a clouser sounds like a dream. More effective, and you look good to boot. What more can a person ask for.
A Clouser is a jig - how many flossers use jigs? So here you give the wisdom of a man in a plaid suit and sports a tacky moustache.
Most people are too witless to realize I am far from serious about restricting the V-C to FF only. Point is drift anglers are more elitist and interested in getting more of their pie than fly anglers have ever been.
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Most people are too witless to realize I am far from serious about restricting the V-C to FF only. Point is drift anglers are more elitist and interested in getting more of their pie than fly anglers have ever been.
You're a walking talking oxymoron.
Fly anglers are far more elitist than drift anglers.
You are correct on the bigger piece of the pie though.
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A Clouser is a jig - how many flossers use jigs? So here you give the wisdom of a man in a plaid suit and sports a tacky moustache.
Most people are too witless to realize I am far from serious about restricting the V-C to FF only. Point is drift anglers are more elitist and interested in getting more of their pie than fly anglers have ever been.
Funny, I have fished across North America, used various size Clouser Minnows for everything from salmon and trout to bass, as well as several other species. Fished with people from all over to. I have never seen anyone jig a clouser. They are always rapidly stripped in, sort of like a snagging motion but instead of the rod you use your arm. How would you use it as a jig? I am genuinely curious!
P.S. But I do love plaid. If you have a source for these jackets I am all ears.
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A clouser minnow with a small split shot tied 1 ft above is deadly for pinks on a spinning rod. Jigging the clouser( in a similar way as stripping a fly in) caught me 30+ pinks this season in the lower with only 4 or 5 snags. Works a charm, get em in the top lip most times to.
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Funny, I have fished across North America, used various size Clouser Minnows ... They are always rapidly stripped in, sort of like a snagging motion but instead of the rod you use your arm.
I guess I do it wrong then.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M7HycFnH26U
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You're a walking talking oxymoron.
Fly anglers are far more elitist than drift anglers.
You are correct on the bigger piece of the pie though.
LOL - perhaps you should check Oxford's for the definition of oxymoron, you maroon! ;D
In the last 3 months we have seen at least 2 suggestions from gear anglers intending solely to get what they see as riffraff off 'their' streams. That's elitism.
About 15 years ago a fairly well known fly fisherman, very involved in fish conservation that had them dealing with leaders drift & gear fishing commented to me that such people were as elitist if not more so than fly anglers - they just couldn't figure out that elitism doesn't just apply to other people.
Problems with fish handling are older than Mr Gadsden himself. They are also exaggerated.
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I guess I do it wrong then.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M7HycFnH26U
Not saying you are wrong, I was genuinely curious as to how one jigs a clouser minnow. It was designed to be stripped fairly aggressively. All of my clousers are a lot thinner and more tapered than my salmon jigs, with the eye of the hook facing forward rather then up. I will admit my jigging experience is limited, but I didn't think that a jigging motion would impart the proper action on a clouser minnow. Thanks to Howlongsyourleader for the example. I will try it.
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I believe that clousers with big weighted eyes, particularly those located close to the hook eye (as opposed to the middle of the shank), when stripped quickly with short abrupt strips, will tend to mimic the up and down flutter of a jig cast directly from the rod, rather than under a float.
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any weight near the eye be a bead, a cone head, dumbbell eyes or some good wraps of lead will produce a rise and fall action when stripped. Like a jig it's all a matter of how fast it's stripped and the length of the pause. You can try and observe this in any clear water.
Tylsie's example - if someone casts a deep 6 clouser minnow across and down how will a fish get flossed? More likely to snag something in the vedder packed as it is with salmon than floss anything.
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I think Zackattack hit the nail on the head about the Vedder.
I had the opportunity to tour the upper Vedder with someone from the salmonid enhancement program earlier this year and was told that all the habitat creation works along the river have doubled the number of pinks returning over the last 20 years, as well as increasing other runs substantially.
The impression I got was that DFO is mandated to provide recreational opportunities in this region (including retention) and the strategy so far has included focusing fishing pressure on the Vedder because it is already urbanized and degraded, has decades of data available, and has heavily augmented conditions that essentially guarantee continued viable populations.
I'm not sure whether this strategy encourages more people to fish all season and elsewhere, or satisfies some fishing angst that would otherwise be directed at more vulnerable fisheries, but I think the strategy is a good way to provide recreational fishing opportunities nonetheless.
Of course more enforcement and education would be better (and DFO knows this), but our current federal government has eliminated that possibility through budget cuts in 2012 and 2013. Maybe next year... ::)
P.S. If you ever get a chance to walk through the trails around the fish habitat works it's absolutely gorgeous, textbook perfect spawning habitat stretching many kilometers. 8)
Good post Byronnn; I certainly agree the habitat created in the upper river has increased salmonid populations and the same is happening now on the flood plain along the lower river. What channels/areas did you tour? Good to read posts from someone who advocates for fish ;)
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Hey Dave,
I uploaded some of the photos I took on the tour, with GPS coordinates.
http://imgur.com/a/XxAgJ (http://imgur.com/a/XxAgJ)
The best place to access most of the works is on the Trans Canada Trail, the few kilometers going east starting from the intersection of Chilliwack Lake Road and the Foley Creek FSR. I don't remember too many of the names, but Centennial channel, Anderson pond, and something with Mushroom in the name stand out. There's a few signs along the way with maps, dates, and names of the spots.
I bet it would be a great walk anytime now through December, must be tons of fish in there!
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I have never heard of this habitat restoration, very cool.
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Hey Dave,
I uploaded some of the photos I took on the tour, with GPS coordinates.
http://imgur.com/a/XxAgJ (http://imgur.com/a/XxAgJ)
The best place to access most of the works is on the Trans Canada Trail, the few kilometers going east starting from the intersection of Chilliwack Lake Road and the Foley Creek FSR. I don't remember too many of the names, but Centennial channel, Anderson pond, and something with Mushroom in the name stand out. There's a few signs along the way with maps, dates, and names of the spots.
I bet it would be a great walk anytime now through December, must be tons of fish in there!
I know all these areas very well! Is the Mushroom Channel perhaps AngelWing? If so, that channel is first class coho habitat. Whatever, they are all marvelous walks at any time of the year but if you want a true dead salmon smell experience, go up to Centennial Channel in about 10 days ... thousands and thousands of dead pinks, some with their brains removed by bears, lol!
Do a search on this site for steelhead enumerations by a few of us locals, Centennial Channel is mentioned many times.
Looking forward to your future posts ..
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we took our kids to the keith Wilson bridge found a parking spot get out of the car and someone dumped all there garbage right on the bank its really quite sad how some treat our recreational areas
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Yup, it's bad all over but the good news is the Chilliwack Vedder River Cleanup Society will be cleaning this area on Sunday. See Chris's earlier post and come on out and help!
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Today I saw a person drag a fish up on the rocks, then with his foot move it back into the water, too lazy to bend down I guess.
I had a short talk with him and said in the future, keep the fish in the water if you are not retaining it.
His reply"Okay." I was a little stern with him maybe I should have been more polite but it makes one angry to see so this going on.
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Today I saw a person drag a fish up on the rocks, then with his foot move it back into the water, too lazy to bend down I guess.
I had a short talk with him and said in the future, keep the fish in the water if you are not retaining it.
His reply"Okay." I was a little stern with him maybe I should have been more polite but it makes one angry to see so this going on.
Good on you Chris, always start out polite though.
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Good on you Chris, always start out polite though.
Getting crappy at 72 and 50 years of marriage.lol
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Getting crappy at 72 and 50 years of marriage.lol
I bet you are a little crabby too :)
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I bet you are a little crabby too :)
He meant to flip those P's... ;)
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He meant to flip those P's... ;)
That "Depends"
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Getting crappy at 72 and 50 years of marriage.lol
Just ask Mrs Gadsden... :- ;D