Fishing with Rod Discussion Forum
Fishing in British Columbia => General Discussion => Topic started by: Spawn Sack on August 11, 2015, 11:17:08 PM
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Hoping someone might help me troubleshoot some fish finder issues I'm having.
So the jet boat we bought last week came with a Eagle Fish Mark 480. Not really my dream f/f, but plan is to leave it on for a year or two as there are some higher priority accessories we want before we replace a fish finder that already works. Down the road I'd like a bigger, color, GPS model.
Anyway, when we test drove the boat I'm pretty sure it worked fine. Honestly wasn't paying a lot of attention to it as it appeared to be working properly which was good enough for me.
We have had the boat out twice. Just on local lakes as we want to get more comfortable with it, esp loading and unloading, before we hit the river. Our previous boat was a 12 foot dinky boat.
Anyway, so the fish finder is doing something funky. Most of the time it will read "0.0" as the depth and not show anything on the screen. Sometimes it will read a depth but stay locked on that depth as you move, and sometimes (maybe 10% of the time) it works fine, shows the changing depth, contours/structure of the bottom, fish, etc.
It does the same intermittent thing regardless if the motor is on, off, idling, cruising, or wide open. I know the lower end fish finders typically will fail to read the proper depth at high speeds, but I certainly expect it to work at lower speeds, and especially with no motor running!! >:(
It is getting power fine, that is not the issue. I'm thinking something is up with the transducer? I've tried cleaning it and adjusting the angle up and down a bit and it has not helped.
Does anyone have any other ideas how to fix this? The unit is the same vintage as the boat (2011).
My only other experience with a fish finder is with my Hummingbird portable clamp on style which works perfect every time. Just not suitable for this boat.
My wife thinks it is because the transducer is mounted rather close to the jet. Like maybe 8 inches to the right of the center of the transom. Other boats I've seen it is mounted closer the SIDE of the boat. I can see this being a valid argument if the issues started up when the motor climbed in RPM and made more turbulence in the water. However it does the same thing with the motor OFF so surely this can not be blamed on bubbles in the water.
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This may or may not work.
Make sure the transducer bottom is flat or even with the water. ( if the current moved it a bit to an angle it will not work properly )
When it is "acting up" hit the power button & turn it off & then restart.
Should work properly afterwords.
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If that doesn't work, I would look online for a new transducer. If I remember right, they aren't that expensive and are actually pretty easy to change. Would allow you to get by until you get your dream machine.
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I would make sure all the cables are plugged in tight and there are no frays along the length of the line.
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I've had dang near identical issues with a Humminbird 520. I thought it was the connectors at the back and I got so pissed with it that I taped them on securely with electrical tape. This seemed to work for a couple trips then the same thing intermittently again. I took the unit into Mike's and nothing was found.
I finally came to the conclusion that the transducer cable had an wiring problem - at least that was my final assessment just prior to discarding the complete ffinder. While chronie fishing one day I began moving the wires on a hunch and sure enough the display zero'd out in 8' of water. I may have over reacted a bit by discarding the unit but I just had enough frustration with it.
I now have a 120 portable clamp on and have a lot of fun with the side view finder.
I've had miss readings on the Fraser before and found that to be cavitation issues but you're saying this happens with the motor off so its not cavitation related.
A ffinder that zeros out on the Fraser at full speed is not a good feeling. Nothing feels worse than going 45mph to a dead stop in less than a second on the Fraser. I've done it - I go slower now. Damn bottom can rise very quickly on the river.
I would get a new, relatively inexpensive ffinder until you get what you want. You can spend the money on a new transducer but then find the head unit is the issue. A new lower end humminbird or another Eagle will be good and you can always re-sell it when you get your new ffinder.
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I know you said its getting power just fine, but if its getting less than 12 volts the transducer will be underpowered and all sorts of stuff happens as a result. Do the transducer wires run anywhere near the battery cables? There could be some interference there, as well as interference generated by a running motor.
Hope that helps rule things out.
Cheers,
Shaun
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--nothing really constructive to add.
--they seem to have a shelf life and when they're done they're done.
--have had the same problem with... after several good years of use... it just started acting up. false readings... depth doesn't make sense.
--I went through all the same potential fixes.... re-connected all cabels... tighten everything up... clean connections... check miminum voltage..
--GPS function is still working with no problems so I may just keep it for GPS on my other boat that has a cheap finder on it.
--Following this thread to see if someone has a miracle cure.
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I don't think there is a miracle cure. Its a cost of boating. replace it with a new unit and enjoy a safe summer. Turf it and forget about it. It's not worth the frustration and compromised safety.
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Could be totally off track but have you looked at the settings on the unit itself? Is the gain too low to read the contours? What depths is the unit set to read? Just thinking out loud ;D
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This may or may not work.
Make sure the transducer bottom is flat or even with the water. ( if the current moved it a bit to an angle it will not work properly )
When it is "acting up" hit the power button & turn it off & then restart.
Should work properly afterwords.
Thanks for all the tips guys! Transducer appears flat with the bottom. Tried clicking it up and down a notch or two and still has same intermittent issues. Tried the power on/off "trick" and didn't work. The brain appears to have a "reset" button on the back. Have not tried that yet. Will read manual on what the deal is and try that later.
If that doesn't work, I would look online for a new transducer. If I remember right, they aren't that expensive and are actually pretty easy to change. Would allow you to get by until you get your dream machine.
Yeah, it may come to that. If after troubleshooting as much as I can and it still doesn't work I may look at a new transducer, however as others have mentioned that MAY not solve the issue, which would be a real piss off!
I know you said its getting power just fine, but if its getting less than 12 volts the transducer will be underpowered and all sorts of stuff happens as a result. Do the transducer wires run anywhere near the battery cables? There could be some interference there, as well as interference generated by a running motor.
Hope that helps rule things out.
Cheers,
Shaun
I'll have to check the voltage. As far as I know it's fine. I don't believe the transducer cable runs near the battery cable. I'll have to look at that too. Only had the boat for 5 days! :)
Could be totally off track but have you looked at the settings on the unit itself? Is the gain too low to read the contours? What depths is the unit set to read? Just thinking out loud ;D
Settings should be fine. At times it will not pick up any depth at all. Even if no motor running and just sitting there bobbing around.
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This sounds like a transducer issue - and could well be - but could also be the head unit sender this is possible to fix and at the same time, if this is ruled out that leaves the transducer as the point of signal failure. I had a similar issue with a matrix 17 several years ago - in my case it was the sender and not the transducer - found a hummingbird repair guy on the Internet - worked out of his house in Surrey/Richmond - he tested and fixed the unit in about 30 min for a nominal charge compared to getting a new unit - the Fraser is not a place to boat if you don't know. The depth - good luck
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Thanks guys. I'm going to try and trouble shoot it with my dad when is his down in a week. This is much more his bag than mine. If no luck I may replace the transducer if not too expensive. If it is up there in price may consider buying a whole new F/F :o
I read the manual cover to cover. I checked the installation of the transducer to the manual instructions and it appears 100% done right.
Electrical interference is discussed in the manual, however the F/F will often not find bottom with the motor and all electrical accessories off, so pretty much rules this out.
Manual does mention that if the battery is below 11V it may cause issues. I'll check and make sure voltage is good.
Also mentioned that transducer may need a soap+water wash. It look clean but can't hurt to try.
As others have mentioned I think something on the F/F its self is glitchy, probably the transducer.
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I have a Hummingbird 520.Does the same thing.I have found that because the controls have multiple functions the settings appear normal even though I am getting no depth reading.I stumbled upon alternate settings for the sonar and display.Mine have to be entered thru the menu shortly after starting.Sonar sensitivity was showing zero here on other screen.Adjusting levels cured it.May have nothing to do with your issue but I would still check it out.Good luck.
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Interesting. I will try to reset the unit to default factory settings and try to dinker with the settings a bit.
I don't really think my f/f has settings related issues as a few times it has worked totally fine for 30 min or so. Didn't touch the settings at all. Then it will just cut out, shows "0.0" as the depth, and suddenly will not pick up anything. It's like someone unclipped the transducer and put it in their pocket. >:(
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Try it you have nothing to lose.My fish finder works fine, some-times for days.Then this happens.Multiple functions has been the key for me.The main menu settings indicate all is ok.
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Dad was down visting last week. We tried and tried to tinker with the Eagle and just could not get it to work properly. Ended up saying screw it and uninstalled the unit and all wiring. Dad had an olderish Garmin that worked fine so we installed that. It's pretty basic, black and white etc, but it shows botton/depth up to reasonable crusing speed which is better than the last one!
Plan is to just use this for a year or two and after we have higher priority things on the boat bought/figured out we'll look at a nice color, GPS, fancy arse model :D
On a related note, does any one ever pay to have their F/F installed? I know it's not rocket science but this kind of job is not really my bag. We had a real bugger of a time fishing wires an getting the whole thing wired up properly. Honestly think I would just save up a few more bucks and pay someone to do it right. I do my own engine maintenance and related stuff to save $ and I like it. Electrical/wiring is just not really my area of competency :o
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My older finder was really finicky about clean power. Had all kinds of trouble with it until I ran a separate power line straight to the aux battery. It had been powered with the rest of the electronics and that was introducing interference. I've read that if the transducer lines are run alongside the other wiring from the stern this can create the same problems though it doesn't with mine. I'd say run a separate power line for your new fancy one and consider insulating the transducer line if you have to run it with the other wiring. Other than that I got nothing
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So had our boat out on the Fraser for the 1st time today. Overall everything went well. Had a hoot catching pinks, kept a few nice clean does to smoke up, nobody died or was ejected from the boat, etc. Would have liked to stay on the river all day but had to ehad back before lunch as working afternoon shift :(
Anyway, the fishfinder we installed to replace the original one that was NFG worked okay today...but it still had some issues.
So unlike the original Eagle model that would not pick up bottom most of the time, this Hummingbird Matrix 10 one that my dad and I installed a couple weeks ago DOES read the bottom depth, however it will lose the "proper" depth as soon as you r get crusing and read like "980 feet" or something bizzare.
Also, it was kind of weird as sometimes it would lose the proper depth say at 3800RPM, but then wehn we slowed down to 3400RPM or whatever it would pick up the correct depth, then be fine up to 4000RPM, then lose the proper depth again.
I definitley do NOT like the feeling of not knowing the Fraser very well and crusing along not knowing how deep the water is. Of course I exercised a bit of common sense and tried my best to "read the water" and go where the water appeared deep enough.
Anyway, I'm going to try and trouble shoot the damn replacement FF ???
Plan is to down load the manual online and read it cover to cover. There may be some setting that needs to be tweaked to help it work properly. Also might try and loosen the 2 screws a bit that hold the mount to the transom and lower the transducer a bit (not the angle, the depth).
If I can't get this free replacement Hummingbird from my Dad sorted out we are going to have to buy a new one.
Honestly I think I would pay a boat shop to install/set it up properly. Maybe there is something my dad and I overlooked that is causing issues.
If you pay whichever shop to install it, I am assuming they will garuntee that it will read bottom up to a certain speed? If they are just going to slap it in and say "the troubleshooting is up to you if it doesnt work to your liking" well, then I might as well just install the damn thing.
Can anyone reccomend a shop that does a stellar job at installing FFs? I live in Chilliwack. Would bring boat to Abby or Langley but preferably not further west than that. Getting kind of tierd of this glitchey FF baloney. Just want one that works properly! Will try and dick with this one a bit but may just ahev to bite the bullet and buy a new one and pay to have it installed "right."
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What part of the river were you in? You can always watch for a boat with a prop to go through the water and follow them. If they aren't hitting their leg, you'll be fine with a Jet.
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You have to make some pretty bad choices to end up high and dry in a jet on the Fraser.
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What part of the river were you in? You can always watch for a boat with a prop to go through the water and follow them. If they aren't hitting their leg, you'll be fine with a Jet.
We launched at Island 22 around 8am. Many guide boats were departing at about the same time as us but as I suspected they are PEDAL TO THE METAL and there is no way I would feel comfortable going that fast trying to keep up, and I doubt our boat has the jam to keep up even if I wanted to.
So we put putted our way down to the mouth of the Vedder, anchored up and fished for a few hours, and put putted back. For the most part everything went fine however on our way to the mouth we had to go around an island/bar. We weren't sure what was the "good side, or if both side were good, so we took a guess and went left. WELL, luckily we were going slow, as about half way down the bar it dropped to about a foot of water. If we were going fast we may have burned over this, on plane, no problem but we rubbed bottom a little and the jet sucked in a bit of sand/crap :o Scared us a bit but we got through it fine. On the way back to I-22, big surprise, EVERYONE (many passing us) are going the other way around the island. Turns out there is 5-7 feet depth on that side. Damn it!
Anyway, it seems prudent to not be focused on one's FF too much and instead look at the water, look for shallow water before you are in it, etc. However if I look at the damn FF I want it to show me an accurate depth >:(
Anyway, if ya'll were gonna get a new FF installed in your river boat, where would you take it?
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A dealer?
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Just looking for a solid referral, that's all. I am aware that any place sells boats and FFs will likely gladly take additional $ to install it for you. I am assuming just like mechanics there are awesome ones, and alright ones, and ones that will rip you off and/or do a half-arse job. Looking for a full-arse job, no corners cut, that will stand behind their work and so on. If my mechanic did fish finders I would take my boat there! Not at all new to the fishing scene (been at it for over 30 years), just new to the river boating scene, that's all :o