Fishing with Rod Discussion Forum
Fishing in British Columbia => General Discussion => Topic started by: chris gadsden on August 17, 2004, 05:43:15 PM
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Because of the closure of the sockeye for the rec fishers on Wednesday night and the FN fishery still remaining open the SDA in conjuction with a number of other organizations will be staging a major protest on Saturday in Chilliwack.
I just just received the word and I have personal problems with some of what is being planned however I will support it in principle and will be there to film it.
I will be talking to Rodney tonight and how he wants to present what is being planned on this board in respect of him.
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oh boy i cant wait do tell do tell
maybe we could work something out as i will be in the area ;)
cnm
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While I support a protest, but I will have no part in any unlawful activities. I wrote to Regan telling him I was ****ed off because of the DOF not enforcing the law...now I should break the law???? Don't think so. :(
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I bet its a dental convention. They're always telling you to floss.
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Have talked to Rodney a few minutes ago and we will review OB at tomorrows CVRCC meeting and we will post further info then.
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Anything we can do if we're unable to attend?
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Be there in spirit I guess. ;D
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This Saturday gathering will be at The Peg starting at 1pm. More details to follow later.
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I just just received the word and I have personal problems with some of what is being planned however I will support it in principle and will be there to film it.
I will be talking to Rodney tonight and how he wants to present what is being planned on this board in respect of him.
In support I add this comment,
Whatever we do this Saturday, we need to rise above any illegal act. If a bunch of rec guys start to fish in defiance of the law... this could blur the line between law abiding citizens and out of control... law breaking... FN members.
I am afraid illegal acts this Saturday would, in the publics eye, make us all look the same.
If in the public's eye we all look the same we would lose a lot of the public support that we would be looking for on Saturday.
CJ.
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While I support a protest, but I will have no part in any unlawful activities. I wrote to Regan telling him I was ****ed off because of the DOF not enforcing the law...now I should break the law???? Don't think so. :(
I agree I will not be fishing But I do support. I must be a good role model for my kids. I refuse to teach them to be lawful then break it myself.
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Chris I have a few questions and thought you could answer them best. ;D
For Operation BBQ I have heard there will be an illegal fishery on the Saturday.
#1 With this happening what is the SDA and others getting at to solve a solution?
#2 How will this prove anything? Chinook fishing is still open so fishing would be allowed? To make a point about the Sockeye are people going to kill them to make a point?
I don't understand, I for one would not participate in any illegal fishing as it is the same as what the First Nations have been doing and would do essentially nothing imho except for some nice gear collection for Fisheries.
If there is no illegal fishery what is the point of hosting the protest at Peg Leg? Wouldnt it get better attention in a less secluded area?
Could I please have a better understanding of what is scheduled to happen.
Thanks, Aaron.
*Note* I will not be able to attend as I am on holidays. If I did I would just be there for support but not be involved in anything illegal. Could the footage filmed possibily be available for viewing at the BC Rivers Day event?
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He did say:
Have talked to Rodney a few minutes ago and we will review OB at tomorrows CVRCC meeting and we will post further info then.
And
just just received the word and I have personal problems with some of what is being planned however I will support it in principle and will be there to film it.
I will be talking to Rodney tonight and how he wants to present what is being planned on this board in respect of him.
Im sure we will hear all about it tonight.
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I really appreciate all the comments made above.
Yes the situation is very serious that we are faced with and there seems to be no easy answer to it, I wish there was. If only FOC would honour their mandate to enforce the fisheries act then we would not be in the situation we are in now.
I feel our precious fish stocks can not take all the effort that has been directed at them this season especially by FN.
If the FN people think they are entilled to more fish the proper process should be taken to change the laws of the land.
Do not block the railways, highways and fish outside the limits of their openings to reach their end goals as our democratic society is not built on such actions to get what you want.
For the SDA to also break the law, I agree whole heartly from my personal stand point that is not the way to go.
What is the answer I donot know but after writing letters to the Minister of Fisheries and other FOC managers they do not even have the courtesy to answer them and that is not right either.
The latest info I have received there is not to be any breaking of the law Saturday.
Actually as I type this an emergency meeting is on between SDA and some higher level FOC people talking about the situation.
I was invited to attend but was out fishing with Terry, Rodney and Nina after our CVRCC meeting today so did not want to change our plans.
I have a early am meeting tomorrow with a couple of fellows that attended the meeting tonight so will update things then for those interested.
We had an enjoyable day fishing and Rodney will be reporting on it later as I need supper. ;D
The SDA and the other groups attending may be trying to gt an extrnsion to the sockeye fishing as FN have been given as most of us know more openings.
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Thanks for the update Chris, was very concerned about the outcome for the long run.
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Just returned from a small planning meeting for the SDA protest set for Saturday at 1 pm at Peg Leg Bar.
Some updates
A few members and others met with Savard and another FOC official last night for 3 and one half hours to try to get them to leave the Sockeye open as long as FN were fishing. They apparently had a 3 day opening but I just heard it has been scaled back to one day because of the high water tempatures.
So maybe last nights meeting helped save a lot of fish with the scaled back opening..
FOC would not bend on reopening it to the weekend for the REC fellows.
This should end the FN legal sockeye fishing for the rest of this year. Time will tell.
Another change in the SDA protest fishery plan there maybe the taking one one sockeye as a symbol of the displeasure of the inaction of FOC to enforce the law.
I have to go on record of questioning this decison but I am only one voice.
The breaking of the law has gone on for way too long on the Fraser by other user groups with poaching being rampant, illegal selling of fish, illegal equipment fishing during closed time, in closed areas to the point of some fish stocks being fished to dangerous levels.
Maybe sacrificing one fish to help save thousands of others may have some merit. It also easy to justify ones opinion I quess but I do not like breaking the law even though we all do it in some manner, be it speeding, not declaring income on our income tax and the list goes on.
One thing I do know we have to jar FOC to their senses some how to do a way better job of managing our precious fish stocks.
I know close to 20 years ago FVSS illegally killed a chinook when they were closed and actually it forced home the issue of unfairness the rec fishers were facing.
It was this action believe it or not was this act of disobience the got FOC to take notice of the Rec angler and we have all the fishing today partly because of it.
It got a meeting with Fishery minister of the day Tom Siddon who was not getting the whole story from his managers and once he stepped in things improved greatly.
Is it the time to do it again? I quess it is up to you the indiviual angler to decide if he wants to to paticipate or not.
Will I be there? I will, but I sure wish there was another way and I blame FOC for putting me there on Saturday.
How else can I react when I take hours writing letters,seeking others to write their concerns also and they donot have the courtesy to answere me just once. Disgusting and rude bahaviour to say the least.
If anyone is to blame for the action that happen and arises on Saturday it is FOC's senior staff and the man supposly at the helm, the Fisheries Minister.
In my books it is not the SDA fault they are taking this action and I hope many others from this board will attend if only to give their support by their present at the protest.
How did the saying go, when they came for the------- and I said and did nothing, then they came for the----- and then they finely came for me and no one was left to help me.
I do not want this to happen to our precious salmonids it is time to speak for them now or forever rest your case.
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Thanks Chris for the update.
Now I have two very good reasons to go to PegLeg Saturday afternoon: the protest and CanoeMan's barfish-aganza.
I only needed 1 reason: the protest.
I will be there!
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I have told you all I know at this point and if a fish is to be taken to make the point it is to be only ONE. The person that is to take the fish is picked out already from what I have been told.
I plan to be there and may do a little bar fishing with the canoeman boys as you know I do not fish for sockeye anyway.
I am surprised in the turn of events so quickly as the BQ was to be held in early September. ???
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Just got back from helping make 30 signs for Saturday's protest.
Also you may have heard Bill on CKNW.
I also see FOC has cut back the FN fishery for the weekend so that may be a bit of a victory coming out of last nights meeting
Also FOC is trying to cover their butt by blaming the warm water that will cause on route mortality which will be true in some sense but he fails to mention all the netting legal and illegall will also have a huge impact as well. Good spin doctors to say the least.
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Gotta work Sat till 8:15 pm :(
Wanted them to hold it on Sun or Mon or any morning.
Oh well
CJ.
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I will not be attending due to personal matters. If I am going, I would be an observer from the sideline.
While the intention of the protest seems good, you have to question what are the consequences of the approach that is being taken. Will this damage the relationship between FOC and SDA further? What happens when SDA and other groups return to the meeting table? Will sportfishers' still be able to voice strongly as before?
I've never really believed in protests, especially when it involves breaking the law, overall it does not produce result except stirring up the anger some more. A better approach would be to push for more changes on the negotiating table.
I wonder how good this is going to look in the media when Bill landed that fish as everyone else cheered on. This is quite serious, and risky. The way the media portrait the protest may either gain support from the public or completely damage its public relationship.
And please, those who are going from the website, you're not representing FWR if you are being interviewed. FWR is simply a business, not an organization that has a mission statement. FWR does not support or condemn the protest, we are simply broadcasting it as a media outlet to let people know what is going on.
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As I stated before I donot like breaking the law one bit and will not be this Saturday. Saying that I feel it is imperitive I am there to show my support for what the SDA is trying to do, that is to get FOC and the Fisheries Minister's attention
Of course I hope things go well on Saturday and as I stated before it is FOC fault that this is happening.
If more of you could be at the meeting I have attended you would see the unwillness of FOC to bend at all on their position of the caving into other user groups demands.
We have tried to explain to them to inforce the law of our Democratic Society but they seem to want to cater to groups that have assaulted Fishery officers, confrontations with sports anglers peacefully fishing, blocked the CNR railway, overfished threatened fish stocks, driftneted at night in closed areas and illegally sold thousands of fish this season. Far worse than a hopefully a peaceful protest.
In all respect if there was another way to handle this very serious situation I am sure SDA would welcome hearing about it.
The SDA directors have spent 5 years trying to protect the REC anglers fishing future by giving countless hours of their own time, raising money to hire lawyers, atending fishing shows to raise public awareness, giving money from their own pockets to attend meetings and the costs of getting there.
What else can you do when FOC and the minister will not even answer in most cases the letters you write to them?
It is tragic that FOC has let things slip so badly that we are in this situation now.
IF FOC does not change their direction they are going we and the salmon will be in seriuos trouble down the road. Mark my word.
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I agree with Rodney's post and, as I stated earlier, I am not in favour of breaking the law to make a point. I am feeling more comfortable now that I hear there will not be mass illegal sockeye fishing at this protest. Remains to be seen, however, just what kind of behaviour will be the standard.
On the other hand, I am well aware of the frustrations felt by those who do things the right way (letters/phone call/personal contact) when they are totally ignored. Let's face it, it's quite simple when there is a short controversial season (relatively speaking) for those in charge to ignore things because concern will go away immediately after the completion of the sockeye runs. Those in power know they are "safe" from this nonsense for another approx. 10 months. Most sports fishers won't even take the time to write letters of concern yet they stand to be the biggest losers in all of this.
So, what is the solution?
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Rodney, your concerns are noted. We all appreciate the forum you provide for all of us. However, this protest is not about FWR. It's to get off the fence and make the recreational fishers' point of view. We all cannot be in boardrooms meeting with FOC representatives. The PegLeg event is our platform. We need to do something to make others become aware of the silent majority. The recreational fishers do not want anything extraordinary. We just want to be treated with equal respect as any other interest within this resource.
Come on all you sideliners! Be there!
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gee.... when it's open season, every one is slaughtrering them........ when it's over then a bunch of whining, there are a TON OF FISH ALL OVER so the dfo closes it so what just chill out........ go to a different hole
and also the ethics flossing? kool i like fish to , but, it ok with me get them anyway, and then whine about other ppl? man, get a life fishing isn't everything it's just a pastime
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maybe we should all chill out and open a reeb, hug our loved ones, scratch the pets behind the ears and give them a treat, take the kids if any out for a movie, phone our grandparents and say hi, instead of b******g about all this crap.
except for me - i have no loved one anymore, my cat Attila The Hun just bit & clawed me, no kids (thank freaking god).......and i've managed to alienate 4 of my best friends in as many days....(don't ask)............but what do i care? i got a computer, a high speed internet connection, streaming techno/industrial, cold reeb in the fridge, and FISHING!!! man life can be weird sometimes
8)
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aw shush up ............ ;D ;D ;D
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no.........no perry como (who the BLANK is perry como) records for me........my musical tastes over the last tow months have been:
Slipknot, Front Line Assembly, Skinny Puppy, Cradle Of Filth, Front 242, Einsturzene Neubauten, old Ministry, and various other heavy industrial bands.....also streaming 24/7 hard techno on my computer..........
www.live365.com
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Every thing is on shedule of today event.
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See you out there. May be watching, may be participating...who knows.
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Late start :(...heading out now.