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[Rodney]

"there is a visible, tangible problem and a readily available solution, with existing means for dealing with that solution."

Not quite. If anything, the solutions were not available, and took three years to get to where we are today, and new problems always emerge. The river garbage problem falls into two categories. One is created by daily users who leave small portions of trash around such as beers cans and plastic bags. The main problem that we have had to tackle, is the criminal garbage. Criminal garbage usually involves a huge dumping on the riverside, usually performed at night. The large dumping usually comes from illegal grow-ops, industrial waste, large disgarded household appliances. One day the river is clean, next day... a huge mountain of garbage sits right in front of you. There were no existing means to tackle this growing problem. It took years of planning between local anglers, The City of Chilliwack, Fraser Valley Regional District, RCMP, DFO to get where we are today. If trash was so manageable, we would be fishing a lot more instead of sitting through meetings and digging our brains to figure out what to do.

The river dumpings and break-ins/theft are closely related, what took place on October 15th is a prime example.

I think you're missing what I am suggesting here. I don't expect the RCMP to get out there and chase down every single thief when the crime is reported. There are more serious crimes that usually sit higher up on their list. By phoning and reporting the crime, it becomes a statistic. These become numbers that we can use to emphasize the need to create solutions for the problem. If no one phones in, how does the City, RCMP know the severity of the riverside break-ins? How do you expect the City to accept your proposal of park n ride if they believe the break-ins are not taking place that often?

Problems like this take the cooperation of every sector. It may take time, but if all are determined to stick around, we will get there.

[dennyman]

Well I have to fall in agreement with Rod that we all have to try and do our bit to see if we can improve the situation. Hopefully over a reasonable period of time this problem can be brought under control. But we cannot just shrug our shoulders and do nothing. Personally I think it is a bunch of small time crooks who have found a pretty easy deal by breaking into cars. However, if we do nothing, who is to say the problem won't get to the point where fisherman will be  getting mugged and robbed on their way to do some fishing.

[marmot]

Its not "small time crooks"...theyre leaving the expensive stuff that they cant get rid of in 10 seconds....they are JUNKIES!! Thats why the change drawers are empty and EVERYTHING is scattered around the car frantically.  This is why I say the problem cant be tackled until we have a much grander policy shift...we're not dealing with normal human behavior, we're dealing with desperation and our system has yet to address it effectively ANYWHERE.  You think the RCMP and VPD dont know about the extent of crime that happens in the downtown eastside? Has it improved? NO.  It keeps getting worse.  They could set up a camera at the vedder and see all the crime happening firsthand and still do nothing to stifle it...why do i say this ? BECAUSE IT HAPPENS DOWNTOWN ALREADY. When youre dealing with junkies its a whole different ballgame.  They dont care if they get caught as long as they can get a fix before they do...and they dont do any time.  The same guys get picked up again and again and again and again. 

Also, the police know the vedder is a bad breakin area already...the entire chilliwack fishing area has been bad for YEARS! 

Rodney, if anglers expressed an interest in a park'n'ride, you wouldnt need RCMP involvement to get it going...all the municipality has to see is a potential profit and they would be all over it...if not profitable, well thats a different story...

Its not a "throw your hands in the air" approach im advocating...in fact, I think that just contacting the RCMP about it is about as "throw your hands in the air" as it can get.  Leave the problem up to an institution that has proven time and time again that it is incapable of dealing with this sort of thing? No thanks, Id rather try to come up with solutions using different venues.  You can contact the RCMP and file your report, go fishing there again, and get your car broken into again and again waiting for change, OR , you can use your own head and try to think of something along with like minded individuals with similar interests that will affect change now.  Up to you!

[Islanderguy]

If it is crackheads doing all this crap, lock em up for 2 years with a prison that actually has no drugs in it!!  That keeps them out of the system and doing all the stealing and damage to support their habbit, then it will also give them 2 years to get drug free.  Let them have all the counselers they need and give them structure and education. I guess you can call it tough love..

The Vancouver East side is full of crackheads because the system is so soft it enables them to do so.  Fill the prisons up with them and their dealers and get them off the damn street.  Then again you can just open up the prison doors to any crackhead and tell them as long as they are in for good, they get free drugs, that would also keep them off the street and satisy the pacifists.

[Bushwacker]

Whoa ! Whoa ! Whoa! This topic is starting to heat up and it's not going anywhere.As I said before the situation was not getting any better and the reality of the problem has a much greater impact on those who have been victimized.That's when one's whole outlook on the situation changes very rapidly.

That's also very easy to say it especially from a guy who had been advocating the ultimate solution and got some heat from it. Sad to say that Chilliwack has been unofficially tagged as the pot growing capital of Canada as well as some other criminal activities.Locking up all these crackheads and other lowlife crooks will bring all of us to financial disaster to build an inordinate number of additional prisons.Note that many pot growers that get caught don't go to jail and get away with a pittance of a fine as a way of doing business.Not to mention the growing menace of crystal meth and other forms of drug abuse.

Part of the solution is to promote better ways to increase awareness and alertness by the general public through Block Watch, Grow Watch, Fish Watch, etc,these become the eyes and ears to assist law enforcement and act as deterrents to reduce crime.
Reply #3 (Nostro) demonstrates a good example of spotting suspicious behaviour and recording the description of potential offenders/vehicles. They took off in a hurry due to the fear of being caught..It is amazing how so many folks can be so blind or unwary that so many of these petty thefts can occur in broad daylight right under their noses.

Reply #25 (Terry B.) Good stuff and I wish you much success in your endeavours and gain the support from the local community through the commercial/retail, police,media,City Hall, tourism, MP Strahl, sporting, and other sectors. We also need more of the 3 M's.... Money, Men, Motivation.
There is the need to raise some funds to support additional volunteer work and the expenses incurred. As an idea perhaps a "Reclaim our Recreational areas" type lottery sold through tackle shops, etc. and more advertising to promote the great fishing and recreational experience in the Fraser Valley.
Yesterday I saw a group of about 15 yellow-jacket police bike squad riding single file on a training run along Promontory/Vedder Rd. Would be nice to see more of these bike cops showing their presence at the popular fishing locations.

Re Reply #19 (Rodney). Is it possible to introduce a Crime Map into your FWR site something like...

http://onlineathens.com/news/police/crimemap.shtml

This will help the fishing and recreational fraternity to gain some awareness of the problem spots along the Chilliwack/Vedder. This map will also provide the database and also be used for some kind of periodic comparison of seasonal occurrences and whether there are any improvements shown through prevention measures taken.

[Rodney]

Re Reply #19 (Rodney). Is it possible to introduce a Crime Map into your FWR site something like...

http://onlineathens.com/news/police/crimemap.shtml

This will help the fishing and recreational fraternity to gain some awareness of the problem spots along the Chilliwack/Vedder. This map will also provide the database and also be used for some kind of periodic comparison of seasonal occurrences and whether there are any improvements shown through prevention measures taken.

If the information becomes available and the RCMP, the City or FVRD wishes to have it broadcasted, I would be happy to add it into our news section of the website. This year DFO and FWR have done just that by keeping our readers as informed as possible.

For example:

Information on adipose clipped Cultus Lake sockeye salmon
Capilano weirs information

This website does not have the tool or power to publish what you suggested, but it is a good medium for local authorities to help the anglers to gain some awareness on related issues.

[chris gadsden]

We have a date, November 9th to meet with The City of Chilliwack, RCMP and the Regional District to discuss this and other items.

[marmot]

well i sincerely hope that something comes from that meeting that brings about a positive change. 

[chris gadsden]

well i sincerely hope that something comes from that meeting that brings about a positive change. 

Remember we are just a group of volunteers doing our best. I truly feel as Rodney has stated on this thread things have improved the last three years since the CVRCC was formed. I imagine most that have posted on this thread that are in the immediate area to the Vedder have attended some of our cleanups and helped to make things better out on the river as well.

The breakins is a problem that has a way to go before it improves like the garbage problem has. I feel it is better to be meeting than not meeting at all as most will agree the positive is we have the opportunity and avenue to dialogue with the authorities.

[liketofish]

Just curious if the break-ins are mostly targeted towards fishermen parking along the river. Don't the locals get hit too parking around homes, shops, and parks.  If so, why is there no public pressure for the city of Chilliwack or Sardis to do anything?  How about getting the media involved to report on mounting crimes along the river?  That should get somebody in the city government paying attention.

[Nostro]

There are a lot more things any city could do to add security to vulnerable areas such as favourite fishing parking spots. As residents and visitors to these areas, be it along the Vedder/Chilliwack system, the Frase River, Chehalis or whatever. These all experience petty crimes during prime fishing seasons. The pressure should be applied to the appropriate governing body for that area. Residents and visitors alike deserve a certain amount of security to self and property. As a group, board members from sites such as this have a united voice and we should exercise it.
But, as individuals, we all can do a lot ourselves. We can, individually, contact the "City" and the security forces and demand action. But, even that is not enough. We all owe it to ourselves and others around us, wherever we are, to keep our eyes open, stay alert and get involved. Would be criminals are very alert of their environment. They pick up on your vibes very quickly if you become aware of them and show it. You may not catch them in the commission of a crime, but you may have prevented a crime from being committed at that spot at that time.
Not all crimes are committed by "crackheads". It gives comfort, I know, if we can label things. But, that doesn't solve the problem. Being involved and being alert helps, but does not always prevent crimes either.
Example: 2 days ago, on Sunday, I'm driving towards the Peach parking lot. I pass 2 very clean looking teen-agers, not at all "crackhead" in appearance. But, as I pass, their behaviour changes. They stopped walking on the sidewalk as soon as I passed, stood against the mail boxes adjacent to the sidewalk. I look into my rearview mirror and each has a door open to a minivan. I pull into a parking spot in the lot and look back along Peach Road. These 2 guys are now walking coolly in the middle of the road, away from the minivan, going north. Now that's funny! Why would they do that? I quickly pull out of the lot and race towards these 2. They see me coming, hop the fence into the DND field and run. The whole thing took less than 1 minute. I went back to the minivan and looked through the window. The car has been searched, it's obvious. I called the RCMP. It took them less then 1 minute to open 2 doors and search this vehicle. Incredible! Did I prevent a crime from happenning? Obviously not! I felt really bad because I should have gone with my initial gut feeling and stopped and backed up instead of continuing to the lot because I was in a rush to get to a favourite hole.
Lesson learned, again. I must keep my eyes open, stay alert and get involved.

[marmot]

Its pretty easy to tell when a crackhead has been through your car as opposed to a "regular" theif, if there is such a thing anymore.