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Author Topic: Let's Build Some More Pipelines!  (Read 960 times)

skaha

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Re: Let's Build Some More Pipelines!
« Reply #1 on: September 26, 2017, 10:27:05 PM »

--actually appears to be a good idea...if they had permission to build in those areas
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shuswapsteve

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Re: Let's Build Some More Pipelines!
« Reply #2 on: September 27, 2017, 10:08:52 PM »

On the surface, it appears to be putting the cart ahead of the horse. Should have approvals first before proceeding, but the practice sounds like a good idea to avoid incubating eggs and alevins in the gravel from being dug up due to construction. The company is trying to minimize as much environmental impact as possible which is a good thing. Just need to get approvals first.  Kind of an over reaction from some environmentalists, in my opinion.
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chris gadsden

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Re: Let's Build Some More Pipelines!
« Reply #3 on: October 04, 2017, 07:48:17 PM »

Similar to overacting on the jack closure on the Thompson again this year after thousands going by as well as the pink closure on the Fraser and other rivers. I had a report a large run of pinks in the Nicola this year, more than last year and I saw it first hand today as the banks of the Nicola are littered with hundreds of spawned fish. Why is not a dead pitch count of this fish, maybe one has been done or will be.

Sorry to be off topic but wanted the above poster to see this.

shuswapsteve

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Re: Let's Build Some More Pipelines!
« Reply #4 on: October 06, 2017, 04:17:14 PM »

Similar to overacting on the jack closure on the Thompson again this year after thousands going by as well as the pink closure on the Fraser and other rivers. I had a report a large run of pinks in the Nicola this year, more than last year and I saw it first hand today as the banks of the Nicola are littered with hundreds of spawned fish. Why is not a dead pitch count of this fish, maybe one has been done or will be.

Sorry to be off topic but wanted the above poster to see this.

Pinks were not showing up that well in the test fisheries and below what they anticipated past Mission. Of course there would be more pinks in the Fraser this year compared to last year because Fraser Pinks are almost nonexistent on even years. It's the odd years where you get the numbers. The reality is that there's no money to do an assessment of pinks on an extensive nature. Department use to do more stock assessment on Pinks in the Fraser up until the late 90s but unless we are willing to take from Peter to give to Paul it's not going to change much. However, this may change in the coming years if First Nations become more involved after reconciliation agreements and applicable funding.
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Dave

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Re: Let's Build Some More Pipelines!
« Reply #5 on: October 06, 2017, 08:42:10 PM »

However, this may change in the coming years if First Nations become more involved after reconciliation agreements and applicable funding.
I think you nailed it ss; it is becoming very obvious FN are going to have a much larger role to play in future West coast salmon management decisions.
As it is now FN leaders understand the problems (unfortunately some of their band members don't) and they are quickly building the capacity to take over some programs that are now DFO's responsibility.

I'm all for it.
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chris gadsden

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Re: Let's Build Some More Pipelines!
« Reply #6 on: October 06, 2017, 09:06:09 PM »

Pinks were not showing up that well in the test fisheries and below what they anticipated past Mission. Of course there would be more pinks in the Fraser this year compared to last year because Fraser Pinks are almost nonexistent on even years. It's the odd years where you get the numbers. The reality is that there's no money to do an assessment of pinks on an extensive nature. Department use to do more stock assessment on Pinks in the Fraser up until the late 90s but unless we are willing to take from Peter to give to Paul it's not going to change much. However, this may change in the coming years if First Nations become more involved after reconciliation agreements and applicable funding.
We are taking about pinks returns from 2 years ago as we are well aware they return in odd numbered years on the Fraser watershed not like Island streams. As well it was the return of the fish in the Nicola from Spences Bridge to Merritt we were commenting on. Sorry state of affairs when FOC can not do proper science that includes walking our streams and doing dead pitching like Dave and Ken used to do when they worked for DFO as it was called then. This of course gives you better idea how many fish are actually returning to their natal streams.

Habitat destruction has lead to many problems. We have been trying to get a meeting for months to discuss gravel extraction on the Vedder River but we continue to get the run around with planned meetings with the City of Chilliwack, FOC and the Province. They keep giving excuses leading to the cancellations of numerous meetings that were scheduled.

Of course they hope we go away and they know what went on last year was poorly done in our mind. We all know gravel extraction is bad for any river system. We are getting frustrated that they donot want to hear the evidence we have. As much as one does not like to go political they may leave us no choice to do so.

Of course the closure of the Thompson for jacks second year in a row was disturbing to the sports angler as so many were in the system. No creel survey was done to see sockeye capture just does not happen.

As you know it was scheduled to open August 22 but was closed only 14 hours before it was set to open, this makes one looe faith in FOC. We wrote several letters to Dale last year and were not very pleased with the responses which he is aware of hearing from Nick, Fraser Valley Salmon Society, myself and others.

He should be willing to met with us to discuss this traditional fishery for many of us.

 End of rant as I leave early tomorrow for Vancouver for the start of the Wild Salmon Caravan, hope to see you in Kamloops on Wednesday. ;D

chris gadsden

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Re: Let's Build Some More Pipelines!
« Reply #7 on: October 06, 2017, 09:10:29 PM »

I think you nailed it ss; it is becoming very obvious FN are going to have a much larger role to play in future West coast salmon management decisions.
As it is now FN leaders understand the problems (unfortunately some of their band members don't) and they are quickly building the capacity to take over some programs that are now DFO's responsibility.

I'm all for it.
Come and see many F/N leaders as we discuss the fish farms issue when we are Chilliwack on Sunday, we will not bite you. I have asked SS to pay us a visit when we are in Kamloops. All we ask is for you to listen first hand to why we are very concerned with these farms.

shuswapsteve

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Re: Let's Build Some More Pipelines!
« Reply #8 on: October 07, 2017, 07:37:45 AM »

We are taking about pinks returns from 2 years ago as we are well aware they return in odd numbered years on the Fraser watershed not like Island streams. As well it was the return of the fish in the Nicola from Spences Bridge to Merritt we were commenting on. Sorry state of affairs when FOC can not do proper science that includes walking our streams and doing dead pitching like Dave and Ken used to do when they worked for DFO as it was called then. This of course gives you better idea how many fish are actually returning to their natal streams.

Habitat destruction has lead to many problems. We have been trying to get a meeting for months to discuss gravel extraction on the Vedder River but we continue to get the run around with planned meetings with the City of Chilliwack, FOC and the Province. They keep giving excuses leading to the cancellations of numerous meetings that were scheduled.

Of course they hope we go away and they know what went on last year was poorly done in our mind. We all know gravel extraction is bad for any river system. We are getting frustrated that they donot want to hear the evidence we have. As much as one does not like to go political they may leave us no choice to do so.

Of course the closure of the Thompson for jacks second year in a row was disturbing to the sports angler as so many were in the system. No creel survey was done to see sockeye capture just does not happen.

As you know it was scheduled to open August 22 but was closed only 14 hours before it was set to open, this makes one looe faith in FOC. We wrote several letters to Dale last year and were not very pleased with the responses which he is aware of hearing from Nick, Fraser Valley Salmon Society, myself and others.

He should be willing to met with us to discuss this traditional fishery for many of us.

 End of rant as I leave early tomorrow for Vancouver for the start of the Wild Salmon Caravan, hope to see you in Kamloops on Wednesday. ;D

Well from your original post it wasn't clear you were talking about 2 years ago - you said the previous year. As for FOC not walking our streams and doing dead pitching that is too much of a generalization. You read a little too much into that paper by some folks at Watershed Watch Salmon Society as it was solely based on the North Coast. There is some truth to what you are saying but also some ignorance. There are plenty of people currently walking streams right now in the Fraser watershed but instead the media and activist portrayal is that there's nobody doing it. That's just not true. I already replied to this issue a month ago to another member.  Maybe while you are on your caravan of awareness you should make yourself properly aware of what is currently done and all of the challenges being faced by those entrusted to carry out this work.
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shuswapsteve

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Re: Let's Build Some More Pipelines!
« Reply #9 on: October 07, 2017, 07:42:13 AM »

All we ask is for you to listen first hand to why we are very concerned with these farms.
And that's why I'm skeptical of the whole event.
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Dave

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Re: Let's Build Some More Pipelines!
« Reply #10 on: October 07, 2017, 08:30:27 AM »

Chris, ask the Sto-Lo "leaders" why their band members continue to fish endangered early Fraser River chinook and summer run sockeye.  In one day these fishers kill more salmon than has been attributed to 40 years of fish farming here on the west coast.
We get that you and this latest advocacy group don't like fish farms but take the blinders off and see what is actually happening to these stocks, and how their downward spiral could be halted with less fishing.
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shuswapsteve

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Re: Let's Build Some More Pipelines!
« Reply #11 on: October 14, 2017, 03:04:28 PM »

Of course the closure of the Thompson for jacks second year in a row was disturbing to the sports angler as so many were in the system. No creel survey was done to see sockeye capture just does not happen.

As you know it was scheduled to open August 22 but was closed only 14 hours before it was set to open, this makes one looe faith in FOC. We wrote several letters to Dale last year and were not very pleased with the responses which he is aware of hearing from Nick, Fraser Valley Salmon Society, myself and others.

He should be willing to met with us to discuss this traditional fishery for many of us.


 End of rant as I leave early tomorrow for Vancouver for the start of the Wild Salmon Caravan, hope to see you in Kamloops on Wednesday. ;D

Just got some further clarification on your latest rant. Helps to have both sides of the story. Maybe you should share his response to be fair to him. I'm sure others here would be interested.
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