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[TNAngler]

I think I am going to form a web based regulations consulting business. It's posted all over the place here and on other websites plus on DFO.

Here it is:

http://notices.dfo-mpo.gc.ca/fns-sap/index-eng.cfm?pg=view_notice&DOC_ID=187080&ID=all

Well if you were going to form a web based regulations consulting business you probably should get your facts straight.

You stated "My guess there is a 50-50 (at best) chance that the river may open in a week or so. The wild card is water temperature which is quite high for this time of year. Even at that expect a closure soon after the Labor Day - if they are consistent with previous years it will close the 6th. If lucky they may keep it open for a few days past that though the interior 1st Nations and others wil be looking for a closure to protect the interior coho."

Unless I am completely misunderstanding your post, you indicate that on or around the 6th of September last year or previous years, they closed the Fraser.  I went to last year's notices and saw no such closure.  I'm not asking for this year's closure, I'm asking for you to support your statement that if they are consistent with previous years it will close shortly after Labor Day.  I didn't see it last year so was asking for proof of that.

[TNAngler]

If the river reopens in late August as they did last year once majority of the sockeye salmon pass through the Lower Fraser River, it will remain open throughout September for chinook salmon retention, like last year. For quite a few years now, SFAC has recommended to DFO that while Interior coho salmon management measures like bait ban should be in place, fishing for salmon and retention of chinook salmon should still be allowed throughout the red zone, and they have followed through with that request.

Whether it will reopen in a week or so from now is still to be seen. At the current in-season estimate of total Fraser River sockeye salmon, the late run may also need to be protected, and the runtime of that stock goes well into September.

Thanks Rodney.  Do you think there is any chance that they give advanced notice or will they do the same thing they did at the start of August and provide notice the day before it opened?  It is really difficult to make plans that will require hotels, buying fishing licenses, getting transportation, etc. when they do this all last minute.  I'm sure the guides hate this as people from out of the area can't make any type of plans and if they open it last minute nobody can plan travel that late.

[TNAngler]

Ok, I found in 2011 I found FN0863 which stated

"Non-tidal waters of the Fraser River - from the confluence with Sawmill Creek
to the Alexandra Bridge 

Effective 00:01 hours, September 19, 2011 until one hour before 23:59 hours
Friday, December 31, 2011, you may not fish for salmon."

I don't really have more time to go further back in the notices but that was the only closure to the Fraser I noticed.

[Rodney]

Thanks Rodney.  Do you think there is any chance that they give advanced notice or will they do the same thing they did at the start of August and provide notice the day before it opened?  It is really difficult to make plans that will require hotels, buying fishing licenses, getting transportation, etc. when they do this all last minute.  I'm sure the guides hate this as people from out of the area can't make any type of plans and if they open it last minute nobody can plan travel that late.

Based on how they've operated in the past two years, I highly doubt that there will be an advanced notice. It'll be announced the day before probably. We've gone from a two-way communication where I'd get lots of information to help whoever need it, to a one-way communication where nobody at the department cares to share any development. We've been pointing this out for awhile now, unlike other sectors, recreational fishing openings need to be announced earlier so people coming from out of town like yourself can actually plan your trip.

[RalphH]

Ok, I found in 2011 I found FN0863 which stated

"Non-tidal waters of the Fraser River - from the confluence with Sawmill Creek
to the Alexandra Bridge

Effective 00:01 hours, September 19, 2011 until one hour before 23:59 hours
Friday, December 31, 2011, you may not fish for salmon."

I don't really have more time to go further back in the notices but that was the only closure to the Fraser I noticed.

fall closures have been in place since 1999 and generally run from the day after Labour Day until around Thanksgiving.

for the last few cycles they have had a limited opening to allow fishing for Pinks

[TNAngler]

Based on how they've operated in the past two years, I highly doubt that there will be an advanced notice. It'll be announced the day before probably. We've gone from a two-way communication where I'd get lots of information to help whoever need it, to a one-way communication where nobody at the department cares to share any development. We've been pointing this out for awhile now, unlike other sectors, recreational fishing openings need to be announced earlier so people coming from out of town like yourself can actually plan your trip.

Sucks because that will likely mean I will have to plan on going to the Columbia instead and it will mean the loss of any income I would generate, licenses (I haven't bought a BC license in a couple years because of the timing and this year doesn't look any different), food, parking at island 22 fees, etc.  Granted, I don't probably contribute a lot to the economy but I'm sure I'm not the only one that will have to change plans or can't make plans because of their lack of communication.

[TNAngler]

for the last few cycles they have had a limited opening to allow fishing for Pinks

You must be looking at different notices than I am looking at or are too stubborn to admit you were wrong.  Except for the one closure I found back in 2011, not only was there fishing allowed, retention of chinook was allowed.  You are going to have to provide proof.

[Dave]

Based on how they've operated in the past two years, I highly doubt that there will be an advanced notice. It'll be announced the day before probably. We've gone from a two-way communication where I'd get lots of information to help whoever need it, to a one-way communication where nobody at the department cares to share any development. We've been pointing this out for awhile now, unlike other sectors, recreational fishing openings need to be announced earlier so people coming from out of town like yourself can actually plan your trip.

So true Rod   Communications Branch in DFO has gone from bad to terrible in just a few years.

[RalphH]

Business will be slow if you call your customers "grasshopper", "smart guy", "chuckles" or "whiner'

"s-a-r-c-a-s-m"

but thanks the same -

[RalphH]

Hey I've just lived and fished here for close to 60 years. I am sure you know much more based as you are in Tennessee, the Salmon Capital of the World.

Well if you were going to form a web based regulations consulting business you probably should get your facts straight.

You stated "My guess there is a 50-50 (at best) chance that the river may open in a week or so. The wild card is water temperature which is quite high for this time of year. Even at that expect a closure soon after the Labor Day - if they are consistent with previous years it will close the 6th. If lucky they may keep it open for a few days past that though the interior 1st Nations and others wil be looking for a closure to protect the interior coho."

Unless I am completely misunderstanding your post, you indicate that on or around the 6th of September last year or previous years, they closed the Fraser.  I went to last year's notices and saw no such closure.  I'm not asking for this year's closure, I'm asking for you to support your statement that if they are consistent with previous years it will close shortly after Labor Day.  I didn't see it last year so was asking for proof of that.

[TNAngler]

Hey I've just lived and fished here for close to 60 years. I am sure you know much more based as you are in Tennessee, the Salmon Capital of the World.

Ok, so you disagree with Rod even and can't produce any proof and then I'm supposed to just bow down to your superior experience?  I had no problem finding close to a decade worth of fishing notices that told me you didn't know what you were talking about.  I could go back further if I had time.  Maybe you have just missed out on all kinds of fishing in the fall because you believed the Fraser was closed.  Or maybe you are just being a worthless troll.  Or perhaps doing internet searches are something you don't understand how to do and your memory is fading a little bit with all that experience.  Either way, I hope nobody else on this site accepts your expertise in the rules as you have proven you are ignorant of what the regulations have said.  I welcome you proving your stance to me but until then, realize you have absolutely no credibility.

[Rodney]

In 2011, DFO kept the non-tidal Fraser River open for salmon fishing and retention of pink, chinook and chum salmon. In addition, they allowed sockeye salmon retention upstream from the Vedder River mouth, giving anglers opportunities to keep sockeye while protecting Cultus Lake sockeye salmon which are coming through downstream from the Vedder River mouth. The sockeye salmon retention opportunities were available until September 19th, while retention of chinook, pink, chum never closed. Once the interior coho salmon run timing is over, the river also opened up for hatchery coho salmon retention in early October.

As mentioned in my previous post, chinook salmon retention in the Lower Fraser River has been opened throughout September for quite a few years now, due to the requests SFAC had made for many years prior to these management changes.

[TNAngler]

fall closures have been in place since 1999 and generally run from the day after Labour Day until around Thanksgiving.

for the last few cycles they have had a limited opening to allow fishing for Pinks

Again, what are your sources because that is completely different than what I am seeing and hearing

[TNAngler]

In 2011, DFO kept the non-tidal Fraser River open for salmon fishing and retention of pink, chinook and chum salmon. In addition, they allowed sockeye salmon retention upstream from the Vedder River mouth, giving anglers opportunities to keep sockeye while protecting Cultus Lake sockeye salmon which are coming through downstream from the Vedder River mouth. The sockeye salmon retention opportunities were available until September 19th, while retention of chinook, pink, chum never closed. Once the interior coho salmon run timing is over, the river also opened up for hatchery coho salmon retention in early October.

As mentioned in my previous post, chinook salmon retention in the Lower Fraser River has been opened throughout September for quite a few years now, due to the requests SFAC had made for many years prior to these management changes.

That is consistent with what I am seeing in the notices except for that one section of the river closing in 2011 for everything.  That was the only closure after September I could find.

[RalphH]

Rod and you are right in that chinook opening have been provided in September for farther back than I recall. As I said there have been openings  in odd numbered years when the Pinks run until at least 2007. In 2006 the River was open only below the mouth of the Harrison from Sept 7 until Oct 9th

Anyway it's hard to know what DFO may do this year. There's no guarantee it will open at all. Last year on the Squamish I chatted with a fellow from England who had come to fish chinook on the Fraser and it was closed. He was pissed and said he'd likely never come back but what was I say? In low water high temperature years they are closing all the salmon rivers in the Maritimes now & last year most rivers on the coast were closed until mid-Sept even though we had cool warm weather from the last half of August on.