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[MERC]

Go with the 44lb test slickshooter (red color).  It's marginally thicker than the orange (35lb) and will give you a bit more strength and insurance if you do hang up and need to pull free.  Slickshooter does get coily if left too long on the reel but will eventually straighten out.  Make sure to check frequently for small nicks though as those are real weak spots that will be a breakage point if you get hung up.

Mono running lines will give you better distance  but fly line style running lines will give you better control of your running line since you can grip them better, especially in wintertime when cold hands are the norm.  The Wulf Tracer running line is actually really nice, runs about $35-40 a spool although some people also like the ELF running line.

If you're practicing casting a skagit line, you will need a tip unless you put a floating tip on (see, still need a tip) with a section of mono leader, generally the length of the rod. Running straight leader off the end of a skagit tip won't work as there isn't anything to anchor the line in the water properly for your cast.  Bulk sinking tips work just fine IMO.  MOW tips were designed to allow you to adjust your sink rate without changing the length of the tip so you don't need to adjust your casting stroke.  Some people love them. I'm not big on them personally.

Also, you might want to seriously consider paying for a couple of hours of professional casting lessons.  It will really cut down on the learning curve and ensure that you don't pick up bad habits. You can learn a lot from videos and the internet BUT, a video won't see your cast and give you proper feedback  to correct your cast. A good casting instructor will. 

[HOOK]

For all the new spey casters and even the seasoned. FlyBC is doing their annual spey casting tune up on Dec 7th. We meet at the Train Bridge area starting around 10am. Some of the guys bring snack, coffee, soup.....etc and setup a nice little lunch. Feel free to bring something to add if you want 

Thought I would give the newbies a heads up because some of you may not be members


I will be there, possibly bringing one or both of my boys like I did last year.

[mastercaster]

I was planning to buy bulk T sink tips, but for the purposes of lerarning I was convinced to buy a couple pre done Rio tips. Looking a my tips here I have one "Skagit MOW tip" (what the hell does MOW mean?) in 10ft-T-11. The other one is also a Skagit MOW tips but it's an "iMOW Medium" in "2.5ft int/7.5ft t-11." From what I recall the first one is a straight sinking tip and the second has 2.5 feet of lightly sinking inermediate tip them the rest t-11.

Anyone think I should get anything else before hitting the river? Also I recall back when I learned to cast my s/h rod the instructor reccomended we used just the floating line - no tips to start. How about with the d/h rod? Would ya'll start with just the skagit head and a leader, or jump right in and learn to cast with the sink tips?

The 3 amigos (compact skagit gurus).....Mike McCune, Scott O'Donnell, and Ed Ward came up with the concept of integrating cheaters with a sinking tip section. Some peeople like them because your casting stroke doesn't need to change when you switch out the various tips while others, especially casting instructors, believe they tend to hinge.  I like to use Rio tips that have been cut to match the rod length......about 12' or so for my 13' rods.  I got them from buying a guy's versa tip setup for the price of dirt. 

You just have to make sure that if you use tips from a single hand setup that you need to jump up 2-3 line weights.  I use 10 wt. versa tips on my 7 wt. spey for example..... so the grain weight matches up properly with my skagit head weight since I have to chop 3' off them to match my rod length.  Bulk T8-14 is the cheapest way to go, though.  I just like the pre-manufactured loops of the others more.

As far as your last question is concerned and as Merc mentioned you need to cast with a tip on as opposed to just the head and leader for two reasons.  The weight of the tip (added to the weight of the head) is needed in order to load the rod properly.  Manufactures of all the skagit lines and rods take this into consideration when telling you which weight of line works for each rod (check the grain window for your rod).  BUT more  importantly, since all skagit casts are sustained anchor casts your tip needs to be sinking/ sitting in the water during the sweep so when you go into the forward casting stroke the rod will load in order to get the line out. 

All you need to do to discover this is to blow your anchor on purpose (pull the tip right out of the water during the sweep).  You'll find that your rod doesn't load at all and your line will likely land in a heap 30' in front of you!

A couple of hours of instruction will cut your learning curve down exponentially.  Seeing yourself on video is also a great idea in order to see what you're doing right or wrong and is much easier to do now with the invention of I-pads because almost everybody has access to them by owning their own or having a buddy whose got one.

[RalphH]

mono lines like Slick shooter do one thing well and that is shoot for distance. Handling is difficult - you should have a stripping basket and they are hell to mend. A standard braided core shooting line like the SA is probably the best value. I can cast over 90 feet with a standard integrated Skagit head and line. Hard understand why anyone would need more. Mono shooting lines are more oriented to boat and beach fishing in the salt or larger waters.

[Spawn Sack]

Whew! Thanks for all the great tips guys! I had to read over the entire thread again to try and absorb all the info...

So, although my line set up may or may not need some adjusting down the road, I've bought it, it's on the reel, and it's what I'll be starting with. I think I said before the staff member who sold me the lot fishes the same rod I have and almost the same reel, and he loves the line set up, so I figure if he likes it and reccomended it for me starting out it's probably good. The guy is a fly/spey instructor as well.

BNF81: I hear what you're saying about the 20lb running line possibly being a weak link. I was going to go up to the thicker connect core (30lb I think) but the staff told be that he tried it out on the same set up as mine and the 20lb casted noticably better. I guess I'll just have to hope that if I get a snag it's the fly/leader! I inquired about other shooting line like slick shooter and so on but I was advised for the purposes of getting started esp in the winter to go with what I got.

What do ya'll typically use for leaders? I've heard most ppl just use a straight piece of mono like 15lb Maxima.

HOOK: I won't have my lesson until after the 7th, so considering this is a "tune up" I think I'll give it a miss. But thanks for the info

MERC: Thanks makes sense about adding a tip to get the rod to laod I never through of that. Good thing I bought a couple to get me going.

Also I got a hold of the instructor who I've had s/h lessons with in the past. He is not doing his 2 day spey school until early into 2014. However he offered me a deal I think I'll jump on: for less than the price of the two day school which I was planning to take anyway, he'll do a 1-1 all day (7-8 hours) lesson. I don't know if I need THAT much 1-1 time but...I've had a couple 4 hour s/h lessons and I know the time FLYS by so I don't think a whole day on the river is too much. The instructor is a super guy and I know if we were "done early" he'd cut me a break on the price. I like the way he teaches so I'd like to stick with him. We're looking at around Dec.15th, if I'm not working boxing day I'll be taking the spey rod out for the derby!

[TayC]

What do ya'll typically use for leaders? I've heard most ppl just use a straight piece of mono like 15lb Maxima.

I usually use anywhere 8-15 lb maxima ug depending on the water.  I find it holds knots and doesn't get a many wind knots.  After 7 hours fishing I came across one wind knot, my friend had to change his leader multiple times that day and he was using flouro tippet.  Plus maxima is cheap!

[Spawn Sack]

Right on, so do guys use tapered leaders at all for spey fishing like in s/h fishing? I'm guessing not. Would be nice to use just a straight piece of mono/flouro. I've experimented a lot with different brands of flouro for river fishing and am generally not a fan.

For gear fishing my go-to leader line is Maxima UG in 8-15lb. Tried some berkley xt this year in 12lb and it was great too very strong! IMO the maxima is harder for fish to see in clear water. I used the xt lots in murkier water and hauled in many beast springs and chum with no issues. I don't have much confidence in the knot strength of flouro I even tried the "best" out there Seaguar blue lable and was super duper careful to tie the best improved clinch I could and made sure it was super cinched down and lubed really well. STILL I busted off a few good fish at the knot Pretty much done with flouro I just don't have any confidence in the knot strength.

[TayC]

Just straight mono leader for me off a tip! If I am fishing dries in the summer off my rage head I will make my own tapered leaders but for winter and sub surface just straight ug.

[HOOK]

SS - they only call it a "tune up" but its basically just a get together before steelhead season kicks into full gear. Like I said there is always a few complete newbies there eager to learn. Some don't even own a spey setup but come to try/test some out. Last year I think we had 4 "instructor types" helping people out. I remember one guy last year who had never cast a spey and after an hour or so was able to hit around 80' almost every cast  (some people just "get it")


in regards to leader - I have been using just a short chunk of 10lb but think I will step up to 15lb and when we say short its 18"-3' short unless your dry lining/ grease lining then its longer and lighter leaders usually

Clinch & Improved clinch are bad knots for flouro, they tend to cut into itself causing the line to break. I only use loop knots with flouro and have never had one break yet (I use Frog Hair). I also never use flouro river fishing because it just cant stand up to any abrasion caused by rocks or fish, tiny little knick in it and snap 

[Spawn Sack]

SS - they only call it a "tune up" but its basically just a get together before steelhead season kicks into full gear. Like I said there is always a few complete newbies there eager to learn. Some don't even own a spey setup but come to try/test some out. Last year I think we had 4 "instructor types" helping people out. I remember one guy last year who had never cast a spey and after an hour or so was able to hit around 80' almost every cast  (some people just "get it")


in regards to leader - I have been using just a short chunk of 10lb but think I will step up to 15lb and when we say short its 18"-3' short unless your dry lining/ grease lining then its longer and lighter leaders usually

Clinch & Improved clinch are bad knots for flouro, they tend to cut into itself causing the line to break. I only use loop knots with flouro and have never had one break yet (I use Frog Hair). I also never use flouro river fishing because it just cant stand up to any abrasion caused by rocks or fish, tiny little knick in it and snap 

Haha, well I checked my schedule am I AM off that day soooo...what the hell maybe I'll bring my new rod/reel down and giver a go My plan was to wait until my lesson (should be around the 2nd weeek of Dec just need to finalize date with the instructor). Not sure if I'll "get it" or if it will be a hard road. I had a pretty hard time learning to single hand spey and still am not overly hot at it (hence going to a two handed rod). I have heard skagit spey is easier to pick up - I guess we will see!

So I am assuming one needs to be a member of Flybc to attend this? Can you give me a link I can check out with the fees, or some info on this please?

Also funny about the flouro as it's often marketed as "more abrasion resistant than mono." I've had no issues using it for still waters. Normally an improved clinch to the barrel swivel then n/s loop knot to the fly. Never a problem. However gear fishing it on the river it has given me nothing but grief. Lots of fish snapped off some on a brand new leader first cast. Given its cost and my limited confidence in it I stick with mono 99% of the time and just use my noodley rod and 6-8lb mono leader in clear water. Still catch lots of fish and am not afraid to put the boots to them like I was with the flouro leades.

ANYway...glad to head all that's needed for steelies on the spey is a short piece of mono I have tons of spools I can sue

[mastercaster]

The fee for FlyBC is $50 payable to mastercaster, etc.  There's a 10% discount this week.  Oh, what the hell....it's almost Christmas.  This week it's free to join so have at 'er.

With fluorcarbon you get what you pay for.  Some is crap!  I use froghair as well but usually in clear water systems.  The rest of the time is 15. maxima for steelhead, 12 lb. for salmon.

Since my tips aren't looped I nail knot 20 lb. on each of them about a foot long which I loop at the end.  Then i can either loop a 2 1/2 foot piece of fluor or mono to it.  Haven't had any breakoffs with fish yet.  Any breakoffs that I have while getting hung up badly on the bottom or a snag has been at the fly.

[HOOK]

I do the same thing as MC in regards to sink tips. Most of mine are bulk T material so I create my own loop at the back end (which I colour code) and then Albright knot a short chunk of 25lb to the front which I then tie a double surgeons into to make the loop. From there you just again tie a double surgeons knot on your leader, loop-loop them together and then tie on your fly


No member fee to join FlyBC.............unless you want to pay MC the $50 then I get half  lol

[Spawn Sack]

HOOK or Mastercaster, sorry I kind of forgot about this Saturday's "tune up" but I'd still like to go if I can make it. Might have some family stuff to do that morning, but if I can get out of it I'd like to attend.

Can one of you guys fire me off an email to kcp@alumni.sfu.ca please? I'd just like some details such as is it still free to join? I'm not sure if you guys were just joking about the one week of free sign up or whatever.

I'm a tad nervous about showing up having never tried/cast the outfit I just bought. Seems a bit douchey of me, but you guys said there are some newbies each year so what the heck Weather depending I have a lesson arranged sometime in mid-december. The instructor and I agreed just to play the weather by ear and if it's supposed to be nice on day X and we're both free, then we'll go out.

Would also be nice to meet some other guys/gals who spey fish as well as I do not know a single angler who does

[HOOK]

membership is free to join FlyBC. there is no charge to attend the get together. we meet at the train bridge area. If you feel inclined you can bring some snacks to share  there is usually chili or something and snacks, im sure this year we will have a fire as well


Im heading out a little earlier to do a bit of swinging before the tune up but I should be there around 11am and staying until possibly 2pm at the latest. We stand around and shoot the sh** do some casting and some more experienced guys help out the new to spey folk. There is usually a bunch of different rods to play with also 

[Spawn Sack]

Right on I plan to attent unless I get called into work. Hoping it warms up a bit... I've been working outside this week and it's COLD