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Author Topic: PCB's in our fish.  (Read 2798 times)

A-BOATER

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PCB's in our fish.
« on: January 25, 2011, 04:13:32 PM »

Watched a tv program about the Orca whale pods in the PNW.  Groups that go into the Puget Sound in Wa. & in our area BC waters.
The marine scientists (bio) stated that Orcas are dying sooner then they once did. Life spans are shorter because of the VERY HIGH PCBs found in their systems...the males tend to be EXTRA LOADED with them as the females get rid of the chemicals as it is in the milk...but the problem is the baby Orcas get them.
The PCB's are now banned in Canada & the program pointed out that that only Russia that allows them to still be used.
(bet other countries are still dumping alot of PCBs in the oceans that we don't know about. China hasn't got the greatest environmental record either...India etc...many other countries)
When I was a floor waxer & did buildings(including industrial) all over the area...witnessed over flows of chemicals that MUST of landed into our waters.
All these chemicals (Rod sometime ago mentioned about all the plastic containers that land in the oceans) PCB's etc...that go into our waters ...get into the marine food chain & into the salmon ..into the whales.(of course whales do eat alot of salmon thus PCBs build up quickly) Heard stories how ALOT of the clean up wkers have died already after the Valdez spill in Alaskan waters.  Sadly I think the oceans can just take so much POLLUTIONS of the world & the oceans have become ONE BIG DUMPING GROUND...
my question is & concern is are our fish safe to eat ?????? They contain PCB's which cause CANCER.
Air pollution un-safe ground water tables in many areas (well water) Though I hear Chillowack has nearly the FRESHEST CLEANEST WATER IN THE WORLD    (GOES THREW LAYERS OF SAND THUS IT IS NATURALLY FILTERED)----Are you concerned about eating fish that have harmful chemicals in them??? Cancers are on the rise. ??? ??? ???



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Floater

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Re: PCB's in our fish.asda
« Reply #1 on: January 25, 2011, 05:28:41 PM »

I also saw the show, very heart warming story the PCB`s were informative and a bit scary but the part i found most, intresting was the orca language. I couldent believe that orcas who live around vancouver island and more southern ones have different ascents. Each pod had its own 12 or so unique calls thats passed down to each generation. Just amazing how little we know about nature and our place in it.
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Dogbreath

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Re: PCB's in our fish.
« Reply #2 on: January 25, 2011, 05:31:59 PM »

I'm not sure what OP is posting about-PCBs in Orcas or fish or Chilliwack.

FWIW-the ground water in the Fraser Valley is contaminated with cow my smelly socks so bad in some places it's not even funny I never drink the stuff ever.

I do eat Salmon weekly though.
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A-BOATER

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Re: PCB's in our fish.
« Reply #3 on: January 25, 2011, 07:37:48 PM »

Dogbreath  Take your pick ...but if ya read "carefully" the MAIN JEST of the post is on POLLUTION in our marine life & with ALL THE POLLUTION in our world ....& as the question at the end of my post asked a question.....Do ya trust the fish we eat as our salmon have PCBs in them ??? That was a hint what I was asking. ;D
PCBs cause cancer.
Floater glad ya caught the program !!! Yes I agree with ya about PCBs being "scary".
Also it is "neat" as ya say about the unique languages of these Orcas. Thought it was also intersting when they put that lost Orca in a sling it did not offer up a fight as it stayed calm...(trusted the people) ;)
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A-BOATER

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Re: PCB's in our fish.
« Reply #4 on: January 25, 2011, 10:24:39 PM »

UPDATE :  GOOD NEWS studies conclude that wild salmon have far less PCBs than beef (aprox 4x less)
So it is  A-OK to eat all the wild salmon that ya want too.
In your google or yahoo (whatever engine ya got) in the general search box type in:  ewg pcb in salmon

You will find some very very interesting info FOR SURE.  Ya can eat wild salmon daily no problem but farmed salmon has so much PCBs they recommend that ya eat ONLY 1 fish per month.  The fish meal (lots of oils) feed has ALOT OF PCBs & that's what they give to the penned fish .  :o  
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alwaysfishn

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Re: PCB's in our fish.
« Reply #5 on: January 25, 2011, 11:13:01 PM »

Ya can eat wild salmon daily no problem but farmed salmon has so much PCBs they recommend that ya eat ONLY 1 fish per month.  The fish meal (lots of oils) feed has ALOT OF PCBs & that's what they give to the penned fish .  :o   

When people hear that they may stop buying farmed salmon...   Isn't this what the fish farmers commercials were referring to?  ;D
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A-BOATER

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Re: PCB's in our fish.
« Reply #6 on: January 25, 2011, 11:38:23 PM »

Sadly many families with their small kids in tow may be going to restaurants around the world eating these farm salmon maybe even on a weekly basis thinking the salmon is healthy for them !!!
Really sad when there is no general OUT-CRY.  
But by the looks of it I think I'll be cutting down on my beef consumtion as well....seems pork & poultry along with wild salmon may be good choices.  But ya don't want the processed pork as then ya have the NITRATES (cancer hazard) ...guess I'll have to use the electric meat grinder...& prepare some ground pork.....

Getting hungry thinking about it already...add in chopped whole wheat crackers (4-5 of them) little salt pepper garlic ...mix in to the freshly ground pork....fry with lid on top of the frying pan with grape seed oil on medium heat (hi heat can smoke this oil & it will become harmful) ....whole wheat buns Ya get the idea. ;)
By the way dear please...throw that just fried farm salmon in the garbage ;D
alwaysfishn yes I've seen those commercials LATELY on the boob tube. Also more tv ads on one food store chain after it was known they do a smell taste on their meats & repackage if product smells ok. Guess when ya apply for a job one question is  How's your sense of smell ?  ::)  
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StillAqua

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Re: PCB's in our fish.
« Reply #7 on: January 26, 2011, 05:41:41 PM »

But by the looks of it I think I'll be cutting down on my beef consumtion as well....seems pork & poultry along with wild salmon may be good choices.  But ya don't want the processed pork as then ya have the NITRATES (cancer hazard) ...guess I'll have to use the electric meat grinder...& prepare some ground pork.....
NOT THE BACON!!!! Please, just shoot me.......
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shuswapsteve

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Re: PCB's in our fish.
« Reply #8 on: January 26, 2011, 10:35:32 PM »

Sorry to burst your bubble, A-BOATER but the coronary heart disease benefits (CHD) of eating farmed or even wild salmon far outweigh the risk of cancer caused by PCB in these fish.  It is unfortunate that common sense and perspective gets lost in this.

This is the study that first created most of the controversy: http://www.sciencemag.org/content/303/5655/226

It is true that PCBs cause cancer, but you also have to keep in mind the extremely small concentrations we are likely talking about which are in the parts per million or billion.  So, when you say "very high PCBs" or "extra loaded" you need to attach a number to it because what is it being compared to?  How long is a piece of string?  You idea of high may be quite small in the grand scheme of things.  The levels of PCBs found in the above study were less than 1/80th of the acceptable levels established by Health Canada (which is around 2 ppm).  That is very small.  PCBs are lipophilic meaning that they like to cling to fat, so animal meats that contain more fat like beef, pork and chicken likely contain more PCBs than salmon.  Keep that in mind while you enjoy your pork meal.  Farmed salmon probably has more fat than wild salmon; however, if you are still concerned about this you can remove any excess fat from the fish.  Despite this you are still further ahead eating farmed salmon than by not.  Trust me, you or one of your family members is more likely to die from CHD than from cancer caused by not eating enough salmon (whether it is farmed or wild) than by eating farmed salmon with extremely small concentrations of PCBs.  You are not in the same ball park if you think that cancer superseeds CHD concerns with this issue.  I don't see this as a farmed salmon vs. wild salmon in this regard.  It is a public health issue which clearly favours eating salmon whether it is farmed or not.

http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/hl-vs/iyh-vsv/environ/pcb-bpc-eng.php
http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/fn-an/surveill/other-autre/fish-poisson/index-eng.php
http://jama.ama-assn.org/content/296/15/1885.full


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A-BOATER

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Re: PCB's in our fish.
« Reply #9 on: January 31, 2011, 05:10:49 PM »

Ya just may have a point there WHO KNOWS .........

Wonder why scientists would tell people to eat MAX 1 farmed salmon per month ??? :o

Sometimes a person just does not know what INFO to trust. ;D


Just noticed ya have 1 post TOTAL.
Happy that my topic got ya stirred or moved to join FWR.

Will look for more & more of your posts ;)
« Last Edit: January 31, 2011, 05:13:48 PM by A-BOATER »
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Dave

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Re: PCB's in our fish.
« Reply #10 on: January 31, 2011, 08:12:47 PM »

Will look for more & more of your posts ;)

X2  great post!
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alwaysfishn

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Re: PCB's in our fish.
« Reply #11 on: January 31, 2011, 08:39:48 PM »

Sorry to burst your bubble, A-BOATER but the coronary heart disease benefits (CHD) of eating farmed or even wild salmon far outweigh the risk of cancer caused by PCB in these fish.  It is unfortunate that common sense and perspective gets lost in this.

This is the study that first created most of the controversy: http://www.sciencemag.org/content/303/5655/226

It is true that PCBs cause cancer, but you also have to keep in mind the extremely small concentrations we are likely talking about which are in the parts per million or billion.  So, when you say "very high PCBs" or "extra loaded" you need to attach a number to it because what is it being compared to?  How long is a piece of string?  You idea of high may be quite small in the grand scheme of things.  The levels of PCBs found in the above study were less than 1/80th of the acceptable levels established by Health Canada (which is around 2 ppm).  That is very small.  PCBs are lipophilic meaning that they like to cling to fat, so animal meats that contain more fat like beef, pork and chicken likely contain more PCBs than salmon.  Keep that in mind while you enjoy your pork meal.  Farmed salmon probably has more fat than wild salmon; however, if you are still concerned about this you can remove any excess fat from the fish.  Despite this you are still further ahead eating farmed salmon than by not.  Trust me, you or one of your family members is more likely to die from CHD than from cancer caused by not eating enough salmon (whether it is farmed or wild) than by eating farmed salmon with extremely small concentrations of PCBs.  You are not in the same ball park if you think that cancer superseeds CHD concerns with this issue.  I don't see this as a farmed salmon vs. wild salmon in this regard.  It is a public health issue which clearly favours eating salmon whether it is farmed or not.

http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/hl-vs/iyh-vsv/environ/pcb-bpc-eng.php
http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/fn-an/surveill/other-autre/fish-poisson/index-eng.php
http://jama.ama-assn.org/content/296/15/1885.full




That's the most convoluted explanation I've ever heard.....    Can I paraphrase?......

Farmed salmon have PCB's, and if you are concerned cut the fat off and while your eating those PCB's don't think about PCB's, think about how good salmon is for you.   ???   ::)
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shuswapsteve

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Re: PCB's in our fish.
« Reply #12 on: February 01, 2011, 09:37:36 PM »

Convoluted??  As I said in my post, if you are still concerned about PCB you can remove any excess fat from the fish.  However, even if you left the fat in you are still further ahead by eating farmed (or wild) salmon than by not eating it.  The benefits of eating farmed or wild salmon are greater than a 1000 fold than by avoiding farmed or wild salmon due to concerns over PCBs.

A-BOATER:
There are circumstances where individuals in our population (i.e. pregnant) are suggested to reduce the amount of certain seafood.  In addition, there are places in the world that are very contaminated so advisories on consumption are required.  However, the concentrations of PCBs we are talking about for the most part are extremely low.  I imagine many people view any concentration of PCB as unacceptable - no matter how small it is.  Fair enough, but keep in mind that you are likely consuming greater concentrations of PCB in your other meats like chicken, beef and pork.  What it boils down to is perception.  An individual reads a study claiming "high" concentrations of PCBs in farmed salmon....but compared to what?  How small or how large are the concentrations and how to do they compare to what you are already exposed to already?  How do the risks of eating or not eating farm salmon compare?  What level of PCB is too high for you?  If you look into this you will soon notice that you are more likely to succumb to CHD by not eating a diet that includes farmed or wild salmon.  However, to each their own.  I will continue eating either farmed or wild salmon because the benefits are pretty clear.

Not sure if I will post a lot on this forum as I frequent a couple others already.  It is not that I think you are not friendly.  I just saw this particular post and decided to respond to it.
« Last Edit: February 01, 2011, 09:40:10 PM by shuswapsteve »
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alwaysfishn

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Re: PCB's in our fish.
« Reply #13 on: February 02, 2011, 11:44:17 AM »

Convoluted??  As I said in my post, if you are still concerned about PCB you can remove any excess fat from the fish.  However, even if you left the fat in you are still further ahead by eating farmed (or wild) salmon than by not eating it.  The benefits of eating farmed or wild salmon are greater than a 1000 fold than by avoiding farmed or wild salmon due to concerns over PCBs.


I get your point even though I don't agree with it....   Take a look at the following video.

I guess we could say "......... eating our PCB laden farmed salmon is not as bad for your health as eating these basa fish..."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h1nEPzsFpc0
« Last Edit: February 02, 2011, 11:49:08 AM by alwaysfishn »
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troutbreath

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Re: PCB's in our fish.
« Reply #14 on: February 02, 2011, 03:38:19 PM »

So if I'm getting this right, choose your poisson carefully. Glad I never eat Basa. Thanks for the heads up alwaysfishn.
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another SLICE of dirty fish perhaps?