Well i managed a buck this weekend, dressed out at 140 lbs, after the 10-15lbs of bloodshot/torn to shreds meat we had to cut out. I saw this buck, stalked him to within 65 yards, shooting my 308. win BLR, I jacked a shell and let him have it. The rounds are factory hornady bullets, 308. 150 grain boat tail spire points, they're going 2800fps with just under 2900 foot pounds. I hit this deer right through both shoulders 3/4 of the way down, took out both lungs and heart, everything demolished. The entrance hole was like my pinky exit was probably 2 inches, but internally it was done. Buck dropped in his steps, i'm choked cus I wrecked a tone of flesh, the gun is grooping 4 rounds in a tooney at 125. (i head shot a grouse at 35yards) So i dont know, mabey the spire points are just gut busters, or the shell was off, but it really screwed up the buck.