Fishing with Rod Discussion Forum
Fishing in British Columbia => Fishing-related Issues & News => Topic started by: Nitroholic on May 23, 2011, 11:56:08 AM
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Cohen Commission
No one followed the B.C black-market salmon
MARK HUME | Columnist profile
VANCOUVER— From Monday's Globe and Mail
Published Sunday, May. 22, 2011 7:20PM EDT
He called himself “king of the Fraser River native fishery.” He had 20 guys working for him and could deliver big numbers of salmon.
In a conversation secretly taped by Department of Fisheries and Oceans investigators, he told two U.S. undercover agents posing as American fish buyers that in an average season he could supply 150,000 pounds of sockeye. But if the money was right, and guaranteed in advance, he could get 10 times that amount.
More related to this story
Former B.C. chief says sockeye was stolen from her band
Excluded transcript frustrates group at Cohen inquiry
Natives getting sweetheart deals from government, B.C. Tory leader says
And that was just sockeye. Chinook, chum and pink salmon could be delivered, too – all taken during periods when native communities were licensed to fish for food, social and ceremonial (FSC) needs.
The Cohen Commission of inquiry into the decline of sockeye salmon in the Fraser River heard last week from DFO enforcement officers, who suggested the FSC fishery is a cover for a lucrative, large-scale black-market operation. They testified that in one investigation they found 345,000 FSC salmon stored in industrial freezers, and that they believed 97 per cent of all FSC fish are sold illegally into the market, not distributed to native people, as intended.
“Most of the first-nations people … we deal with, by far the majority of them, are good people and sometimes those people get led astray. But there is a core group of people out there that simply are in it for themselves,” testified Scott Coultish, regional chief of intelligence and investigation services for DFO.
What the Cohen Commission didn’t hear was any testimony about the meeting between the agents and the “king” of the Fraser River native fishery. Phil Eidsvik, a non-lawyer who is at the hearings representing the BC Fisheries Survival Coalition and the Area D Salmon Gillnet Association, tried to get the transcript entered as evidence, but it was ruled out after a lawyer for a native coalition objected to its relevance.
The transcript, leaked to Mr. Eidsvik by a source he won’t identify, was made in 1989.
It is old, but one of the agents involved in that operation said in an e-mail to The Globe and Mail last week that it remains relevant today, because it gives an inside look at the illegal trade in food fish.
“What kind of chinook volume are we talking about?” one of the agents asked the king, after getting a commitment on sockeye.
“Ah, I would think that around here more than about 20 tonnes,” he said.
Pinks?
“I could probably get about 100,000 pounds pretty easy, “ he said.
The agent said he was interested in chum salmon, too, with fresh eggs, which had high value in the Japanese market.
“No problem with that as long as the price is right,” the king said.
“Do you think maybe … 300,000 pounds total on the chum?” the agent asked.
“Yeah, I think I’ve handled that much before,” he replied.
“Any problem if the payment is only in cash?”
“No, no, that’s, that’s the way I like it,” the king said.
In total he had just offered to supply the buyers with 590,000 pounds of native food fish.
Gail Sparrow, former chief of the Musqueam band, recently complained that many people on her reserve didn’t get their allocation of fish last year, even though 800,000 sockeye were harvested in the Fraser FSC fishery, because, on her reserve at least, most the salmon were taken off reserve by fishermen who illegally sold them.
It is probable the Musqueam fish went to a big dealer, like the king of the Fraser River, who was never charged in 1989, despite the damning nature of the comments he made on tape.
Why was the king never busted?
“We went with the tapes to the Department of Justice and they wouldn’t proceed because of a recent ruling by the Supreme Court, which forbid covert tapes where a police officer was present unless the suspect was aware of the tape being made,” said the former DFO agent. “We also tried to go through the justice system in the USA, but they felt that it was a Canadian problem.”
The Cohen Commission heard that the DFO investigation that found 345,000 FSC salmon in cold storage didn’t go anywhere, because enforcement couldn’t get funding to track the salmon after it left the freezer.
So we don’t know where those fish went. But maybe the king does. Apparently he’s still operating.
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/no-one-followed-the-bc-black-market-salmon/article2031554/
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Now I know why a friend told he there were a few new F150s and Cadillacs parked at the Albion dock when he went to buy some sockeye there last year.
It's one thing to sell a few fish out of the back of a truck but totally different when a syndicate is formed to illegally export fish.
We are talking hundreds of thousands (millions?) of dollars and I think it is unlikely that the money made it back to the band.
Too bad about the chum since it is only for the roe and there seems to be very small returns these days.
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Now I know why a friend told he there were a few new F150s and Cadillacs parked at the Albion dock when he went to buy some sockeye there last year.
It's one thing to sell a few fish out of the back of a truck but totally different when a syndicate is formed to illegally export fish.
We are talking hundreds of thousands (millions?) of dollars and I think it is unlikely that the money made it back to the band.
Too bad about the chum since it is only for the roe and there seems to be very small returns these days.
Even if the money made it back to the band, isn't there something wrong with the natives catching fish under a food and ceremonial license and then selling it for cash?
The other problem it creates is a cynical society which looks at what natives are getting away with and questioning why natives can get away with breaking the law and Caucasians can't!
I spoke to fishermen on the river last year that were coming back to the river multiple times during the day and each time they took a limit. Their rationalization was if the natives were ok to sell their "food and ceremonial fish" then whats the big deal with taking a few limits of sockeye..... I phoned in to the RAPP line a couple of times but have no idea if it was followed up as I did not receive any feed back.
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Did I read that right, this is from tapes made in 1989, don't they have anything more recent than that to present?
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There are numerous things that have been presented, this is just one of them.
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This aint right
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Illegal trade in native-caught salmon rampant: DFO
The decline of Fraser River sockeye salmon is the subject of a judicial inquiry led by retired judge Bruce Cohen.
File
By Jeff Nagel - BC Local News
Published: May 18, 2011 5:00 PM
Updated: May 18, 2011 5:57 PM
Aboriginal fisheries on the lower Fraser River are "out of control" and vast amounts of salmon supposed to go strictly for food, social and ceremonial purposes are instead sold on the black market.
That's the assessment of Department of Fisheries and Oceans (DFO) staff tabled in evidence this week at the Cohen Commission into the decline of Fraser sockeye.
DFO investigators estimated 97 per cent of lower Fraser sockeye harvested under aboriginal food fisheries are sold, according to one document summarizing internal department concerns after an April 2010 meeting.
Scott Coultish, who heads DFO's Intelligence and Investigation Services branch, defended the figure before the commission Tuesday, saying it reflects staff estimates.
That and other evidence filed at the inquiry gave fresh weight to long-running claims of widespread native poaching and illegal sale of salmon.
"The root cause of illegal harvest is the sale of that product," said the 2010 document.
A 2006 operational intelligence assessment by DFO's Special Investigations Unit warned illegal sales of First Nations-caught fish is widespread across B.C. via back door dealing to restaurants and fish shops as well as door-to-door sales.
"The FSC (food, social and ceremonial) First Nations fishery on the Lower Fraser River is largely out of control and should be considered in all contexts, a commercial fishery," the assessment said, warning DFO is "unable to effectively control the illegal sales."
Various methods and levels of sophistication allow First Nations-caught salmon to be laundered into regular commercial markets, it added.
The assessment called for more effort to identify and charge retail buyers in the Lower Mainland and said more resources are needed to step up enforcement.
The findings were in response to a 2005 probe by fishery officers who suspected large amounts of First Nations-caught sockeye was going into cold storage at outlets across the Lower Mainland for later illegal sale.
Project Ice Storm was an audit of 110 Lower Mainland fish plants that found 345,000 sockeye in storage as of September 2005.
That was the end of a season where low sockeye returns meant no commercial fishery was allowed, nor was any aboriginal economic opportunity fishing (a limited for-profit commercial fishery for First Nations.)
All the fish in the plants was therefore FSC fish and much of it seemed packaged for sale.
But the investigation ran out of funding, DFO officers never got proof any of the frozen salmon were sold and no prosecutions resulted, the inquiry was told.
Randy Nelson, DFO's director of conservation and protection in the Pacific region, said further budget cuts expected will likely continue to limit the department's ability to target illegal sales and poaching.
Although it's impossible to say how much illegal fishing happens, Nelson told the inquiry he believes it may account for hundreds of thousands of sockeye vanishing each year, but not millions.
Many people fish illegally, he said, not just First Nations.
Even when poachers are caught many never pay their fines.
There's more than $1 million in outstanding fines for illegal fishing in the Pacific region, according to an update tabled at the inquiry.
Sto:lo fisher advisor Ernie Crey, speaking outside the hearings, dismissed the allegation large amounts of sockeye are illegally sold by First Nations.
He said aboriginal people don't use traditional preservation methods as much and have increasingly turned to industrial freezers.
"It's not prohibited," Crey said. "We can do that if we choose, along with all other Canadians."
He said DFO wrongly assumed the fish in 2005 was destined for the black market.
"They don't have any direct evidence that's the case," he said.
B.C. Conservative party leader John Cummins said he feels vindicated by the evidence presented this week.
The longtime commercial fishermen was fined $200 in Surrey court Monday for his role in a 2002 protest fishery that tried to shame DFO into cracking down on aboriginal food fish sales.
"It just underscores what we have been protesting and saying all these years," Cummins said.
He said he doesn't blame First Nations for the entire downturn of Fraser sockeye, but he said they are part of the problem.
"It makes the management of the fishery so much more difficult for the department when they don't know how many are going upstream," Cummins said.
"The resource is at risk. If we don't do the right thing, we're going to lose it."
Cummins has not yet paid the latest $200 fine nor another one for $300 handed down last December for another fishing protest in 2001.
He said he hasn't yet decided whether he will pay.
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I say smoke screen. I personally feel this is another DFO trick to get all the fisher groups commercial, native , and sport, in-fighting again. Always bear in mind the the DFO has a mandate to promote the fish farm industry.
Yes there is a black market salmon industry, but 97% come-on. My question is why is this bought to the public now; 13 YEARS" after the accusation was made. I find it hard to believe that it is black market salmon are anywhere near the treat to out salmon, that open net pen fish farms are. I covered the the fish farm thing extensively in my news paper column, back in 95-96. Then as now the majority of joe public allowed the government paid spin doctors to direct all eyes away from open net pen fish farms and the masses of the sea lice they produce. No-one listened then, no-one listens now; I give up!
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Jeez another DFO conspiracy ::) why are we still on about sea lice? 28m sockeye last year, possibly 20m pinks this year. You say no one listened then and still aren’t… could it be due to the fact that recent science has shown sea lice are not the hot button issue people like yourself keep pushing?
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Do the math; the last two record salmon returns were from fry that went out when the government buckled to the public out cry and forced the fish farms to fallow their nets.
I'm tired of the blame being shifted from the commercial guys to the natives and back; and then for a change of pace the loggers and miners. While all the above place the blame on us sporties. Come on, we are all trying to clean up our act and their is volumes of documentation to prove it; so who is not pulling their weight here. I write for news papers and well know how to spin a story in any way I wish. Take it from one sees the inside; take everything you read with a grain of salt, find out where the write draws a paycheck from, and read between the line.
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So newsman, show us your version of how to spin. Show us some peer reviewed defensible data that positively implicates the "masses of farmed salmon sea lice" to salmonid declines in the Fraser River or any of it’s tributaries.
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Do the math; the last two record salmon returns were from fry that went out when the government buckled to the public out cry and forced the fish farms to fallow their nets.
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Dave, how does it feel to have a life-long career that has been based on conspiring to deceive the general Canadian public? ;D ;D ;D
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Dave, how does it feel to have a life-long career that has been based on conspiring to deceive the general Canadian public? ;D ;D ;D
Not sure if I will be able to sleep tonight ;)
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the amount of nets in the fraser has gotten progressively worse year after year, I dont doubt the fact they are selling as many as the report suggests. its not the biggest thing affecting the fraser sockeye but taking upwards of a million fish out of the river cant be helping anything...the thing that really bothers me is the roe fishery for pink and chum does....ive watched them slit the does and throw them back in the water along with dead males they catch in the nets too...and im talking by the thousands
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Do the math; the last two record salmon returns were from fry that went out when the government buckled to the public out cry and forced the fish farms to fallow their nets.
I'm tired of the blame being shifted from the commercial guys to the natives and back; and then for a change of pace the loggers and miners. While all the above place the blame on us sporties. Come on, we are all trying to clean up our act and their is volumes of documentation to prove it; so who is not pulling their weight here. I write for news papers and well know how to spin a story in any way I wish. Take it from one sees the inside; take everything you read with a grain of salt, find out where the write draws a paycheck from, and read between the line.
Instead of just covering the news you should trying knowing something about the topic, but I am used to reading articles in the paper that look more like something I would find in the National Inquirer – more sensationalism and little on fact. Fallowing is not a new practice that was initiated when the 2008 outmigrants went to sea. I find it hilarious that fish farm critics were predicting the demise of the 2008 Fraser Sockeye outmigrants basically saying that when they get lice they die...”that simple”, but when the adults returned in 2010 they needed to find an excuse so they said that the salmon farms suddenly cleaned up their act for that period of time. So, when the return is not as good does this mean that the farms decided to not fallow and visa versa....Give me a friking break...lol. If you have learned anything from the testimony at the Cohen Inquiry you should understand that the issue of Fraser Sockeye productivity has more to do than salmon farms.
http://www.agf.gov.bc.ca/ahc/fish_health/sealice_BA_monitoring.htm
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Instead of just covering the news you should trying knowing something about the topic, but I am used to reading articles in the paper that look more like something I would find in the National Inquirer – more sensationalism and little on fact.
Ha, Ha, that is a good one. I like it.
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Did I read that right, this is from tapes made in 1989, don't they have anything more recent than that to present?
Since the Supreme Court has ruled out covert tapes, what is left? Would they reject video taped evidence of the criminals in the act?
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The solution is not to blame, but to correctly monitor and enforce the law. It is like leaving the bank vaults open at night and then acting all surprised when money starts to go missing...gasp...there are dishonest people out there? Enforcement should be along the lines of prostitution, go after the Johns. All FSC fish should be tagged upon capture, tagging could be as simple as the removal of the pectoral fins (any fish found in the possession of the band not so tagged should be confiscated as illegally caught). Anyone caught purchasing tagged fish should be arrested and charged. A DFO officer could ask to see a restaurant's fish (removal of the fins prior to preparing the fish for a meal could be made illegal as well) and if the fins are removed, charge them. Knowing the fish they are buying are tagged and could be identified later may dissuade the buyers (the real criminals here), especially if a few restaurants are investigated and prosecuted publicly. Without a market, the syndicate has no reason to continue stealing fish from the bands. This could all be done for less cost than the investigation of the native fishers in 1989 must have cost. Why do they not do it? Perhaps newsman is on to something.
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The solution is not to blame, but to correctly monitor and enforce the law. It is like leaving the bank vaults open at night and then acting all surprised when money starts to go missing...gasp...there are dishonest people out there? Enforcement should be along the lines of prostitution, go after the Johns. All FSC fish should be tagged upon capture, tagging could be as simple as the removal of the pectoral fins (any fish found in the possession of the band not so tagged should be confiscated as illegally caught). Anyone caught purchasing tagged fish should be arrested and charged. A DFO officer could ask to see a restaurant's fish (removal of the fins prior to preparing the fish for a meal could be made illegal as well) and if the fins are removed, charge them. Knowing the fish they are buying are tagged and could be identified later may dissuade the buyers (the real criminals here), especially if a few restaurants are investigated and prosecuted publicly. Without a market, the syndicate has no reason to continue stealing fish from the bands. This could all be done for less cost than the investigation of the native fishers in 1989 must have cost. Why do they not do it? Perhaps newsman is on to something.
Good points, Sandman. What about the foreign market? How would you police that, without a very deeply-integrated task force? And task forces cost money, which is something governments hate spending...
J
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The solution is not to blame, but to correctly monitor and enforce the law. It is like leaving the bank vaults open at night and then acting all surprised when money starts to go missing...gasp...there are dishonest people out there? Enforcement should be along the lines of prostitution, go after the Johns. All FSC fish should be tagged upon capture, tagging could be as simple as the removal of the pectoral fins (any fish found in the possession of the band not so tagged should be confiscated as illegally caught). Anyone caught purchasing tagged fish should be arrested and charged. A DFO officer could ask to see a restaurant's fish (removal of the fins prior to preparing the fish for a meal could be made illegal as well) and if the fins are removed, charge them. Knowing the fish they are buying are tagged and could be identified later may dissuade the buyers (the real criminals here), especially if a few restaurants are investigated and prosecuted publicly. Without a market, the syndicate has no reason to continue stealing fish from the bands. This could all be done for less cost than the investigation of the native fishers in 1989 must have cost. Why do they not do it? Perhaps newsman is on to something.
ain't gonna happen while all the dudes in Ottawa collect ther big fat pay checks !
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What bothers me is the few dead sturgeons I see floating down on the Fraser River. I saw two about 8 feet last year and 4 footer this year. How many dead ones I don't see?
Is the Sturgeon fishing $27.00 tag fee stamp doing anything besides making money for the government? If it takes 50 to 75 years for the sturgeon fish to mature, should we be so proud of "Our Great Sturgeon Fishing?" Perhaps it should be stopped all together..? What do you think?
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What bothers me is the few dead sturgeons I see floating down on the Fraser River. I saw two about 8 feet last year and 4 footer this year. How many dead ones I don't see?
Is the Sturgeon fishing $27.00 tag fee stamp doing anything besides making money for the government? If it takes 50 to 75 years for the sturgeon fish to mature, should we be so proud of "Our Great Sturgeon Fishing?" Perhaps it should be stopped all together..? What do you think?
Well it is making the guide services and the services that service their clientele (hotels, fuel sales, gear, restaurants, etc) a lot of money, so as long as the lower Fraser population exhibits what could be considered "reasonably healthy population structures . . . A wide range of size-classes and maturity cohorts of white sturgeon. . . from immature juveniles to reproductively mature adults" (McKenzie 2000), then I would say a catch and release fishery is acceptable. Should the population start to show signs of aging and poor recruitment (fewer juveniles) then I would support a closure to protect the remaining stocks (like on the Nechako).
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Dave, how does it feel to have a life-long career that has been based on conspiring to deceive the general Canadian public? ;D ;D ;D
--the conspiracy if you choose to call it that is with the government not the individual workers of DFO.....
--Government conspiracy:... is simple... don't give enough funding for DFO to do the job they are mandated to do!
--I have never personally met a CO, DFO or Forest officer that did not want to do their job. Not only in enforcement but in research to conserve and protect!
--Why wasn't the "RIVER KING" case pursued... why weren't complaints from natives who alleged they did not get their allotments investigated??? I'll bet no CO or DFO or RCMP investigators were involved in a conspiracy of silence... but I'll also bet they were not given the time or money to properly investigate.
--I draw my parallel from forestry.... MOF staff cuts...Companies now police themselves under government policy of professional reliance...they're doing such a good job of self policing that there are way less violations than there were when MOF staff had the funding and experience to check them. I believe most of us can remember how well professional reliance worked out for Ontario Drinking Water Users.
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it still baffles me how u can look after ur oceans when ur based in Ottawa ? time to get rid of dfo !!! pay out those blood suckin $$$ maker managers and let the provinces with ocean look after them ! or bite my tongue let the natives run it ! they couldn't do any worse !
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Cohen Commission
No one followed the B.C black-market salmon
MARK HUME | Columnist profile
VANCOUVER— From Monday's Globe and Mail
Published Sunday, May. 22, 2011 7:20PM EDT
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/no-one-followed-the-bc-black-market-salmon/article2031554/
funny how the article isnt there anymore
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it still baffles me how u can look after ur oceans when ur based in Ottawa ? time to get rid of dfo !!! pay out those blood suckin $$$ maker managers and let the provinces with ocean look after them ! or bite my tongue let the natives run it ! they couldn't do any worse !
Ya lets lets the Liberals run our oceans. :-\ We would soon be reading about the sale of a large chunk of the Pacific Ocean.
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Ya lets lets the Liberals run our oceans. :-\ We would soon be reading about the sale of a large chunk of the Pacific Ocean.
Got that right brother!!! :D
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lmfao, you guys do realize that the bcliberals and the federal conservatives are the same animal rite?, the fact that the bcliberals even call themselves liberals is a lie and fraud in and of itself, they arent liberals whatsoever....holmes*
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lmfao, you guys do realize that the bcliberals and the federal conservatives are the same animal rite?, the fact that the bcliberals even call themselves liberals is a lie and fraud in and of itself, they arent liberals whatsoever....holmes*
Of course, there is nothing liberal about a BC Liberal. They Shanghaied the BC Liberal party in a move to unite the right leaning parties (right of the NDP) after the decimation of the Socred government.