Fishing with Rod Discussion Forum
Fishing in British Columbia => General Discussion => Topic started by: Every Day on January 18, 2016, 11:38:33 PM
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A friend sent me this tonight.
https://www.facebook.com/marla.billy.5/videos/vb.100000025241402/1131669216843909/?type=2&theater
This is a stock in extreme conservation concern. A stock that was completely closed down to recreational angling due to the lowest ever return recorded. This is why we need enforcement on these rivers - and why I truly believe that closures actually promote poaching. Do you think this would have happened in that (popular) run with someone else there? Probably not.
I'm pretty outraged right now. Conservation comes first... why can't everyone just be on the same page for once?! I've sent this in to RAPP, and I 'd encourage everyone else to do the same. If enough people report, maybe this will actually go somewhere...
Some pics that I've saved in case the video goes down..
Captioned:
"Was a good time out fishing :) Burton caught 3 while I got snagged and pulled in 6 branches from the river"
Posted 4:35 pm on January 18, 2016.
(https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xaf1/v/t1.0-9/12508842_10153166080101612_5644049554749757402_n.jpg?oh=ff4de5d79c370c62a1934de13a1fdca4&oe=573D935C)
(https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xlt1/v/t1.0-9/12508775_10153166080141612_1053888030735871070_n.jpg?oh=84ad221be628f79929db10d46623b502&oe=573A2579)
(https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xta1/v/t1.0-9/12494940_10153166080131612_8171017595673804382_n.jpg?oh=08cd349bfd5c03c25666a8ce46ebec4c&oe=5731A466)
(https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfl1/v/t1.0-9/12573122_10153166080186612_2113782857088877889_n.jpg?oh=a720b3cbde705e767ebae153e6218f5b&oe=57407431)
(https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpt1/v/t1.0-9/941043_10153166080226612_4442423728541047952_n.jpg?oh=491dcdcec40bb8a2beabfa205a44107d&oe=56FB80F8)
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P.S. I really want to keep this a respectful/civil discussion. No hateful terms/words/phrases thrown around please. Let's just focus on the fact that this is happening on not just the Thompson, but a number of other closed systems as well, by a number of different ethnic groups.
I also want to make clear that Conservation of a species is above all else. This is a stock in extreme conservation concern - there is no harvest, period. Conservation trumps all, and I hope that the COS deals with this accordingly with that mandate.
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I am amazed at how people openly breaks the law and then goes and post it on the internet for everyone to see. Are they really that stupid or are they just starving for attention ?
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This has been going on for decades! Now a buddy sends you pics and you act all shocked! It's everywhere ED, Everywhere!!!!
Good luck in the fight! You had better odds cashing in on the Power Ball last week!
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Conservation ? What is that word? That word no longer exists in this world.
I was told from a reliable source that the powers to be are allowing a increase in the bait fishery of the Georgian basin. That's the herring. I will find out more and post.
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Conservation first?
Don't be naïve, Dan. Poaching by FN has been going on forever.
The most we can do is what we have been doing all along, regardless of the ethnicity of the perpetrators.
O-R-R (Observe-Record-Report) is our only recourse.
Unless you yourself want to push the offending fellow into the water, release the fish and start another war with the injuns.
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def not cool. i have not had the chance to participate in this fishery which is on my bucket list but not if the system cant handle it.
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All these responses saying conservation doesn't exist, it's been going on forever, it wont stop... etc. are exactly why these things continue to happen. If no one stands up for what they believe, nothing will happen. If everyone lobby's their opinion hard enough, things will change.
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Video isn't working for me.
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I think it has been removed.
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Submitted a report. Was actually going through before the violation as evident by the photos.
I also screenshoted all the pics, they have also been taken down.
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All these responses saying conservation doesn't exist, it's been going on forever, it wont stop... etc. are exactly why these things continue to happen. If no one stands up for what they believe, nothing will happen. If everyone lobby's their opinion hard enough, things will change.
OK, I'll bite. What have you done so far to make a difference?
Concrete examples, please.
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I was involved in swims to count fish, brood stock fished 3 yrs. on the Oyster. Brood stock fish for the Quinsam hatchery for steelhead and cutthroats Protested the coal mine in the watershed of the Quinsam, warned the biologist of the decline of the steelhead in the Quinsam 4 yrs. before they closed most of the east coast rivers on Vancouver Island.
Recently been trying to convince the forester that looks after the head waters of Trout creek to refrain from logging a cut block in a sensitive wetland that feeds said creek.
I have a sore head from hitting it against a wall.
You had better hope that they don't pass the TPP trade agreement, or the TTIP or the other trade agreement that Canada is trying to get with Europe. You should find out about these issues and understand how the are going to affect your lives. Welcome to the Matrix, serf slave.
The government owns me and you from the time we are born to day we die. Check that out too.
Then after the shock of your life search for the real owner of this world and what he has to say about where we are in his time schedule
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BLAIR.
NO!
And your supply of strobe lite type giffs should add more than annoyance.
Just sayin' :o
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I was involved in swims to count fish, brood stock fished 3 yrs. on the Oyster. Brood stock fish for the Quinsam hatchery for steelhead and cutthroats Protested the coal mine in the watershed of the Quinsam, warned the biologist of the decline of the steelhead in the Quinsam 4 yrs. before they closed most of the east coast rivers on Vancouver Island.
Recently been trying to convince the forester that looks after the head waters of Trout creek to refrain from logging a cut block in a sensitive wetland that feeds said creek.
I have a sore head from hitting it against a wall.
You had better hope that they don't pass the TPP trade agreement, or the TTIP or the other trade agreement that Canada is trying to get with Europe. You should find out about these issues and understand how the are going to affect your lives. Welcome to the Matrix, serf slave.
The government owns me and you from the time we are born to day we die. Check that out too.
Then after the shock of your life search for the real owner of this world and what he has to say about where we are in his time schedule
Well said Islanddude! 8)
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Someone been drinking? ???
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Someone been drinking? ???
Not just you thinking that, I have no clue what he's on about. :-\
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FN have to make up their own mind about conservation i dont think any of us have the right to pass any judgment on their choice to still fish. The situation is way beyond complicated but the fact is stocks were not endangered pre contact.
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From what I have been able to find, there was no fishery for steelhead prior to "pre contact". If our society is required to consult with aboriginals do we not deserve the same.
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FN have to make up their own mind about conservation i dont think any of us have the right to pass any judgment on their choice to still fish. The situation is way beyond complicated but the fact is stocks were not endangered pre contact.
Seriously? That's a horrible excuse, as this isn't the 1700's, its 2016. Would you be happy if your doctor went "well a year ago you were perfectly healthy, I know you have cancer but hey, last year you were fine so we won't change anything"?
kinda what your suggesting.
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Seriously? That's a horrible excuse, as this isn't the 1700's, its 2016. Would you be happy if your doctor went "well a year ago you were perfectly healthy, I know you have cancer but hey, last year you were fine so we won't change anything"?
kinda what your suggesting.
Not, so. What he is suggesting is that it is difficult to pass judgement on FN for fishing a run that was endangered by the actions of the European invaders of their land. It does not justify what they are doing as good for the threatened stocks, but recognizes that the situation regarding FN rights to fish is complicated.
A proper analogy would be the doctor criticizing him for continuing to take a certain vitamin supplement for his cancer treatment because the plant supply for that medication was running low because the doctor had been over prescribing it to a bunch of drug users that now weren't going to be able to get their fix. While it is true that the supply is running low and it would be in the patient's best interest to stop taking the supplement before the plant supply, from which the treatment is synthesized, completely dries up, he still has a right to continue taking the supplement, since it was not he that caused the shortage in the first place. He is the one that needs to decide if it is in his best interest to conserve the supply he himself needs, even though it is not his fault it is running out.
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Not, so. What he is suggesting is that it is difficult to pass judgement on FN for fishing a run that was endangered by the actions of the European invaders of their land. It does not justify what they are doing as good for the threatened stocks, but recognizes that the situation regarding FN rights to fish is complicated.
A proper analogy would be the doctor criticizing him for continuing to take a certain vitamin supplement for his cancer treatment because the plant supply for that medication was running low because the doctor had been over prescribing it to a bunch of drug users that now weren't going to be able to get their fix. While it is true that the supply is running low and it would be in the patient's best interest to stop taking the supplement before the plant supply, from which the treatment is synthesized, completely dries up, he still has a right to continue taking the supplement, since it was not he that caused the shortage in the first place. He is the one that needs to decide if it is in his best interest to conserve the supply he himself needs, even though it is not his fault it is running out.
Well when the run is closed to fishing and he is out there fishing, blame can no longer be pointed at someone else if fish stock continues to decline as they are then part of the problem. With my analogy they are the "doctor" and the steelhead run is with cancer, so it is accurate.
Also considering they took down the video and pictures they know it is not kosher.
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From what I have been able to find, there was no fishery for steelhead prior to "pre contact". If our society is required to consult with aboriginals do we not deserve the same.
incorrect - they did take steelhead. Sometimes in considerable numbers. Any survey of FN subsistence I have seen (and I did my BA major in this area) lists steelhead as a species of fish FNs harvested on the coast
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Well when the run is closed to fishing and he is out there fishing, blame can no longer be pointed at someone else if fish stock continues to decline as they are then part of the problem. With my analogy they are the "doctor" and the steelhead run is with cancer, so it is accurate.
Also considering they took down the video and pictures they know it is not kosher.
Exactly, his right to fish does not justify his own role in the continued decline of the stock. At this point he only cares about putting food on the table. He will now be part of the blame if the run dies out completely in four years. It is just difficult when you are blamed, by the people that caused the problem, for not helping to fix the problem. I know he should help, he probably even knows he should.
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https://gyazo.com/37c5906e387ba1132f902c1dd8e69ce3
Apparently were caught on the Cowichan.
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https://gyazo.com/37c5906e387ba1132f902c1dd8e69ce3
Apparently were caught on the Cowichan.
Well the big one looks like a hatch, but pretty tough to identify a hatchery steelhead that has his back half cut off.
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Well the big one looks like a hatch, but pretty tough to identify a hatchery steelhead that has his back half cut off.
The hatchery getting fairly aggressive with their clipping! :o
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https://gyazo.com/37c5906e387ba1132f902c1dd8e69ce3
Apparently were caught on the Cowichan.
Well that's positive!!........last year they had a net stretched across the mouth of The Cowie
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Seriously? That's a horrible excuse, as this isn't the 1700's, its 2016. Would you be happy if your doctor went "well a year ago you were perfectly healthy, I know you have cancer but hey, last year you were fine so we won't change anything"?
kinda what your suggesting.
Sandman already answered that for me, so i will just say that FN internal politics when it comes to Fishing, hunting and land are so complicated that any judgments we pass on the situation are so irrelevant its not even funny. Yes that guy obviously knows the Steelhead in that river are low and yes his band probably has told him and the community hey guys lets not fish steelhead for food.
Problem is many people will claim hereditary Chief status and say hey i decide where i can and cant fish and im gona fish. Or the same can be said for parts of the river same guy can claim as his families harvesting grounds dating back pre contact. Since there is virtually no documented history for FN who knows what the truth is. Point is we know nothing about these things and to say oh this guy is poaching is not our place. In the end its not the rules that DFO (who are concerned more about Canadas trade agreements than any real conservation) or Band office sets, but you as the individual that has to make the right choice out there in the wild.
There is a war going on out on all the rivers and parks of Canada as we speak, and that is for our freedoms and rights to fish and hunt. Privet enterprise is being favored by our government and the individual is slowly losing his right to fish for sport and for a meal, hunting is also in the same boat. Last year in BC we lost a big chunk of our moose draw in favor of Guides and Lodges, so that foreign big spenders can come and enjoy killing a moose ( they def dont need the meat) A herring commercial fishery was open last year in the central north coast despite the worries of first nations and none first nation scientist that this would disrupt the recovery of the Eulachon in the area that have been gone for years. Many Provincial parks in the north have been transformed from a place to be enjoyed by the tax payers, to a "NO GO" zone during peak bear viewing season because, people are paying lodges big bucks to see a bear in pristine environment and they dont wana see some guy fishing there or enjoying a early September swim in a nice glazier fed hole.
First nations were stripped of all their right and land and now its happening to the rest of us, so next time you see a picture of some FN with a steelhead or a sockeye realize yah its a shitty situation but hey its only getting worse for ALL of us.