Fishing with Rod Discussion Forum
Fishing in British Columbia => General Discussion => Topic started by: buck on August 03, 2015, 10:55:38 AM
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Checked Peg Leg @ 9.00 AM to see how many flossers were out. I counted 40 and more were coming as I was leaving. We should start a lotto to see how long it takes DFO to close the river entirely or bar/ area closures.
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Or get a group of folks to walk down the river with a copy of the fishing notice and explain it.
Easier said than done I know that.
And if you're out numbered 40 to 1 it makes it even more difficult.
Most those folks probably only know the fishing is open and never actually read the notice.
(Clubs are optional)
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So I have read the notice,and why don't they state no bottom bouncing?Theres tons of guys out today flossing? I don't get it?So they must be able to cause DFO just drives by and says nothing to the hundreds of guys.
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Because, at the moment, there is too much grey area.
It makes enforcement difficult.
However fear ( I'm not talking intimidation tactics ) and peer pressure can be useful persuader's.
Some of those folks out there are ignorant by choice but so many are ignorant for lack of knowledge and know how.
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40 at Peg Leg. Wonder how many at Scale Bar.
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Not many at Bowmans when I took a boo.
Heard there was 50 at Peg, Buck's report and a lot at Snaggy Bar from a friend's report when driving by, he could not see Scale., near Hope, good name for it by the way. Sad to see those not heeding the request to Bar fish. I guess it is like the RCMP telling drivers to slow down and do texing, but a lot donot comply.
Of course the BC Liberals raised the speed limit on some highways. That does not make sense, the RCMP say slow down and Highway Minister Stone raises the limit, government at work at its worse.
Guess I will not get out Bar Fishing as a closure will soon happen when the reports from the monitors come in. The poor Leaf Craft is so sad this evening. :'(
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I fished at gill road this morning and was surprised that everyone there was bar fishing. Even my 2 year old daughter was bar fishing catching the northern pike minnows lol.
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I was at Gill as well across on the north side . I was suprised there was only one other boat over there at one of the most popular spring bars . No joy there , tried down by Jesperson ,a few boats achored there nothing again . And yes most fishers there were relaxing watching there rods socialising . I booted up to spagette bar pullled in tight to the beach . Shallow up there now . Another boat was anchored out . I set up the bar rod and plunked it out ,the boat pulled anchor and moved for me as he was doing something else ::) . Really slow out there , not much action anywhere that I could see . Just one boat drifting down the top of Spagette TOWing in a spring . Nice day on the river though 8) . Oh and the river is really muddy .
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Checked Pegleg this am and Ballum Rd. saw about 40 people. Saw one throwing spinners and a couple barfishing, the rest were TOW. ::) I give it a week and the river will be closed to salmon angling.
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Saw 2 TOW ers at Gill and one at Agassiz Rosedale Bridge, had a talk with him but he looked at me with a blank look.
Was please to see many bar rods out at Gill, saw the Master heading downstream most liky to my bar MLB.
You should have gone there as always better water conditions. :D
Going to give it a try this afternoon, from shore as need a nap and that is the best thing to do when bar fishing as you are sure to get one, stay tunned. ;D ;D
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This grey area is terrible. I'm sure there are guys who think if they throw a corkie on or some green wool they are targeting springs. The only thing this grey area law is encouraging is fights breaking out between bar fishermen trying to take the law into their own hands and bouncers who will say they aren't doing anything illegal.
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So let's make this clear - is it closed to bottom bouncing or is it open to bottom bouncing?
The only answer is "Yes".
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Heard a report from today, 2 boats on a bar. One boat towing, snagging away in the beating hot sun. The other boat plunking, drinking ice cold beer in the shade. Guess who got the only spring ;D Somebody's bell was ringing today!
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Hi just a newbie to salmon fishing and have seen a lot of discussion and I want to fish ethically. Is jiggingnfor salmon and casting spoons kosher?
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It's not necessarily what you use but how you use it.
ie. Jigging can be done ethically, working the lure properly to entice a strike. Or unethically, ripping it through a school of fish hoping to snag one by pure chance.
Fish in such way where you are honestly trying to get a fish to willingly bite your presentation and you'll find yourself beyond reproach.
edit: obviously there is no universal standard of 'ethical' . Some feel targeting salmon in rivers is unethical, others feel catch & release to be unethical and on it goes. With experience you'll come to decide where to draw the line for yourself
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It's not necessarily what you use but how you use it.
ie. Jigging can be done ethically, working the lure properly to entice a strike. Or unethically, ripping it through a school of fish hoping to snag one by pure chance.
Understood completely. Not sure why people would do the latter as it is no longer sport fishing. You have to accept the chance of bitter disappointment to make it exciting when you finally entice one to bite!
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So let's make this clear - is it closed to bottom bouncing or is it open to bottom bouncing?
The only answer is "Yes".
To quote DFO NOTICE FN0772 (that's the one that opened the river on August 3rd):
"There is no retention of sockeye salmon permitted at this time. Given the low abundance of sockeye and the expected en-route mortality, impacts on sockeye are to be minimized and DFO is working with all users of the resource to limit impacts on sockeye.
While fishing for pink, chinook and chum salmon, anglers should avoid using fishing methods that catch sockeye salmon and fish selectively.
The first principle of selective harvesting is to avoid catching non-targeted stocks. This means that anglers should use methods that do not catch sockeye. The following fishing methods enable anglers to catch pink, chinook and chum salmon and rarely intercept sockeye salmon:
Bar Fishing
Trolling Spoons at Creek mouths
Float Fishing
Pulling Plugs
Fly Fishing
We encourage anglers to continue to use these methods to target pink, chinook and chum while avoiding sockeye.
Please note that bottom bouncing is NOT considered a selective fishing method and is strongly discouraged. The Department requests that selective fishing techniques be used and will continue to closely monitor the situation to ensure impacts on sockeye are at a minimum.
Should DFO feel that the rate of compliance is insufficient to ensure the adequate passage of sockeye, spot closures or a "no fishing for salmon" restriction may result."
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gCJ9Z_HgFqc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eov11cglvf8
Here's a regular snagger who doesn't care if the fishery closes for everyone.
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Oh Mickey
You're so bad
You're so bad
You blow my mind
Hey Mickey!
Hey Mickey! > :(
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Oh Mickey, you're so bad
Can't you understand
It's guys like you Mickey
Oh what you do Mickey,
do Mickey
Don't ruin my fishing Mickey!! :(
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Big_Fish,
I'm looking at the length of line between hook and weight and assuming that the dude was bottom bouncing and not fishing in a more preferable way?
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Me thinks its the bouncing betty that gave it away as opposed to the length of his line between hook and weight ...
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On the bright side, it doesnt look like there are too many others BB'ing there. Hopefully that means majority are respecting the DFO request to not BB leaving a few special individuals like this one. He even says in the first video he landed a sockeye. Selective methods indeed...
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Me thinks its the bouncing betty that gave it away as opposed to the length of his line between hook and weight ...
I disagree, there is a huge difference between bottom bouncing and TOW. A proper bottom bouncing set up with a short leader is just as selective as ripping a fly across a river as dirty as the Fraser, or spoon. But since the DFO has asked to for people not to do it they should comply. Not looking to start a fight, and if I get attacked so be it! Just tired of people saying BB and flossing are the same thing.
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This grey area is terrible. I'm sure there are guys who think if they throw a corkie on or some green wool they are targeting springs. The only thing this grey area law is encouraging is fights breaking out between bar fishermen trying to take the law into their own hands and bouncers who will say they aren't doing anything illegal.
Well I can use a green corkie with green wool on a float rig with a 18" leader and catch spring.
Its not as much the gear, but how you use it
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I don't know if the effect of this thread would be very positive. It already has 3000 views and youtube videos of springs caught on consecutive days.... :o
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I heard FOC says 70 % of people out there are TOWing, from what I have seen that is incorrect although there is still too many doing it. Is FOC just saying that so they have an excuse to shut us down?
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Have you guys ever caught summer run steelhead in the Fraser Bar fishing? Just curious. I was bar fishing on the Columbia river in the states for steelhead last week, and it was a blast.
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Yes, I've seen several caught as a bi-catch in the lower Fraser while bar fishibg
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What is TOW?
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What is TOW?
Slang for flossing, "The Other Way."A thing I have not done for many years even though I can accept it in a small way for taking sockeye. My personally thought is I never want to take a fish by intentionally fishing in a way to snag it. Another sad thing many young people learn this method and know no other way to catch fish.
The only good part is if there is one is, It is good for the economy, especiaaly in the Valley as it generates millions of dollars when the sockeye is open, something that does not appear to bein the works this year but FOC works in funny ways some times. :-X
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Thanks!
I'm curious as to why flossing targets sockeye more than other fish, and why using spin and glows targets chinook and others. Are chinook still eating as they go upriver, do spin and glows trigger an aggressive reaction? This is my first season at it and I've much to learn...
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Thanks!
I'm curious as to why flossing targets sockeye more than other fish, and why using spin and glows targets chinook and others. Are chinook still eating as they go upriver, do spin and glows trigger an aggressive reaction? This is my first season at it and I've much to learn...
A lot of unknowns in fishing, many fishers have theories on what you ask but I am not sure so can not help you.
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I'm curious as to why flossing targets sockeye more than other fish, and why using spin and glows targets chinook and others.
I wouldnt say flossing targets sockeye more, but rather it targets all fish indiscriminately. If people get more sockeye while flossing, it's probably due to the fact that during the peak of the sockeye run, they are present in far greater numbers than literally everything else combined. Literally millions of fish.
As to why springs will take a bar fished Spin-n-glo, while sockeye ignore such offerings is a good question, and as Mr. Gadsen notes is mostly a mystery, though theories abound. While I dont believe chinook actively feed in rivers it surely must be triggering some sort of feeding/territorial instinct that causes them to bite.
For some reason once in fresh water, sockeye are mostly unwilling biters. People definitively can get them to actively take in clearer waters like the Vedder and Harrison, but in the murky Fraser, not so much, hence the proliferation of flossing. It's the only reliable method of taking sockeye in the Fraser by rod and reel that we know of so far.
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Interesting...
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I wouldnt say flossing targets sockeye more, but rather it targets all fish indiscriminately.
Exactly, it is NOT a "selective" fishing method.
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saw a horrific seen at peg leg yesterday i was only there for 20 mins aswell. I saw a nice chrome sockeye around 7lbs get dragged up on the rocks for 2 minutes plus while these idiots tried to get the hook out. Now this is why they are going to close the river for everyone.
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Close it...teach those idiots a lesson. A real shame! People to lazy or cheap to invest effort to actually sport fish...fool a fish to bite. The fuel and time...they should just go buy fish if it is meat they are after. All my fish has come out of saltwater on anchovy and hootchies...8 springs in 4 trips been really good out there.
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Bottom Bouncing with a long leader doesn't target anything in specific. More sockeye are intercepted simply because there are more numbers of sockeye than anything else (when the sockeye are actually in the river at the time of the activity). Anything that swims with its mouth continuously opening and closing is prone to eventually get a hook in the mouth from a long leader. Sometimes the hook gets them on the inside of the mouth sometimes it gets them on the outside of the mouth. If the mouth is closed and the leader goes over the head, there is a chance it gets snagged on a fin. The skill in this snagging comes from reading the water, knowing what weight to use to get the optimal sweep, knowing the angle to cast up river and ensuring the river bottom is going to promote a bounce. Sure corkie size, wool size, hook size and line weight all play a factor in resistance to water and high that the hook sweeps across the bottom but this is all a skill that one develops over years to perfect this method of snagging fish.
Only until long leader bottom bouncing is deemed to be officially snagging - I can't see how it can be legally enforced. Make bottom bouncing with long leaders illegal and enforce it appropriately. Don't stop a fishery due to subjective or interpretive methods of harvesting. Fishermen will figure out other ways of catching fish if one method is made illegal. Most will obey the law - some will not until you take away their gear and vehicle and impose large fines.
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Filmed this video today of a gentleman loosing a spring. I was there for 30 minutes and saw 3 springs bonked and also 2 pinks!! Lots of sockeyes were being caught. Wish people would just bar fish :-X
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T0kXNdC6r4o
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Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaand, now it's closed. What a shock! ;)
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>:( >:( >:( >:(
was gonna go bar fishing next weekend! :'(
I'd like to cause physical and financial pain to those idiot flossers
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>:( >:( >:( >:(
I'd like to cause physical and financial pain to those idiot flossers
Well, that escalated quickly....
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Doubtful the closure has anything to do with people flossing just look at the test fishing numbers and compare to other years the numbers dont lie !! Can you say 2009 all over again !! Hopefully this is just a bad year and not the ongoing trend for the future ....
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Doubtful the closure has anything to do with people flossing just look at the test fishing numbers and compare to other years the numbers dont lie !! Can you say 2009 all over again !! Hopefully this is just a bad year and not the ongoing trend for the future ....
Agreed, test numbers are concerning. In addition, they closed the tidal portion, where you cant really floss. Sad situation here.
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I noticed that some of the sockeye that were being caught and released were showing signs of diseases associated with the warmer water. I noticed diseased fish in the Columbia River when I was fishing last week. They were having problems with sturgeon dying on the columbia river. State biologists were looking at diseased sockeye as the main culprit, which was what the sturgeon were eating. Good thing I went out this morning and got one day of Bar fishing in. Look on the bright side, you can still bar fish for steelhead :)
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I live in a townhouse complex in Langley. Because people here know that I fish I have been asked by several people here to fillet sockeye for them
Sometimes 4 sometimes many more.
when I ask where they got the fish all they would say was that they were bought locally for $15 per fish.
must be bottom bouncers selling their catch, I can't think of where else they would be getting them, now multiply this by probably hundreds or even thousands of law abiding people all over Vancouver and its no wonder that our fish stocks are decreasing.
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I live in a townhouse complex in Langley. Because people here know that I fish I have been asked by several people here to fillet sockeye for them
Sometimes 4 sometimes many more.
when I ask where they got the fish all they would say was that they were bought locally for $15 per fish.
must be bottom bouncers selling their catch, I can't think of where else they would be getting them, now multiply this by probably hundreds or even thousands of law abiding people all over Vancouver and its no wonder that our fish stocks are decreasing.
They are native fish, not BB fish.
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I guess they were when then were caught but now they are in a bunch of freezers instead of swimming upstream to spawn, but if what you say is true and they are native fish I guess that makes it ok.
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I guess they were when then were caught but now they are in a bunch of freezers instead of swimming upstream to spawn, but if what you say is true and they are native fish I guess that makes it ok.
He means they are caught by natives and not bb`ers
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You can always tell a 'native' caught fish by the price , a bb'er would have to charge a hell of alot more for it to be worth it ..
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You can always tell a native caught fish by the net marks, I'm sure he would of noticed them when he was filleting them.
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It would be great if people stopped buying fish from people who sell them illegally.
People often only complain about the sellers but it's both the buyers and the sellers causing the issue. I'm new to these forums but already I've seen far more complaints about First Nations sellers then people like 76t7's neighbours. Funny thing is, they're both part of the problem of illegal fish sales ;)
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Get caught buying them face a fine while the one selling walks away free to net another day.
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Correct me if im wrong but aren't natives allowed to sell they're catch?? They call it an economic opportunity I believe. I remember last year they had roadside stands for legitimate sockeye sales. Ive never heard of any sporties selling fish we simply dont get enough for it to be lucrative , gill net vs. single barbless hook not to mention the cost of gas , gear , license etc...
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Correct me if im wrong but aren't natives allowed to sell they're catch?? They call it an economic opportunity I believe. I remember last year they had roadside stands for legitimate sockeye sales. Ive never heard of any sporties selling fish we simply dont get enough for it to be lucrative , gill net vs. single barbless hook not to mention the cost of gas , gear , license etc...
That's correct, if the fish are caught in economic opportunity openings. Legally, fish caught in communal openings like now, cannot be commercially sold.
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Alberni Sockeye typically show up in the Lower Mainland in July and into August. There's a local commercial fisher who does this and he's been charging $5 a lb for dressed fish. During the big runs such as last year and 2010 it was possible to buy fish $10 to $15 each off commercial boats at various docks in Steveston and up the river.
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I understand that legally they aren't supposed to sell during a communal opening but i dont believe that they actually do abide by this rule , im not saying all the native groups are doing this but every year its not hard to find a 15 dollar sockeye from the back of a pickup truck regardless of the type of opening they get .They let them sell fish one time but not another ? It doesnt work that way money is way too powerful to resist im sure of it . This is a whole other issue way off original topic but im just sayin ..
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Who's most at fault the HOOKER or the JOHN?
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Who's most at fault the HOOKER or the JOHN?
Maybe both. Or nobody. Or everyone? Maybe it's the politicians who made the laws, or the country's cultural heritage, or maybe the structure of the government has something to do with it.
Point is, when it comes to issues as complex as resource management (and a resource as in-demand as salmon), the answers are never easy.
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I live in a townhouse complex in Langley. Because people here know that I fish I have been asked by several people here to fillet sockeye for them
Sometimes 4 sometimes many more.
when I ask where they got the fish all they would say was that they were bought locally for $15 per fish.
must be bottom bouncers selling their catch, I can't think of where else they would be getting them, now multiply this by probably hundreds or even thousands of law abiding people all over Vancouver and its no wonder that our fish stocks are decreasing.
This post is hilarious on so many levels...
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Let's get rid of all the net fishing on the Fraser too?
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If the populations are so fragile that would be the sensible thing to do.
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Let's get rid of all the net fishing on the Fraser too?
The Fraser gillnet fishery has history. the rec. sockeye fishery is still considered new, it was created sometime in the 90's.
The problem is the Fraser river rec. sockeye fishery, it needs to be closed forever. The scene it creates on the river is discusting, not a "sport fish", and now this plague has spread to sport fish.
Close sockeye in the river, and create restrictions to remove flossing from the fisherman's arsenal, that includes the "split-shot fly fisherman" your not innocent either. Lol