Fishing with Rod Discussion Forum
Fishing in British Columbia => General Discussion => Topic started by: Tuckster on August 19, 2013, 11:27:35 AM
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Thought I would take a collection of opinions.
I have had difficult times up at the Squam as i normally use spoons and spinners. Visibility is killing me here. So upon some research i have found a few interesting things.
I have mentioned a few times on the forum that I am relatively new to BC fishing and am still learning the ropes. I ask for advice on pinks regularly, and the common thing is pink lures...especially in murky waters is the way to go because they can see it easier.
This seems to be fundamentally false, Pink/Red, like in clear water have the worst visibility of all colours that can be used.....as little as a few inches. Blues and greens have the greatest visibility even in the murkiest of water. This is all just based on how the wavelengths of light penetrate water. Shorther wavelengths of blue/violet penetrate much deeper than longer wavelengths of red/pink.
So i suppose my quandry is......Is the pink salmon liking pink lures simply a myth? Of course, if pinks actively feed on pink coloured food sources in the ocean (squids), than pink is the go to in the ocean. It's possible this gets thrown away in murky, non-ocean waters. Would a blue lure outfish a pink lure in dirty river water simply based on visibility alone? Is vibration and disturbance the greater option......run a fly behind a small attractor that throws out vibration?
Lots to consider......I am of course going to try out a few of my theories tomorrow at the Squamish. I will report back on success later on, but would love to hear some advice or crazy opinions!!
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Pinks eat shrimp, krill and plankton among other things. That's probably why they like pinks/reds.
But they will bite anything in my experience.
My best advice would be to get a book called "What fish see" by Colin Kageyama.
It will answer all your questions on colours.
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Awesome! i will check it out.
Yeah, pinks having a primarily pink diet will definately have an impact where visibility is decent.
My problem basically - is using pink lures in murky water actually detrimental to overall productivity?
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Mr. Kageyama, an optometrist, is big into brass and black spinners when the water is dirty. At least for Steelhead.
I wonder is if they would work for Pinks?
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Mr. Kageyama, an optometrist, is big into brass and black spinners when the water is dirty. At least for Steelhead.
I wonder is if they would work for Pinks?
I am trying this tomorrow. The theory goes that a sillhoutte of all one dark colour is easier to zone in on in the murk as no actual colours are visible.
I love trying unconventional things. I grew up fishing in Ontario where the fish are fewer and harder to catch. What works once rarely works again, so you frequently had to try crazy things to get into fish. Often it results in blown money of stuff that doesnt work......but occasionally you hit it right, and it's so nice heading out and outfishing everyone else on the water when you hit it right.
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At lower Fraser, when the water was quite murky, I've seen a guy using blue/purple spoons having better success for pink salmon than
people with the usual pink colored lures.
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use to fish with a guy who always had some colorado blades that he would chuck on the element of the stove to blacken and blue them up !
never saw him fish them thou, but he always had them !
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Good thread.
Let us know how you make out!
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Yes, very cool thread. I like hearing about the actual science behind fishing, in this case, how wavelengths penetrate water. It's hard to find information/books about actual behavior, something more than just "use ABC lure in XYZ water" please do keep us posted.
I've also heard the black lure for murky water argument; seems counter-intuitive but might just work!
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The easiest thing is to always have a good assortment of colours to try.
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I've also heard the black lure for murky water argument; seems counter-intuitive but might just work!
Yeah, it has no flash BUT it is essentially absorbing all wavelengths of light so kind of makes sense :)
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I don't use this method with spinners as i never use them. But i always go darker/cloudier days dark color, as well with low vis water dark lure, bright/sunny days bright color, and high vis water bright lure.
This is usually what i do except for some certain circumstances.
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Mr. Kagayama based his recommendations on several observations:
1. A lure has to be seen to attract a fish. There are obvious findings such as you can't see a green lure in green water against a green background. Fundamentally there has to be contrast.
2. He has done testing to see how colours lose their visibility at distance. Some colours fade with distance. Red shifts to black at distance.
3. The light underwater shifts towards blue. For visibility use colours fluorescent under blue light.
4. A fish eye sees approximately what humans can see.
5. Salmon eyes are optimized to see blue/green in the ocean and shift to red as they ripen.
6. Some lure pigments, especially the dyes used for flies lose their colour under blue light and look brown or black. Check your 'red' and 'orange' flies under blue light. You will be shocked.
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I have got them on blue stripe, copper with red fleck, purple spin-glo's and, fly fishing a number of years back, a guy outfished me 10 to 1 using green flies. When I switched to green BAM!, immediate action. Same happened with me on the Squamish a number of weeks back when I was getting zero on pink colorado's and had immediate success when I switched to copper crock with red fleck.
It seems they turn on to different colors at different times but I am still not sure if that is what is happening or if they simply happened to come on the bite shortly after I changed my lures. In all probability they will bite anything but there is a widespread belief out there that pink works best.
Just like every other mug out there pink is my goto choice and, when that isn't working I switch to something else. As others have pointed out on other threads pink works best simply because that is what people use the most. Maybe the best way to find out is to fish some other color when everybody else is using pink - see if you do better or the same.
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Fished a number of different painted blade finishes the last few days, neon Red and chartreuse/orange doing quite well also chartreuse/green they all worked just as we'll or better than pink, black blades worked very well also.
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Years ago when fishing for Springs in Lake Ontario in low light conditions (dawn/dusk) black and black/combos ALWAYS out fished other lures, with the exception of glow in the dark. If our lures were down around 100ft., dark was alway better than any other color. That being said, how about improvising.....try taking a black lure and paint a pink stripe or dots. The silhouette of the black may get the fish's attention and on closer examination the pink on the lure might trigger a strike. Just a thought. Tight lines.
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When I fish murky water, first I always wade out, put a swivel on the end of a section of my rod and attach and drag a few lures through the water to see what looks best as far as seeing contrast and movement is concerned. Your eyesight is close enough to a salmon or trout's eyesight that whatever looks most visible to you moving through the water will also show up best to the fish. Water can be murky for different reasons (dark mud, light glacial silt, tea-staining) and different colours, shapes and patterns all look different under different water and light conditions.
Then I think about whether I'm trying to imitate it's food or just piss it off......
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So I was at the Squamish yesterday and as it turns out.....was not nearly as murky as I was expecting. The fish were very, very thick in there and when I was casting spinners i could feel it smacking over fish non-stop. After two foul hooks in a row i switched to a straight dark colored jig under a float...just brilliant. I was in a pool of swirilng water, so the float didnt travel far. Hookups with every cast, just about every ont right in the top of the beak! which is what I was hoping for with a suspended jig.
In short......fishing was almost too good to truly see if color made much of a difference...but the method sure did.