Fishing with Rod Discussion Forum
Fishing in British Columbia => Fly Fishing Cafe => Topic started by: fishseeker on October 14, 2007, 08:26:34 AM
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To all of you who answered my previous questions on Chum fishing - thanks much for your answers. I got geared up as you recommended and it all casts beautifully ;D.
Eager to give it a go, I went out to the squamish/mamquam confluence yesterday morning and got skunked but it was still a great day and I didn't feel too bad because everybody else was in the same boat. In the 5 hours I fished between 7:30am and 1pm I only saw two chum caught - both in the same spot by different people at different times. Personally, I think they were lucky - they weren't doing anything any different to anybody else.
Being new to this I was careful to watch what others were doing and there are some things I am curious about:
- In the fast section of the Squamish near the confluence people with gear were casting a long way out. I could not get my line out more than 40 feet but two large (presumably chum) salmon splashed up about 2 meters in front of me - after that I kept my casts closer to the shore but still no takers. Is it better to cast further out?
- On the Mamquam river nobody was fishing beyond the railway bridge and I am a bit confused about that. According to the regulations we are allowed to take two chum below the BC rail bridge but it does not say anything about catch and release. Since I am not going to be keeping any, I assume this means I can fish beyond the railway bridge. I decided against it because nobody was doing this and I didn't want to risk anything
- Even more confusing: I got chatting to a guy who was all in good spirits because he took a Coho out of the Mamquam above the railway bridge. I get the impression from the regs that we are not allowed to take ANY salmon above the railway bridge but they don't explicitly state this.
Anyway, I am definitely going to go up there again - hopefully the number of Chum will increase.
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fishseeker, glad you had a good time.
The Squamish River has gotten busier during the fall salmon season in the past several years. When we fished it in the mid 90s, you may only see a few other people fishing each day. As the population grows in GVRD, this is pretty much expected as it is one of the closer rivers to Vancouver. That being said, the atmosphere among anglers is generally very pleasant, and hopefully it will remain that way. Regarding how far out the fish are, when we fished it ten years ago, we would only fish directly in front of us. Chum salmon travel pretty close to shore, as long as they are not disturbed. We fished very successfully by drifting our float through these shallow travelling lanes. The problem with more anglers in the river is that it only takes one person to start wading in the water before everyone starts doing the same. These days, it's quite common to see people wading out and standing in a line up to their thighs while fishing for chum salmon. It's also just as common to find surfacing and travelling fish behind them along the shallows while they fish. Casting far isn't necessary, you will have more success by fishing the slower water in front of you, as long as your depth control is correct. Also, standing in that water is extremely cold, I'm not sure how anyone can handle it for a long period of time.
Regarding the regulations on the Mamquam River, please see:
http://www.pac.dfo-mpo.gc.ca/recfish/Freshwater/region2_e.htm
If a section of the river is closed for salmon fishing, it would be indicated in the table as "no fishing for salmon" under that section. In this case, there is no mention of it, so catch and release of chum salmon can indeed be done above the railway bridge, there's no retention of chum salmon allowed in this section. In addition, one hatchery coho salmon is currently allowed upstream from the railway bridge too.
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Well, thank you Rodney.
I keep hearing how things were better in the past and that's really a shame but things are such as they are. All I feel I can do is be responsible with regards the way I fish and hope that others will do the same - I certainly don't want to be part of the problem. (I guess the future will see us all fishing for carp as the salmon slowly disappear if we are not careful).
Your info about casting distance is good to know...I did wade and stayed surprisingly warm considering how cold the river was but, like you say, it was probably not necessary. My depth control was definitely another issue - I had a fast sink tip line and kept my leader short but the river was fast and I am not sure I was getting it down deep enough. At first I was just using some orange yarn tied to a hook - eventually I switched to a weighted fly and that seemed to get down much faster. (The Mamquam was pretty shallow so I am not sure it was so much of an issue there).
Its also good to know about the regulations on the Mamquam river. Looking at this again, more carefully, I can see now that they allow retention of 1 coho and 2 Chinook upstream of the BC rail bridge - in time I will get better at reading the regulations.
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fishseeker, i have basically taught myself how to flyfish over the last two and a half years. all i can say is pratice, practice, practice. i have learnt how to fish all types of water and at certain times learnt that every type can be successful. when you are down at the water watch what the guys are doing who are successful. feel it out and if they are open to giving you some pointers dont be afraid to ask like you have done here(i say feel it out because when i started out i ran into the odd @sshole but most guys are more than willing to point you in the right direction). for chum i prefer faster water because the fish tend to be moving instead of holding and you can get into fresher fish. today for instance though we were fishing slower moving deeper water and had alot of success. trial by error once you have been pointed in the right direction is the only way to go, through this you may find some new things out too which is great. i have been skunked many times in the last couple years but if you keep hitting the river and dont stick to what isnt working (switch it up if you are skunked for a while) you will learn a great deal. grinding it out makes it so much better when you become successful.
good luck
tight lines
derek
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fishseeker, i have basically taught myself how to flyfish over the last two and a half years. all i can say is pratice, practice, practice. i have learnt how to fish all types of water and at certain times learnt that every type can be successful. when you are down at the water watch what the guys are doing who are successful. feel it out and if they are open to giving you some pointers dont be afraid to ask like you have done here(i say feel it out because when i started out i ran into the odd @sshole but most guys are more than willing to point you in the right direction). for chum i prefer faster water because the fish tend to be moving instead of holding and you can get into fresher fish. today for instance though we were fishing slower moving deeper water and had alot of success. trial by error once you have been pointed in the right direction is the only way to go, through this you may find some new things out too which is great. i have been skunked many times in the last couple years but if you keep hitting the river and dont stick to what isnt working (switch it up if you are skunked for a while) you will learn a great deal. grinding it out makes it so much better when you become successful.
good luck
tight lines
derek
Hey thanks Derek, its definitely been slow progress so far. I started fly fishing a year ago and, most of the time, I do get skunked. I don't get discouraged because I enjoy being out on the water for it's own sake and there is always the anticipation associated with the notion that this time I *might* get something. So far I have managed a few trout flyfisihg from my inflatable raft and a bass from the shore. I have at least got past many of the challenges associated with casting, timing the strike and playing in the fish. If it was easy the sport wouldn't be particularly interesting anyway.
I think the significant part of the problem I had this first year is the desire to go out and try all waters everywhere. I now believe I might done better if I picked a limited number of spots and just worked those. (Thanks to great articles on this site I got the Chub fishing on the fraser figured out in just this way. I know many people don't think of this as "real" fishing but it taught me a lot about the influence of tides on fish behaviour and how to do hook ups successfully).
Like you say, it does pay to watch what others are doing and, these days, I am trying to spend half as much time observing as actually fishing. I will keep in mind what you have told me about the faster water - the two Chums I saw caught were, indeed, pulled out of very swift and surprisingly shallow water.
By the way, I am not sure what you mean by "switching it up" if I get skunked for a while. I assume that means changing tactics by changing fly, fishing deeper etc. So far I haven't got quite enough experience to know how to change tactics but I guess that will just need to evolve over time.
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by switching it up i meant new colors, change spots, and tactics etc etc etc. dont be afraid of changing what you are doing. also when the fishing is really good it doesnt hurt to experiment as well. i am constantly changing flies even when i am getting fish.
good luck
derek
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OK, thanks Derek - I am definitely going to take your advice on this.
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Fishseeker
do you only fish on weekends ???
I get week days off(less people fishing)
I will be heading up there next week(if the fish are in ha ha) and could give you a few pointers
I am by no means an expert but i have had success catching Chum, Pinks, Ho's, Rainbows and Steelhead on the fly
many times the fly fishermen will out fish the gear chuckers at the Squish
and dont get me wrong i chuck gear too (short float method)
as fighting big Chums all day on the fly is hard on the arms
the reason i wade in a bit is to allow for my swing to finish in the zone(this is where most of the fish bite)
i have caught many fish behind the wading gear chuckers
you dont need to throw it out too far
just learn how to mend your line and use the right sinking line for the speed of the water
keeping your fly in the zone
Stick with it its all worth the effort to get that heart stopping tug on your fly line
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agreed britguy, maybe ill meet up with you guys. hopefully the fish are in on a consistent basis soon. im starting to get worried they will forget to show.
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Sad to say I am a weekend warrior most of the time - one of the downsides associated with holding down a regular job I'm afraid :(
That said, I am extremely fired up to get myself at least one Salmon before the season is over and I was actually planning to take a day off next week - just so I could avoid all the crowds I banged into last weekend (provided I can get my boss to let me go). So if I can arrange this and you guys are up for it I will be happy to meet you there - just let me know when and where. (Any day and any time is fine by me - I can get up very early if necessary).
Britguy, I know very well what you mean about those heart stopping tugs on the line. I have never caught a Salmon but I did a fair bit of course fishing for carp and catfish in South Africa back in the mists of time when I used to live there. I know the rush associated with getting something large on the end of a line and I have been addicted to it ever since. (It took about 10 years of no fishing before I realized this but that's another story).
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if we end up meeting up there are alot of places that arent all that secret and you do not need to deal with the crowds that are at the mouth of the mamquam/squamish bar. im sure we could go elsewhere if you guys are up this way.
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OK, its finalized. I am going to take a day off next week. Just let me know what day and where and I will see you there. (I am familiar with the railway crossing over the Mamquam and the pool just below it).
PS: I live in Burnaby so if either of you are on the way or nearby let me know - I could give you a ride. Whatever works best.
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fishseeker i live in Coquitlam but have transport
i think i am off Mon Tue but will find out in the morning
Tuesday would be better to give the river chance to clear up
Britguy
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Hi Britguy, I had this all arranged but an urgent family issue has come up and I am going to need a day next week to deal with so I will have to bail.
It's really too bad because I was itching to get out there again. With luck there will be a chance to meet up some other time.
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No probs fishseeker
family comes first
I might give it a miss up there too till this rain backs off
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hi guys!
britt guy i think we know each other from earlier this year. i think we did a float down the seymour looking for winter runs. we drove up to the hatchery together and talk about fly fishing for pinks (off the beach). if this is indeed you i would really like to get together and chat/fish.
talk to you soon!
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i had good success with using a moderate sink tip and changing up wool flies till you find one they like...I also did like rodney suggested and fish in behind the lineup out further....i also lift my rod a few times on the swing..for some reason they chum seem to love hitting um on the uptake..i love flyfishing for chum, damn near my favorite fly fishery...nothing like seeing a swirl down below your floating line and thinking, wonder what that was and then seeing your line take off and the hard pull of the fish....wait till you hear your sinktip ripping through the water on it's way out to the middle of the flow...hope you got a decent reel with a good drag system.. ;D as those are some fiesty fish and an absolute blast to fight on the fly...
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Well guys I just wanted to say a big thank you for all the help and advice on this and my previous thread.
I managed to get out to the Squamish/Mam confluence on Friday and got this one:
http://www.fishingwithrod.com/member/gallery/fishseeker/FirstSalmon (http://www.fishingwithrod.com/member/gallery/fishseeker/FirstSalmon)
It was the first Salmon I have ever caught and the culmination of much effort. I am glad I got that 9wt to handle this because this fish was strong and it would almost certainly have broken my 6wt.
By the way, thanks for your advice on 'switching it up' Derek. For the first few hours I was not having any success - it was a bit of a gong show on the Squamish river and I could see most other people were not doing too well either. I watched those who were being successful moved about, tried different strategies and eventually ended up getting multiple hookups with only one caught. (All except this one broke off)
This one was not the Silver Chum I have heard so many people talk about but the fight was still very hard - a real adrenaline rush! Also, thanks to bbronsky on that reel you recommended, the drag performed brilliantly - I am very happy with it. I played around with different options and I did find that I could keep the drag low and palm it but I had to make bloody sure to keep my fingers out of the way - the speed of those runs were really something.
Xgolfman, I have just read your post and I wish I had looked at it more closely before I took off. I observed much the same thing - all the hits I got were on the swing - I didn't try lifting my rod a few times but it's something I am going to remember next time (PS: Chartruese wool seemed to work best for me.)
PS: Any ideas on how much this fish weighed? Looking at the picture i would guess it was about 70cm long.
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12lbs.
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im going out there tomorrow. has anyone been out in the last couple of days?
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was out two days ago and had an alright day, got a nice wild coho to shore and hooked quite a few chum but my run of futility continued with me losing most of them.
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thanks dereke
i will let you know how it goes tomorrow if your not going out.
i had a look at some of your pics and i tied up some prawn patterns black and pink.cant wait to get out there! ;D
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i wont be back out till around wednesday thursday. two graveyards left for me. let me know how it goes..
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there were some people out today
not slot of fish.i got one on my 3rd cast and lost him then nothing.only saw about 6 fish to the beach all day.really slow.I'm working and wont be able to get out until next week if your around it would be nice to hook up with someone who really knows the area.let me know if your into it dereke?