Fishing with Rod Discussion Forum
Fishing in British Columbia => General Discussion => Topic started by: TrophyHunter on August 16, 2007, 09:16:40 PM
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I heard from a reliable source today that the Fraser will be closed to ALL salmon fishing starting this Sunday the 19th, I was also asked to spread the word so here it is !! I was kinda surprised that nobody had posted this yet
cheers TH
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The official DFO announcement is not out yet, however it will be tomorrow.
Political decision.
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Say goodbye pink fishing...
BUMMER.
Nicole
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The official DFO announcement is not out yet, however it will be tomorrow.
Political decision.
Will that be to ALL for ALL sectors?
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I hope they don't consider sturgeon fishing with roe, barfishing for springs.
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The area between Mission Bridge and Hope will be closed to fishing for salmon as of midnight Sunday. This apparantly was due to the low run size for sockeye and the high incidence of non-selective fishing (bottom bouncing) in that area and the impact this is having on sockeye. Other species are still open. It seems that the closure will remain in place till the majority of sockeye are through the area. The area below Mission remains open. We were told that the First Nation food fishery will also be closed this weekend to allow the fish to pass.
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Dion..... it's a bit of a NO BRAINER bud..... use ooligans for sturgeon.... you won't be targetting salmon for sure. I used nothin but oolies yesterday.... caught 5 in 3 hours from 3 feet to 8 feet. My sonar is one of those super high definition units.... loads of salmon cruising under the boat and i don't think even one stopped for a sniff of my oolies. I coulda used roe but then that wouldn't be selectively fishing for sturgeon now would it.
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Oolies have done play all for me this year. Apparently dewies have been the big ticket lately (boss got 3 over 8' on 'em last week), but once the pinks hit the river in full force you wont see me using anything but roe and salmon parts. It wont matter though since I rarely fish above the Mission bridge.
Thanks for the info ever_hopefull.
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Let's not panic here. I highly doubt that there's going to be a blanket closure of the entire Fraser system.
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http://www.canada.com/vancouversun/story.html?id=462280a6-a392-4ed7-ad2d-9a4e10dc4f6c&k=4807
Fishery closed
Scarce sockeye prompts DFO to close section of Fraser river to sports fishing, other closures may follow
Kelly Sinoski, Vancouver Sun
Published: Thursday, August 16, 2007
All sports fishing on the Fraser River between Mission and Hope will be halted indefinitely as of midnight Sunday in a move to spare B.C.'s dramatically declining sockeye salmon stocks.
That section of the river was chosen for closure because that's where sports fishing has the biggest impact on sockeye, Debbie Sneddon of the Department of Fisheries and Oceans officials said today.
Sneddon said she wasn't sure how long the recreational fishery would be closed, but there would have to be a "significant increase in run size" for it to reopen.
Other areas could be closed later, depending on sockeye levels, she told a conference call with first nations members today.
The government has already closed the commercial fishery for sockeye on the Fraser River as the summer run shapes up to be one of the worst in 40 years.
The DFO had expected 45,000 fish in the season's first run but only 13,000 showed up, while only 120,000 of 169,000 anticipated fish arrived in the second, or early summer run.
It also forecast 2.4 million fish for the late Fraser run, but that has now been downgraded to 750,000.
The decision to close the recreational fishery above Mission followed calls by first nations in the past month for DFO to take that action.
The Sto:lo Tribal Council said the collapse of this summer's sockeye runs has created a "hardship" for first nations communities.
During the conference call, first nations members asked why it took the government so long to halt recreational fishing when first nations are struggling to catch enough fish to meet their food, social and ceremonial needs. They also argued that the entire sport fishery in the lower Fraser should be closed because the anglers will just move to a new location; many are already fishing in the Fraser Canyon, they said.
Ernie Crey, fisheries adviser to the Sto:lo Tribal Council, said after the conference call that sport fishermen are on the river ostensibly to fish for chinook but end up snagging hundreds of sockeye.
Sneddon said during the call that there is a limited amount of fish available for all first nations and urged band leaders to find ways to share the available catch amongst themselves.
"We do not have enough fish to meet everyone's needs," she said.
Sneddon acknowledged the closure was short notice, as such a salmon shortage wasn't expected until 2008.
The depleted stocks have prompted the Tsleil-Wauthuth First Nation, also known as the Burrard Band, to voluntarily agree to a sockeye embargo on the Fraser because of concerns that taking any fish could jeopardize future stocks.
But other band leaders argued it shouldn't be up to them to put an allocation plan in place.
Yale band chief Robert Hope said the government has failed to consult his band about the fishery closures.
"I understand there are 81,000 TAC [total allowable catch] out there and I'd like to explore all the options of how we can access these fish," Hope said. "We haven't even determined our share. "I suggest we get to the table and talk; we're going to go out and take our fish."
(http://a123.g.akamai.net/f/123/12465/1d/media.canada.com/8975269b-0529-4353-a446-596d133824d2/%20sun0811-fishing1.jpg?size=l)
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During the conference call, first nations members asked why it took the government so long to halt recreational fishing when first nations are struggling to catch enough fish to meet their food, social and ceremonial needs. They also argued that the entire sport fishery in the lower Fraser should be closed because the anglers will just move to a new location; many are already fishing in the Fraser Canyon, they said.
for some reason this paragraph makes me shake my head >:( it sounds to me that First Nations don't know what the word "share" means...
Rec fishers put huge amounts of money into fisheries and deserve an equal share !!!
man this pisses me off !!!
TH
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yes I agree with you, CONSERVATION FIRST!
>:(
Nicole
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So does that mean the Fraser River below the Mission Highway bridge will still be open to fishing? And if so will a person have to purchase a tidal license too?
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So does that mean the Fraser River below the Mission Highway bridge will still be open to fishing? And if so will a person have to purchase a tidal license too?
Yes and Yes
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So does that mean the Fraser River below the Mission Highway bridge will still be open to fishing? And if so will a person have to purchase a tidal license too?
Only if you want to fish down there :D
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so be it....maybe now all the whining and bickering will stop.
as for first nations...if they really are the champions of our resources then they should comply with DFO.....if DFO decides to exclude them from the ban, then it only confirms their lack of commitment and their own spineless, stupidity.
me....i'm going to renew my tidal license and get re-familiarized with the chuck once again.
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i hear that .... i been getting my fair dose of salt this summer so far and ..... i don't think i'll be back to the rivers (other than sturgies here an there) till steelhead come round. I'll have to take the nephew out for some pinkies in the lower.... but other than that.... now that we've got the second boat going...... Vancouver salt here i come ;D
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very stupid decision!!
most impact of conservation is "destruction of fish habitat".
second most impact of conservation is " over fishery".
dfo is all responsible for those issues.
angler's affection for the conservation concern is less than 5%. i belive.
now sockey fishing is closed, not many anglers are fishing there.
i know not all anglers argree to the bb. however, recent response of some anglers is very supportive to the this decision.
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if im rich, i would bring a beautiful boat to my favorite fishing spot.
or i can hire a fishing guide from most desirable fishing charter business...
but, sadly i cant. it the reason i go to fraser.
probably, you guys are all good sportsfosherman. but im not.
i fish both for fun and food.
which is more cruel? fish for food, or fun??
maybe im a bad fisherman, or others are hypocrites.....
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From FN's (Fraser Valley tribes) response that tells you how resource conciouse they are. But heck what can you expect from them, back then when canneries opened everywhere, many were the employees did they do something to stop exploiting the resource? Heck no. At least the main stream society is doing something to recover the resource. With this said, good to see Tsleil-Waututh First Nation is willing to help out.
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not to beat the dead horse or spur more debate but i really think us sporties need to let conservation come first . I love them tasty sox but I also have no qualms about a complete salmon closure from the mission bridge on up for a few cycles. I don't think we can reach a situation where every angler is happy with that but..... I remember a day when conservation came first.
The cheam and sto lo are greedy pigs and don't care about the plight of the fish... that is plain to see. Because of this, I think we sporties need to step back and impact the fraser salmon as little as possible and hope that as many as possible get by the nets of death. I'm not going to go preaching and berating those who don't agree with my sentiments, but i for one, with the exception of a few lower river pinks should it open, am hanging up my bar rods and my flossin gear for the next coupla years. There are many opportunities to catch fish for fun and for the table without fishing salmon from the main stem fraser. Like any change, it all starts with the individual.
So... close it up... i'll miss the fun for sure but with a clear conscience.
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I agree we need to help as much as we can. But while our tax money and all sorts are put into protecting and enhancing the salmon stock and seeing those people selling netted salmon for cash (no income tax there) and us not allowed to fish for any salmon is just plan annoying. And the government just kept on picking on us and not doing anything with them just annoys me more.
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I agree we need to help as much as we can. But while our tax money and all sorts are put into protecting and enhancing the salmon stock and seeing those people selling netted salmon for cash (no income tax there) and us not allowed to fish for any salmon is just plan annoying. And the government just kept on picking on us and not doing anything with them just annoys me more.
That's it in a nutshell !!!!! The Government has difficult decisions to make , I get that .... but closing the river to the group that has the least impact is hogwash !! if they are truly worried about the survival rate of fish then they would close the river to FN also...
TH
I guess this is another case of the the loudest voice gets fed first :(
maybe it's time we all stop paying our taxes ?? what are they going to do arrest everyone ;)
TH
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Doesn't look to me like this is just a salmon closure it says all sports fishing, the DFO has been making requests that sportsfishers refrain from using methods that impact sockeye from the beginning of the year these requests have been ignored why does this closure suprise anyone. As for closing all sports fisheries it makes it way easier to police, if you see a fishing rod out that person is breaking the law it's that simple. As for the guiding industry I feel sorry for th 5% of them that supported the fisheries requests and wouldn't use methods that impacted the sockeye, but as a lot of people have stated on this forum "majority rules" and the majority of sports anglers on the river in the last few weeks are the ones responsible for getting it closed down.
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:-* ya iv ebeen pushing for it and am sick of people bouncin . it' s like me cruising by the bars picking people off with a 7mm. What's the outrage then??? Still bouncing???
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Doesn't look to me like this is just a salmon closure it says all sports fishing, the DFO has been making requests that sportsfishers refrain from using methods that impact sockeye from the beginning of the year these requests have been ignored why does this closure suprise anyone. As for closing all sports fisheries it makes it way easier to police, if you see a fishing rod out that person is breaking the law it's that simple. As for the guiding industry I feel sorry for th 5% of them that supported the fisheries requests and wouldn't use methods that impacted the sockeye, but as a lot of people have stated on this forum "majority rules" and the majority of sports anglers on the river in the last few weeks are the ones responsible for getting it closed down.
Nice try, however I would bet that the real reason ( No one would say this from the government) is the pressure from the F/N.
They have said that if they are off the water then ALL must be off the water, otherwise they will still fish.
Puts the Government in the position that they must close the river to all or face the wrath of the F/N.
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I would happily give up my socks not to see another flosser on the cap/vedder/chehalis/seymour etc etc. Sportsfishing and its core values are being dragged down the tubes by flossing. I am glad about this closure.
One thing that drives my crazy though...this is a pink year, the fraser has tons of chum each year...historically, do natives only eat sockeye? I know as a commercial fisherman the dollar value placed on each species. Is chum an unacceptable food source for natives? I really question their main goal (ie food or PROFIT) when they pass up on fish I would put on my own family's dinner table.
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they must close the river to all or face the wrath of the F/N.
That's funny and silly.
Is the wrath of the the F/N anything like the Wrath of Khan?
I didn't think they even had a warbird.
(http://www.solidsender.com/dstrbo/news/wrath_of_khan.gif)
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they must close the river to all or face the wrath of the F/N.
That's funny and silly.
Is the wrath of the the F/N anything like the Wrath of Khan?
I didn't think they even had a warbird.
(http://www.solidsender.com/dstrbo/news/wrath_of_khan.gif)
OK read this and see if this covers the subject for you.
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/LAC.20070817.BCSUE17/TPStory/TPNational/BritishColumbia/
Think Fraser River bands all doing this.
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OK read this and see if this covers the subject for you.
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/LAC.20070817.BCSUE17/TPStory/TPNational/BritishColumbia/
Think Fraser River bands all doing this.
That's just a court case. Meh. Lawyers and such. Settlement out of court 99% of the time.
You call that "wrath"??
"Wrath" is a Warbird or Negh'Var class Dreadnought targeting its photon torpedoes onto DFO headquarters.
(http://www.cloudster.com/sets&vehicles/Klingon/klingon30a.jpg)
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That's ok. I have a couple nice little spots picked out on the lower for pinks. Haven't been to the upper for almost 2 months, cost to much for gas. I would rather drive 5 min to the lower and get me some nice fresh pinks, hopefully they will start showing up in numbers soon. Then out for early Coho, I heard that we are supposed to have a bit of a rebound year for Coho, is this true? :)
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While this closure is the result of First Nations pressure it is not the First Nations fault, they are concerned because while their fishing opportunities have been severely restricted (although not totally curtailed) this year they could still go down to the river seven days a week and watch people fishing with rods (I won't even use the term sportsfishermen here) killing sockeye just for the fun of catching and releasing them. There is no use pointing fingers at the FN's here the fault is completely within our own community. I'm sure glad hunting season starts soon I think I'll take my 22 out and just wound a bunch of does that is what the C&R sockeye fishing mentality strikes me as.
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You call that "wrath"??
"Wrath" is a Warbird or Negh'Var class Dreadnought targeting its photon torpedoes onto DFO headquarters.
I think you need more sun ;)
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You call that "wrath"??
"Wrath" is a Warbird or Negh'Var class Dreadnought targeting its photon torpedoes onto DFO headquarters.
I think you need more sun ;)
Probably, but I think people taking this way too seriously using words like "wrath".
Just showing them how silly it is.
I know you see it Dragon, others don't.
Go catch a carp.
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Has anyone seen the OFFICIAL notice of this? DFO? Provincial Fisheries? Anything?
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I talked to Roger from Hub's this morning and he told me the Fraser is closing from the Mission Bridge upstream to the bridge at Hope as of midnight this Sunday night Aug 19/07. The only places that are open with no retention of sockeye are the mouth of the Vedder and the mouth of the Harrison to the Highway bridge at Kilby park. The Fraser is still open for Sturgeon fishing only. :'(
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Does this include the Pitt River? I'd be sad if it's closed too...My favorite fishing spot :D
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Sure Nosey, say what you want. Mortality rate of C&R is about 10% with bad handling that 25%. When there's total fishing closure for all sectors (including FN) from catching sockeye, and guess what they KILLED over 43,000 sockeyes. Furether, if they do have a little concern for the stock at least apply for chinook openings by using driftnet or dipnet NOT set net. At least with driftnet those poor fish will have a chance of being released alive.
So they're not responsible eh? They took part.
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"They took part" and so did sport fisherman or the so called ones. ::)
If a closure was to happen, how many of you that have been bouncing that said why dont they have the balls to close the river if there so concerned will have the balls to keep at it just because the recreational sector uses less of the resource. Probably not too many beacuse there wont be a loop hole to jump through and get around it. Again if a closure happens, you, the ones that did not obey the request, will be the ones to blame.
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Sure, blame on BBers, and who's speaking up for those 43,000+ sockeyes that got slaughtered by FN?
Oh ya, and glx, DFO called for all method that can catch sockeye not to be used. Unfortunately, with that type of wording that includes barfishing. Oh and don't start that thing about 'oh barfish rarely catch sockeye' routine, let it be one sockeye it is still a method that WILL catch sockeye.
Oh and by the way, [edited - unnecessary vitriol] what have you done to aid the recovery of those sockeye stock?
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Going to be interesting to see the hoards of people fishing all the feeder rivers, Stave, Vedder,Squamish etc.
Will be interesting to see if they open this section of the river at all to pinks.
Timing is poor as there are either sockeye or Thompson Coho in the river.
Going to be real interesting.
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Yah can't blame BBing for this, the natives would have pressured government regardless of method... Even if everyone of us was barfishing.
The fact that we were fishing at all is more of the issue... And now whatever FN caught doing it shall be called a hypocrite... There have been 35,000 sockeye caught already, and the fact they want us off the river makes me think we should all be going for regular boat rides, and document all the nets that will be drift netting over the bars we would normally be fishing...
I personally think that court is no longer the answer... That's a waste of time.
We need to be more guerilla in our tactics to ensure those who sell their catch PAY.
Cheers,
Nicole
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one other point everyone is missing on this so called closure now there will be no-one out monitoring and reporting the illegal native nets.
Want to bet that the roadside sales of sockeye won't stop.
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What have I done? I have chosen too obey the request and have told many others why they shouldnt be doing what there doing. Did they all listen, nope, but some did. Stop using the excuse about the Native fishery. Thats all it is, an excuse. What they do is what they do. We dont have control over it. Hopefully one day there will be control of all the interested parties. But until then do your part, suck it up, stop your pissiing and moaning about what others do and watch out for yourself.
And no they didnt ask for all methods that catch Sockeye to not be used, they asked anglers to use selective techniques to minimize the capture of Sockeye. As for selective methods, barfishing is considered selective, according to a notice from the Sportfishing advisory committie.
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put together some statistics from my trips over the past 6 weeks to various bars and rivers.
Total hours fished 63 hours
number of fisherman seen 321
total springs seen hooked 37 fraser, 22 vedder
total springs seen snagged 9 of 37 fraser, 11 of 22 vedder(most were lost)
total springs seen snagged and kept 0 fraser, 1 vedder fisheries talked to the guy)
total springs landed 29 of 37, 16 of 22
total sockeye seen hooked 43 (all but two released in water)
total sockeye seen abused 2 (dragged on rocks)
My own score 6 springs hooked, 4 springs landed (2 fraser, 2 vedder) and kept .
1 foul hookedspring on vedder released in water.
1 small pink released, and 5 sockeye all released in the water(1 in vedder).
So over 6 weekends only 43 sockeye interacted with by all the anglers I saw fishing and if you go with 25% mortality rate that is only 10 sockeye over the entire period.
Multiply by number of bars and other fish areas ( I was at the ones you can get too where most people fish) I doubt whether more than 100 sockeye will be killed in 6 weeks.
So congrats for blowing the sockeye interaction way out of proportion to reality. Oh and last week end I saw fisheries twice go by in their boat with binoculars way across the river, how they can come up with meaning full numbers from that distance is beyond me other than the number of people fishing. The good news is the drift net that went by for two miles down the river and cleaned out the fish on Sunday disappeared after the fisheries boat went by.
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http://www-ops2.pac.dfo-mpo.gc.ca/xnet/content/fns/index.cfm?pg=view_notice&lang=en&DOC_ID=103462&ID=recreational
Effective 00:01 hours Monday August 20, 2007 until further notice, there is no recreational fishing for all Salmon species from the downstream side of the CPR Bridge at Mission upstream to the Highway No. 1 Bridge at Hope, BC.
Current run size estimates of 120,000 Early Summer-run sockeye and 750,000 Summer-run sockeye are significantly below preseason expectations of 690,000 and 3,369,000, respectively. The limited amount of TAC remaining is required for First Nations food, social and ceremonial purposes.
The Departments first priority is to ensure that there is sufficient sockeye escapement to the spawning grounds for conservation purposes. The Department is also committed to providing top priority, after conservation, to First Nations fishing for food, social and ceremonial purposes.
Despite a no fishing for sockeye regulation for the sport fishery, DFO continued to observe and receive reports that sockeye were being encountered in the recreational fishery.
DFO is implementing this salmon closure in the recreational fishery to ensure the above priorities are provided. This salmon closure will be reviewed weekly.
Recreational fishing opportunities for trout, steelhead and sturgeon and other non-salmon species remain open.
Variation order 2007-305 is in effect.
Notes:
Did you witness suspicious fishing activity or a violation? If so, please call the Fisheries and Ocean Canada 24-hour toll free Observe, Record, Report line at (800) 465-4336.
For the 24 hour recorded opening and closure line, call toll free at (866) 431-FISH.
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Recreational fishing opportunities for trout, steelhead and sturgeon and other non-salmon species remain open.
Woohoo.
Can you bottom bounce for sturgeon?
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That's ok. I have a couple nice little spots picked out on the lower for pinks. Haven't been to the upper for almost 2 months, cost to much for gas. I would rather drive 5 min to the lower and get me some nice fresh pinks, hopefully they will start showing up in numbers soon. Then out for early Coho, I heard that we are supposed to have a bit of a rebound year for Coho, is this true? :)
I have heard the same and if the numbers that were and are still showing on the west side of VA are any indication then it should be a decent year....we can only hope!
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I've stated this fact over the past years but i'll repeat it.
I used to have close ties to the cheam through friends who are band members and are relatives of the former chief of the cheam. I, for several years had a letter of passage from band council to acces thier land for hunting and fishing privleges. I am also a member of B.C.' s METIS NATION.
My friend was the bands fishery manager for many years until about 4 years ago when he just had enough. The tradition among first nations is that only certain families have traditional fishing grounds. My friends was saddle rock area. What he saw happening was that any F.N. with ties to the band were arriving on the reserve lands during the sockeye migration and declaring thier right to fish. Do you all know that the government are the ones who pay for thier boats, thier nets, thier boots, thier gloves..... every single part of thier fishery is subsidized by both the provincial and federal governments. Then these "stewards" of the resource turn around and sell thier catch for TAX FREE $$$$
I have personally witnessed on numerous occasions, the drift netting AT NIGHT with nets tied together to achieve a BANK TO BANK drift. NOTHING GETS BY THAT and I guarantee that this is happening again this season.
An important thing to remember here is that it is not just us sporties who are crying foul over this issue of the cheam and sto lo nations over fishing the resource. First Nations groups from far up the fraser hate the cheam as well and if this was a hundred or so years ago..... there would be war over it.
It's not just an issue of fish either. There are other first nations groups that practice the same disregard when it comes to hunting big game. I have photos of 53 deer of all ages and both sexes, harvested at night with the use of military rados, and spotlight equiped motor bikes, atv's and 4x4's. The gunshots started at dusk and did not stop throughout the night. Also any hunters ever wonder why they closed the doe draws for the lower mainland of region 2??? Because the natives did nothing but ride around at night and shoot everything in sight. Anyone who hunts the harrison valley east road will know what i'm talking about.
The thing is this.... there is simply nothing u sporties can do to curb F.N. behavior by ranting off on the internet, this lies soley in government hands.
My advice to you is ORGANIZE AND QUIT BICKERING, rodneys been preachin that throughout. ORGANIZE or SHUT THE HELL UP.
Do what the saskatchewan farmers did. Gather in a group and head to victoria, call the news, and make a big stink.... take your tents, a weeks worth of food and necessities and STAND UP AND BE HEARD. If you are not prepared to do that..... than for the love of god..... shut the F*** up.
With that, I off to Nootka, where the F.N's are real nice, there's LOTS of fish to be had for everyone...... and you don't have to floss em :D
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Another article...
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20070817.wsockeye0817/BNStory/National/home
Harvest of Fraser sockeye curtailed
Canadian Press
August 17, 2007 at 4:37 PM EDT
Victoria — The collapse of this summer's sockeye run on the largest salmon-producing river system in the world means no commercial or recreational fishing of the fish and seriously curtailed access for First Nations.
But a senior official with Fisheries and Oceans Canada is confident there will be enough sockeye entering British Columbia's Fraser River to ensure good spawning, which is the bottom line.
And while no sockeye are being pulled from the Fraser for sale to the public, there are still millions returning to other parts of the Pacific Coast to ensure that grocery stores and restaurants will still have sockeye for sale, albeit fewer and more expensive.
The forecast had been for 6.3 million sockeye to swim up the Fraser River from the Pacific this year, but the bottom has fallen out of that prediction.
Based on test fishing and monitoring, Fisheries has revised that forecast steeply down to just 1.6 million sockeye.
“At that level, there is not enough for commercial fisheries or recreational fisheries and there's not enough to meet all First Nations needs,” said Paul Ryall, who leads the salmon team at Fisheries and chairs the Fraser River Panel, the management mechanism under the Pacific Salmon Treaty with the United States.
In a normal year, about one million Fraser River sockeye would be earmarked for food, social and ceremonial use by First Nations.
As of mid-August, Mr. Ryall said about 100,000 sockeye had been taken by aboriginal fishermen and there may be a chance twice that number could be allocated.
“We think that we could harvest safely about 150,000 to 200,000 at the current run size, so there would be the ability to have some [further] very limited harvest for First Nations only,” he said.
In the international, multi-jursdictional world of salmon management on the Fraser, the Number One priority is conservation and the need to get enough fish back to the spawning grounds to produce future generations.
Next in line comes the obligation to First Nations. Commercial and recreational fisheries rank at the bottom.
According to the Sto:Lo Tribal Council, the limited harvest is creating hardship for all the First Nations of the Fraser and there are concerns there may not be enough sockeye to feed elders and families this winter.
“Frankly, I've not seen a summer such as this in 40 years,” said Grand Chief Ron John in a letter to Fisheries on Aug. 16.
The Sto:Lo have complained recreational fishermen on the Fraser are taking untold numbers of sockeye.
They accused Fisheries of allowing the Fraser River sport fishery to become “a macabre and destructive force” and have called on the department to close down the sport fishery.
Late this week, authorities made the decision to shut down a 40-kilometre stretch of the lower Fraser, from Mission Bridge to Hope, to all recreational salmon fishing, effective 12:01 a.m. Aug. 20.
The move is designed to eliminate the number of sockeye inadvertantly snared by sport fishermen.
Mel Kotyk, Fisheries' acting area director for the lower Fraser, said First Nations leaders were generally pleased with move, but in a teleconference call made it clear they thought the sport closure should have covered a larger area of the river and its ocean approaches.
“They like the direction, but they felt it should have gone further,” Mr. Kotyk said Friday.
Commercial fishermen, who rely on sockeye as their “money” fish, are also worried.
“It's devastating for those who just fish in the south and don't have licences to fish other parts of the coast,” said Irvin Figg, president of the United Fishermen and Allied Workers union, now a part of the autoworkers' union.
He estimated up to 600 fishermen may be affected.
“For them, the season's just going to be a write off.”
He said commercial harvest of sockeye was also banned by Fisheries for conservation reasons in 2005, despite an unprecedented return of what is known as the Horsefly run.
The collapse of the 2007 sockeye is being largely blamed on poor survival in the ocean of fish that migrated to the Pacific two years ago.
“The ocean in 2005 was quite warm,” said Mr. Ryall. “That's not a good condition for production of food to make these fish survive and grow.”
He said that theory is supported by the low number of Fraser River coho salmon returning this year after they, too, migrated to the ocean in 2005 and the relatively strong return of sockeye from the Harrison Lake area.
The Harrison Lake sockeye migrated to the ocean a year before the majority of sockeye from other parts of the Fraser system.
While other Pacific rivers are showing lower than forecast sockeye returns, they are not seeing the extremely low numbers in the Fraser.
Mr. Ryall said nearly 500,000 Skeena River sockeye have been taken commercially and Alaska is also allowing openings for sockeye.
In fact, according to Mr. Figg, the Americans are doing extremely well.
“Alaskan sockeye is coming back like gangbusters,” said Mr. Figg, prompting him to question the Canadian estimates.
“Our sockeye and their sockeye all go out into the Pacific and feed in the same spot.”
But Mr. Ryall noted all is not lost for commercial and recreational salmon fishing on the river this year.
“There will be pink salmon returning in sizable numbers and there's definitely interest, commercially,” said Mr. Ryall.
“Later in the fall there will be chum salmon, with both commercial and First Nations interest. And there has been some chinook fishing in the spring and it will continue into the fall and throughout the winter in very limited fashion.”
“So there is still going to be some salmon fishing, just no sockeye,” he said.
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This is what i hate about the special interest groups and others with their bs, exaggerations and blatant lies.
here's some interesting points from the article.
1. The Sto:Lo have complained recreational fishermen on the Fraser are taking untold numbers of sockeye.They accused Fisheries of allowing the Fraser River sport fishery to become “a macabre and destructive force” and have called on the department to close down the sport fishery
how he gets away with such a statement i have no Idea!! Given the amount of illegal nets that they put in the river. All blatant lies and exaggerations in order to support their agenda which is a native only fishery!!! and congratulations to all those guys ranting and rving playing right into their hands.
2.In fact, according to Mr. Figg, the Americans are doing extremely well.
“Alaskan sockeye is coming back like gangbusters,” said Mr. Figg, prompting him to question the Canadian estimates.
“Our sockeye and their sockeye all go out into the Pacific and feed in the same spot
surprise, alaskans having another bumper year. I think its time to do some DNA analysis on those alaskan fish caught in the ocean, any bets thats were BC's missing fish are!!
I agree with alway... a lot of the bands I run into are fine and very amicable but these radicals are going to cause a lot of trouble unless they are dealt with by all involved!
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Yah can't blame BBing for this, the natives would have pressured government regardless of method... Even if everyone of us was barfishing.
The fact that we were fishing at all is more of the issue... And now whatever FN caught doing it shall be called a hypocrite... There have been 35,000 sockeye caught already, and the fact they want us off the river makes me think we should all be going for regular boat rides, and document all the nets that will be drift netting over the bars we would normally be fishing...
I personally think that court is no longer the answer... That's a waste of time.
We need to be more guerilla in our tactics to ensure those who sell their catch PAY.
Cheers,
Nicole
Glad to hear you agreeing with me once in a while Nicole. I have urged those bfers who are not willing to confront bbers with a 50 to 1 ratio, to just cut lose some illegal nets out there. This will save much more socs. ;D
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Steelhawk, gotta give you something once in awhile ;)
The fact of the matter is there were plenty of fish on the spawning grounds in 2003, so overfishing could have only happened out in the chuck recently...
Or the predation has decimated the stocks on their way up to the north pacific feeding grounds...
The fact is that no one should be fishing right now.
This should be seen by all groups as a crisis...
The fact that natives are still fishing is what's bothering me, the fact that the river is closed to sporties does not bother me at all. We're doing our part...
And yet much of the media is saying that the native fisheries are closed along with everything else...
Nothing but lies, resulting in a misinformed public.
Cheers,
Nicole
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DFO knew this was coming.... this disasterously low return
if you can handle reading through several pages of document.... head over to the DFO pacific region website and on the main page, find the heading "state of the pacific ocean" and you will come to "some" understanding of all the influences affecting sockeye and many other oceanic species. And how oceanic temperatures are affecting ALL species. This read really opened my eyes.
I'd post a link but...... I ain't that computer savvy
Harvest of sockeye should be closed to EVERYONE period. This is way bigger than the "us sporties aren't getting a fair shake mentality" that so many of you are flogging. Sockeye may be on the verge of extinction in the fraser system what will YOU do about that today.... blame BB'ers ?? that's just ludicrous. CLOSE it down to ALL user groups period... and that is where ALL of should be putting our energies.
With that, I'm gonna try and stay clear of these posts......
in 48 hours i'll be floating in a boat far from this fraser river cluster f***
But , if someone can manage to organize ALL the sporties into a MOB of people heading for Victoria.... I'll stand ahead of you all and bring my metis flag..... not all injuns are out to screw the sporties... and i know lots who would march on over there with you.
good luck with all this people.... conservation is MUCH more imortant than slamming your fellow fisherman because of this river closure... how many of you would be right in there should they decide to open it up...... too embarrassed to say??? That's what i thought.
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I've stated this fact over the past years but i'll repeat it.
I used to have close ties to the cheam through friends who are band members and are relatives of the former chief of the cheam. I, for several years had a letter of passage from band council to acces thier land for hunting and fishing privleges. I am also a member of B.C.' s METIS NATION.
My friend was the bands fishery manager for many years until about 4 years ago when he just had enough. The tradition among first nations is that only certain families have traditional fishing grounds. My friends was saddle rock area. What he saw happening was that any F.N. with ties to the band were arriving on the reserve lands during the sockeye migration and declaring thier right to fish. Do you all know that the government are the ones who pay for thier boats, thier nets, thier boots, thier gloves..... every single part of thier fishery is subsidized by both the provincial and federal governments. Then these "stewards" of the resource turn around and sell thier catch for TAX FREE $$$$
I have personally witnessed on numerous occasions, the drift netting AT NIGHT with nets tied together to achieve a BANK TO BANK drift. NOTHING GETS BY THAT and I guarantee that this is happening again this season.
An important thing to remember here is that it is not just us sporties who are crying foul over this issue of the cheam and sto lo nations over fishing the resource. First Nations groups from far up the fraser hate the cheam as well and if this was a hundred or so years ago..... there would be war over it.
It's not just an issue of fish either. There are other first nations groups that practice the same disregard when it comes to hunting big game. I have photos of 53 deer of all ages and both sexes, harvested at night with the use of military rados, and spotlight equiped motor bikes, atv's and 4x4's. The gunshots started at dusk and did not stop throughout the night. Also any hunters ever wonder why they closed the doe draws for the lower mainland of region 2??? Because the natives did nothing but ride around at night and shoot everything in sight. Anyone who hunts the harrison valley east road will know what i'm talking about.
The thing is this.... there is simply nothing u sporties can do to curb F.N. behavior by ranting off on the internet, this lies soley in government hands.
My advice to you is ORGANIZE AND QUIT BICKERING, rodneys been preachin that throughout. ORGANIZE or SHUT THE HELL UP.
Do what the saskatchewan farmers did. Gather in a group and head to victoria, call the news, and make a big stink.... take your tents, a weeks worth of food and necessities and STAND UP AND BE HEARD. If you are not prepared to do that..... than for the love of god..... shut the F*** up.
With that, I off to Nootka, where the F.N's are real nice, there's LOTS of fish to be had for everyone...... and you don't have to floss em :D
Excellent post...100% agree...
Something else you should all realize is the difference between Canada and alaska is alaska fisheries hired an independent biologist...They study what the fishing runs are doing and only fish the ones that are healthy...They have asked Canada to join them but have been refused because your DFO is run by fools in Ottawa....Many times they have warned that certain fisheries need to be closed etc. but it's fallen on deaf ears...Whatever their biologists say goes...It's sad when the ones in B.C. are screaming and end up resigning but still nothing happens..
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so be it....maybe now all the whining and bickering will stop.
as for first nations...if they really are the champions of our resources then they should comply with DFO.....if DFO decides to exclude them from the ban, then it only confirms their lack of commitment and their own spineless, stupidity.
me....i'm going to renew my tidal license and get re-familiarized with the chuck once again.
I believe it was the spineless stupid gov't officials who mismanaged the fishery................Oh my god what colour are they ! Gimme a break with the redneckism!
Hotrod
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And with the deletion of a number of posts, this now comes to a screeching halt.
AGAIN.