Fishing with Rod Discussion Forum
Fishing in British Columbia => General Discussion => Topic started by: gheart008 on July 02, 2007, 11:03:58 PM
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So I launched from Cates this morning, and when I got there, there were 5 men (all from the same group) fishing and dropping traps off the docks (If anyone doesn't know, Cates docks are closed off to fishers and crabbers until November). I decided to jot down the number on the sign near the dock entrance where it told to call if you spot any violations. I decided to call and report them after I launched. The guy on the other end took down my name and number, then I described what was going on. He told me they would get on it right away. I was floating around the docks for over 2 hours and not a single officer showed up!!!
What good is it for us to report these types of activities when no one cares to do anything about it? Eventually I saw a guy (not an officer) walk over to them and told them to leave (since it was getting busier with boats) and they eventually packed up and left.
I was outraged. I was going to tell them to leave in the morning, but I actually wanted them to be caught and fined right on the docks while I was looking as that would have been a great show and would have made my day, hence the call after I launched... wanted to catch them off guard without any warning.
So what are we to do? If I were to have given them a warning in the morning that I was going to report them and they didn't listen to me, I make the call and no one would have shown up to do anything about it anyways so what's the point?? It just gets me mad when stupid poachers and non regulation abiding people do things like this, and to make it worse when we report this activity and nothing is done about it.
Sorry, that's my rant of the day.
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I share your frustration . I too have called in violations and nothing has happened. I like to think that they have more serious violations that need their immediate attention but who knows.
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Its hard for the fisheries officers to be everywhere at the same time, alot of times they are dealing with more serious matters then a few crab poachers. I too spend alot of time in Cates park area and cant count the amount of times Ive seen violations, my advice to you is to call the non emergency RCMP number for North Vancouver, the RCMP in this area are aware of the poaching that goes on and are more than happy to come down to the peir to check things out, that is unless they have more serious matters to deal with.
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Your message must have gotten through to the field people because the CO's were out in force tonight (all 2 of them) checking for licences and barb hooks.
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As mentioned the officers operate in a dynamic environment and can't be everywhere at once.
I have seen them clamp down on a place-the old DND Pier @ Jericho Beach-after I reported it though.
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am sorry to say that I think your reaction is way over the top...the main reason I disagree with you is that I THINK the no fishing from the peir thing isnt a fisheries law to protect crabs etc, I think its more of a keeping the dock open for boats issue (district to, not DFO). Its really easy to sit in your boat minding your traps when someone stuck on shore has no other access.
I the way I look at it is that North Vancouver is a joke in terms of the city supporting recreational fishers. There isnt a single public dock (salt) in north vancouver that I can take my boys to and fish crabs or even perch.
Now if I am wrong and this isnt a city bylaw and indeed its a fisheries reg (to protect crabs or what ever) then I will eat my words but otherwise lets have some understanding for people who have now other choices in N Van for fishing locations.
PS - the lack of a conservation officer makes me think it was a city bylaw thing more than anything else...can anyone confirm?
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A closure that is location specific like a pier is most likely responsible by the District of North Vancouver, similar closures are currently in place in the District of West Vancouver. I am not 100% certain as I don't fish the area, but if it is a closure implemented by DFO, it would be outlined in the tidal water regulation handbook. That brings up the question, what's the number that you phoned, gheart008? I wonder if it is a number for bylaw officers or DFO officers.
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Rodney is correct this is a north vancouver parks issue, the closure is indeed because of all the boat traffic in the summer months, it is not a fisheries related closure. If this is the problem then the parks board would be the ones to voice your concerns to. If they were taking undersized crabs that is a little more serious and a call to the north van rcmp is all that is needed. I have seen poachers apprehended and fines laid out at this pier many times, but this sort of thing goes on in many different areas on shore and on the water so its not always possible to catch them in the act.
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On a side note. A couple weeks ago a friend of mine while fishing for chub. Noticed a guy's rod was bent (looks like a fish on the other end) and he just stood there holding it doing nothing. Then my friend saw the fish surfaced which was a sturgeon. He placed a call to 604-717-3321 (non emergency police number) and explained the situation to the officer and his suspicion that the gentleman in question was waiting for a chance to get the fish and bag it. The officer actually said they have a patrol car in the area and will have the officer drop by to observe and take proper action if need it. My friend went on fishing and sure enough after about 10 min. another gentleman came by with a net and they quickly net and bag the sturgeon, and guess what... just as they got to the parking lot about 50 meters away, two police officers were there waiting for them.
So don't feel down, if your report wasn't acted on this time. May be the next call will. Who knows. But one thing for sure, if no one reports no action will be taken.
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A closure that is location specific like a pier is most likely responsible by the District of North Vancouver, similar closures are currently in place in the District of West Vancouver. I am not 100% certain as I don't fish the area, but if it is a closure implemented by DFO, it would be outlined in the tidal water regulation handbook. That brings up the question, what's the number that you phoned, gheart008? I wonder if it is a number for bylaw officers or DFO officers.
I can't remember the number... but it was the number that was posted on the giant sign right before you start walking on the walkway towards the docks.
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On a side note. A couple weeks ago a friend of mine while fishing for chub. Noticed a guy's rod was bent (looks like a fish on the other end) and he just stood there holding it doing nothing. Then my friend saw the fish surfaced which was a sturgeon. He placed a call to 604-717-3321 (non emergency police number) and explained the situation to the officer and his suspicion that the gentleman in question was waiting for a chance to get the fish and bag it. The officer actually said they have a patrol car in the area and will have the officer drop by to observe and take proper action if need it. My friend went on fishing and sure enough after about 10 min. another gentleman came by with a net and they quickly net and bag the sturgeon, and guess what... just as they got to the parking lot about 50 meters away, two police officers were there waiting for them.
So don't feel down, if your report wasn't acted on this time. May be the next call will. Who knows. But one thing for sure, if no one reports no action will be taken.
wow I bet they picked up a heafty fine!
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Wow Gooey you are my man, to have the gut to tell it for what it is. I admire people who defends the right of the average people, guys who have no boat, senior citizedns, kids, who need a place to have fun like others who have more means. Funny why they only get to use it when it was cold and windy season. These are mostly old folks or kids who cannot stand the elements. Don't get me wrong, I report violations before for people who retained undersized crabs or retained more than their limit. But the matter is, Deep Cove Cates Park is the only productive spot for crabbing and yet these people are bumped off the pier so the boaters can have their fun. That is a wrong rule and policy and it has been that way for eons of time. If they cannot spend a little more tax money to expand the pier to include the weaker and poorer group, and the boaters are the only group to take craps, then it is totally not fair. To give them tickets is to put more salt to the wound. Injustice in my book. Yes, if they retain undersized crabs or more than the limit, by all means report them. Exclusion? Not fair and wrong. Imagine the Richomd piers have the same policy, that all crabbers and fishers are off the piers to be given only to the boaters for summer months. Considering the huge fishing piers in Yankee land of CA, our local cities should be ashamed of themselves for their fishing citizen. Again, Gooey, well said.
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Hopefully just because authorities weren't able to respond to your report you won't stop reporting violations.
Trust me, they try.
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Steelhawk and Gooey,
The boaters pay to use the launch (and hence the dock), so it's kind of unfair to have to pay for something and then not be able to use it, because it's packed with people who are fishing and crabbing for free.
Anyhow, I see using the dock as a privelege and not a right. Having it open to the public only during low season makes sense to me.
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Wow Gooey you are my man, to have the gut to tell it for what it is. I admire people who defends the right of the average people, guys who have no boat, senior citizedns, kids, who need a place to have fun like others who have more means. Funny why they only get to use it when it was cold and windy season. These are mostly old folks or kids who cannot stand the elements. Don't get me wrong, I report violations before for people who retained undersized crabs or retained more than their limit. But the matter is, Deep Cove Cates Park is the only productive spot for crabbing and yet these people are bumped off the pier so the boaters can have their fun. That is a wrong rule and policy and it has been that way for eons of time. If they cannot spend a little more tax money to expand the pier to include the weaker and poorer group, and the boaters are the only group to take craps, then it is totally not fair. To give them tickets is to put more salt to the wound. Injustice in my book. Yes, if they retain undersized crabs or more than the limit, by all means report them. Exclusion? Not fair and wrong. Imagine the Richomd piers have the same policy, that all crabbers and fishers are off the piers to be given only to the boaters for summer months. Considering the huge fishing piers in Yankee land of CA, our local cities should be ashamed of themselves for their fishing citizen. Again, Gooey, well said.
I think you are missing the point. Common sense would dictate that a dock busy with people fishing and lines sticking out for crab traps would not mix well with a dock busy with incoming and outgoing boats. Imaging your kid falling in the water and getting chewed up by a prop on a boat coming/leaving. Who would be to blame? Who would be negligent, you or the boater? I would think you.
In terms of spending more tax money, I would like to know what percent of the dock users actually live within the District of North Van? Wouldn't it be unfair for the residents of the district to pay more taxes for public use of their docks by non-district residents? Would you be willing to pay a small fee to crab/fish off of that dock if you lived in Richmond?
Now should there be a public dock in NV where people like Gooey can take their kids? ... I don't see why not but I hope you don't complain if the crabbing sucks... lol. I'm not too sure and I may be totally mistaken, but aren't most of the popular fishing/crabbing docks not really intended for boats?
Shane
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I the way I look at it is that North Vancouver is a joke in terms of the city supporting recreational fishers. There isnt a single public dock (salt) in north vancouver that I can take my boys to and fish crabs or even perch.
Gooey I understand your frustration but the fact is that there's No Fishing between the Lion's Gate and Ironworkers Memorial Bridge-that leaves little room for recreational fisheries in North Van.
So don't feel down, if your report wasn't acted on this time. May be the next call will. Who knows. But one thing for sure, if no one reports no action will be taken.
Well put!
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I think you are missing the point. Common sense would dictate that a dock busy with people fishing and lines sticking out for crab traps would not mix well with a dock busy with incoming and outgoing boats. Imaging your kid falling in the water and getting chewed up by a prop on a boat coming/leaving. Who would be to blame? Who would be negligent, you or the boater? I would think you.
In terms of spending more tax money, I would like to know what percent of the dock users actually live within the District of North Van? Wouldn't it be unfair for the residents of the district to pay more taxes for public use of their docks by non-district residents? Would you be willing to pay a small fee to crab/fish off of that dock if you lived in Richmond?
Now should there be a public dock in NV where people like Gooey can take their kids? ... I don't see why not but I hope you don't complain if the crabbing sucks... lol. I'm not too sure and I may be totally mistaken, but aren't most of the popular fishing/crabbing docks not really intended for boats?
Shane
Why not compare to other public piers where crabbers and boaters co-exist in peace. Piers like Belcara and Jericho Beach are places people can crab all year long and boaters can anchor also. Are these parks funded differently from Cates Park? All they need to do is to widen the area at the end so crabbers can have some room to set their traps. Is that too much to ask for? People pay taxes with or without a boat, so why should only the boaters be given the facility to enjoy crabbing? If all public parks pursue the user-pay policy, then many average joes and their families will be denied. Not fair. Boaters pay for the launch and extra parking space of the trailers. They should not own the piers.
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That dock is large enough so that if everyone respects each other, there should be plenty of room for all. Considering N van is such an outdoorsy community (which pays some of the highest taxes in the GVRD), I think that its insane there is no public fishing space (from a dock).
I had one rod and my 2 kids down at the deep cove dock...we were fishing for perch, just having a little fun. Some clown, a skinny old fart came strutting down with this shiny badge hanging off his belt (may have been the "dock master")....seriously the guy had a swagger to him that made me think he thought he was the big shot sherrif in town...anyhow we were tucked under the ramp, not getting in anyones way and he comes running down like someone is doing 90 thru a school zone. He was just such a chump that this particular issue kinda sticks in my craw.
And sam...you must have 15-20 km of shoreline from 2nd narrows to deep cove...I think its a shame we d not have a public dock that permits fishing in that entire stretch. Secondly, I think that rule (no fishing between the bridges) is because its a heavily used commercial vessel lane (cruise ships, tankers, etc) so the rule really shouldnt impact shore fishers or even the construction of a small fishing dock.
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Too bad they have to exclude the people who has less means or physical ability to handle a boat. Most of the boaters are crabbers anyway, and the dock is purely used to faciliitate this group of crabbers at the best time of the year. What a pathetic rule of exclusion there. There are also lots of new immigrants moving int NV district. They have to provide some facility of shore line recreation such as a pier for fishing and crabbing year round for these people who pay their share of property taxes. I tried crabbing at the Ambleside pier a few times (after my Cap trip) and I have not seen one legal sized crab except the red rock crab. Perhaps the water there is too fast for the big ones. Does anybody have more luck crabbing there?
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Next time read the sign properly. It doesn't say that 'we REQUEST that you don't crab or fish'. It clearly states that you are not allowed to. Here's also a prime example of a new generation being told to defy the letter of the law just because you can't find a legal area to crab/fish. Did you tell your kids that the sign was only meant for other people?