Fishing with Rod Discussion Forum
Fishing in British Columbia => General Discussion => Topic started by: clarki on December 07, 2014, 10:28:37 PM
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Vancouver Sun article (http://www.vancouversun.com/news/Reports+landslide+North+Vancouver+along+Seymour+River/10448213/story.html)
I wonder how this will affect fish passage?
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http://bc.ctvnews.ca/north-shore-rock-slide-partially-blocks-seymour-river-1.2136788
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It will be interesting to see what happens with the major rains that are supposed to hit. Probably a very good thing that they have some control of the water flow from the dam.
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there was a similar but smaller blockage on the Coquihalla this year and few fish made it past though there was some thought it would be passable in higher water. However at least 100 fish of some 200 below the blockage were captured and moved to the upper river by mid September.
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there was a similar but smaller blockage on the Coquihalla this year and few fish made it past though there was some thought it would be passable in higher water. However at least 100 fish of some 200 below the blockage were captured and moved to the upper river by mid September.
This is being reported as quite a significant blockage, enough to raise water level right to the girders of the twin bridges, and creating a large waterfall in the downstream side. It would be interesting for fisheries experts to scout the slide and assess if any steelhead will be able to get past it and if not, what is the plan for next year's salmon runs? These are already hurting (like the Coq).
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there are photos of the Coq blockage on the BCFF face book page if you want to compare these to the Seymour slide above. There is quite a difference. Is the slide on the Seymour downstream of the hatchery? I'd guess given it's size some attempt to clear it needs to be looked at. The river itself may be able to do this. Interestingly there is sufficient evidence to know a slide near Agassiz blocked the entire Fraser a few thousand years ago but the river cleared this on it's own. However these incidents does show how precarious salmonid habitat is in some of these mountain waterways.
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Is the slide on the Seymour downstream of the hatchery? I'd guess given it's size some attempt to clear it needs to be looked at. The river itself may be able to do this.
Yes, the slide is quite a distance downstream of the hatchery. The slide occurred at roughly where the "P" parking symbol is on the map. http://www.seymoursalmon.com/findus.php (http://www.seymoursalmon.com/findus.php)
North Vancouver officials are reported as saying that the river will not be able to "mobilize" the slide debris (due to the house-size rocks)
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Gotta love it ;D , mother nature at it's best .
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https://www.facebook.com/metrovancouver/photos/a.215735715515.176934.33730130515/10152829012145516/?type=1&theater
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Twin bridges this afternoon :(
(https://scontent-b-sea.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpa1/v/t1.0-9/10858434_10152918401735350_8504926815536182754_n.jpg?oh=44ab17350c48dceaee0d3dadd477cdce&oe=55082AAC)
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And in case you're wondering what the twin bridge looked like before...
(https://scontent-b-sea.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfp1/v/t1.0-9/10628269_10154921391185517_6591202006138407931_n.jpg?oh=c28a79bc4edf25e2b5833858252150af&oe=550BA5CE)
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And for reference for those who don't know the seymour, the water level is about 20 feet below that bridge usually
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On the bright side they are doing trail upgrades for a few years.
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Actually, this is what it looked like before ;) This is looking downstream from the site of the current bridge. There used to be two bridges like the one in this photo.
(http://photoshare.shaw.ca/image/7/7/e/118485/75955_10202290808445687_947450768_n-0.jpg?rev=0)
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I wonder how this will effect the steelhead in this river, as the population is already small.
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I have been told by someone who knows that the Seymour steelies hang out at two places, both of which are always closed to fishing. The slide has now changed that. The DFO should monitor the situation and, if needed, close the river to fishing to protect the fish and to protect the anglers. The trails are closed but I don't think that will stop some people from fishing.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4PLrGgE5zHw
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Yikes , hope he had good tread on his shoes or a pfd ... a definite "don't try this at home kids" vid.
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I have been told by someone who knows that the Seymour steelies hang out at two places, both of which are always closed to fishing. The slide has now changed that. The DFO should monitor the situation and, if needed, close the river to fishing to protect the fish and to protect the anglers. The trails are closed but I don't think that will stop some people from fishing.
Unlike Salmon DFO is not a regulatory agent for freshwater steelhead fishing. That falls to FLNRO.
The trails are not fully closed, just between certain points. Also we have no idea what the river looks like until the water drops.
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At Hyannis point the end of the road was completely fenced, same with the east side of the Rice Lake parking lot, and looking at the picture of the end of Riverside that looks pretty well sealed off too. So I'm guessing the only accessible portions of the river right now are from the mouth up to Pool 88 and from Spur 4 bridge up, as I would imagine they fenced off the northern most part of Fishermans. My father caught (and released) a 10 or so pound wild coho doe Monday at the very mouth of the Seymour, just 50 feet below the CPR bridge. I don't know too much about fish yet but I found it odd that it was somewhat colored (red on gill plate and red stripe down body, still some silver to it) , indicating that it had spent a fair amount of time in fresh water, yet it was caught in tidal water. Maybe it was turned around or spooked by the slide? Had lots of fight in it so I wouldn't have thought that it grew tired and just fell downstream. I'm starting to think the fish should be left alone this winter as it could be a challenging year for them. And damn, never seen Pool 99 run like that before.
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In addition to my rant, here is a better perspective of typical water height below twin bridges.
(http://www.straight.com/files/styles/popup/public/files/gallery/collections/FishermensTrail-2012/FishermensTrail-SH-2012-6714_0.jpg)
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I don't know too much about fish yet but I found it odd that it was somewhat colored (red on gill plate and red stripe down body, still some silver to it)
Doesn't sound like a coho. The colouration sounds more like a steelhead.
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Initially I thought it was a steelhead but looking at the tail it only had spotting on the upper lobe (and only the uppermost part of it), while I had read that steelhead had spotting on both lobes. Additionally, the tongue was black with white gums, and looking online it seems that steelhead's mouths are more white. Saying stripe probably wasn't the best way to describe the coloring along the body, as it was more of a hue focusing along the lateral line. The third fish below is the best representation of what I am describing, but what was caught looked "fresher", didn't have the super defined squiggly quality to the red along its lateral line but more of a diffused and maybe slightly squiggly hue, and had some red hue on the gill plate.
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_ckBlasgNSzg/SjQe7uE84RI/AAAAAAAAMp8/zdGINySGMgI/s400/Coho+Salmon.jpg)
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Initially I thought it was a steelhead but looking at the tail it only had spotting on the upper lobe (and only the uppermost part of it), while I had read that steelhead had spotting on both lobes.
Yep, a coho! :) The tail spotting is a dead giveaway.
Sorry, wasn't trying to be an armchair critic.
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Sorry, wasn't trying to be an armchair critic.
Then why do you do it so often? ;)
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Then why do you do it so often? ;)
Bazinga!
Having said that, you're still a facist and Ralph is still a doosh! :)
Back to the Seymour R slide...
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Ha, no worries. So do you think it is possible that the slide had something to do with a spawning phase coho returning to salt, or is that a somewhat common occurence?
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Ha, no worries. So do you think it is possible that the slide had something to do with a spawning phase coho returning to salt, or is that a somewhat common occurence?
It's common. We see coho in the salt/estuaries all the time rocking pink under their chrome scales. Generally happens when water levels are too low for them to enter and they stage at the mouths for long periods of time, but there are always exceptions.
Some salmon, like chum and pinks, quite commonly enter the rivers totally ready to go. I've caught many pinks and chum off the beach that look like they should be in the river spawning already and half dead. In fact I've watched, on several occasions, pinks and chum spawn (probably with very low to no success) in brackish water near estuaries on the beaches.
So, I think your father caught a late coho that had nothing to do with the slides.
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Bazinga!
Having said that, you're still a facist and Ralph is still a doosh! :)
Back to the Seymour R slide...
leave me out of this.
Not unusual for coho to take on colour in the salt close to their natal stream - particularly so late in the season.
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leave me out of this.
Not unusual for coho to take on colour in the salt close to their natal stream - particularly so late in the season.
Well he just dragged you in, didn't he? ;D
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Video taken from the slide site today
http://link.brightcove.com/services/player/bcpid888483788001?bckey=AQ~~,AAAAtIJh4TE~,Ey0zR91VLds2WQTBHsEly2uYPZzBI2pw&bctid=3935072323001
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STEELHEAD will pass through ... and life will go on.
We all like to pass on "Mythical Strengths" to Mykiss, especially when we are telling stories of our catches.
However, when any obstacle whether it be Man-made or Natural is introduced to the Steelhead ....
they all of a sudden become the most Fragile of species.
One would tend to think that a Fish who can survive the Ocean, Migrate through the Larger rivers, Make their way up the smaller estuaries.... (overcome enormous challenges):
Can swim past , over or through a rock slide.
Believe it or not, the steelhead has "somehow" achieved survival over periods longer than our average life span.
When we think we are the "Gods of their Destiny" and try to "Overthink/Micro-Manage" any occurrence ... then it's time to step down from the Glass Towers.
I personally am not to "Worried" that they can not over come this minor "Glitch" to the river. They have in the past and will continue to do so in the future.
An interesting perspective blair; I hope your optimism is correct in this case, but considering the low numbers of not so wild (so lacking a bit in the genetic diversity you attribute these fish), time will tell how they do/did.
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This is just bad timing as the seymour hatchery released their greatest number of juvenile steelhead.... nearly 50k. hopefully this doesn't slow the plans for the estuary work that is planned in the near future.
just real real bad timing
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http://www.nsnews.com/news/seymour-rock-slide-creates-new-lake-1.1662822#
Twin bridges is dead and Seymour River has a new lake that's here to stay. I forgot to say thank you to Every Day and RalphH for the feedback, never would have thought there were such late comers to the Seymour. It will be interesting to see how the fish adapt to the new 'lake' over the next few years.
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hmmmm...hope these steelhead dont find it more appealing to remain as rainbow trout in the new lake. Nature is never boring.
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More of a big pool than a lake.
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More of a big pool than a lake.
Yah , have to give it a new name , ( Stave Pool ) ;) . Or some other name .
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Yah , have to give it a new name , ( Stave Pool ) ;) . Or some other name .
Twin Bridges Lake.
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Update from DNV Councillor Mathew Bond:
https://www.facebook.com/mrmathewbond
"Some hard facts about the Seymour River Rockslide:
In a 1 in 10 year flood event, the existing bridge at Twin Bridges would be under 4m of water. The bridge will be removed in the very near future. There are no short term (3-5 years) options for a new major crossing at this location.
The Fisherman's Trail will be decommissioned between Twin Bridges and Mystery Creek Trail. There are thousands of trees along the edge of the trail that are currently underwater, many are already falling down. All of these trees will die in the next two years and they will take most of Fisherman's Trail with them. Metro Vancouver is being proactive to decommission the trail for safety considerations (danger tree hazards).
In a 1 and 50 year flood event, the exit of the Bottletop trail would be under 4m of water. The Bottletop trail is closed indefinitely. Even though it has been signed, flagged, and taped off, people are removing the tape and riding it. Over 50 people rode it today. This trail is low on the list of Metro Vancouver's worries right now and if people continue to use it and cause frustration for Metro, they will decommission the entire trail immediately. If people stay off the trail, then there will be an opportunity to work with the NSMBA to reroute the bottom section of the trail to meet up with the Mystery Creek trail at Fisherman's. Bottom line: Don't ride Bottletop or we will loose it permanently.
The Ministry of Environment and Department of Fisheries and Oceans will be meeting with Metro as soon as possible to discuss that fact that fish will be knocking on the door in a few months and they have no where to go.
This is a shocking change to the landscape, and we have lost a critical connection across the Seymour river that has been there since 1908."
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sad this was my favourite river/hike.