Fishing with Rod Discussion Forum
Fishing in British Columbia => Fishing-related Issues & News => Topic started by: GENERAL-SHERMAN on July 21, 2013, 10:30:56 PM
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fished from on the way to crossing tonight and noticed the natives netting a few hundred yards upstream of the barrier they've made on the indian side. .... phoned to report them and hung around till just before dark and nobody came....I don't know why I even bother! my friend got flack for walking up from the crossing the other day....they wouldn't let him by and I can see why now.
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Good on you.
I've seen this all before. 100s of dead fish left to rot.
Your friend should have tried to walk up on the north side of the river.
Last year a bunch of gear was seized from them.
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Typical behaviour, then they wonder why there is confrontations on the river.
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Nothing new, they often set up nets in that spot. DFO has come and dealt with it before but they can't always be there. Best thing I guess is call it in every time you see it, they do keep records everytime something gets reported.
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with all the problems they should have come up with a solution by now.....maybe gravel removal up behind on the way store close to the river on a non pink year so the river blows through reverting back to the old route and bypassing the reserve altogether... I dunno just brainstorming here!
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with all the problems they should have come up with a solution by now.....maybe gravel removal up behind on the way store close to the river on a non pink year so the river blows through reverting back to the old route and bypassing the reserve altogether... I dunno just brainstorming here!
I don't think that will happen. They just diverted the river so the main arm goes through the native land a couple of years ago. It used to only be a side channel
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FYI
Chris
UFV SFAC and Sox WG Group Members,
As noted on page 152 of the Salmon IFMP we have received a request from
a number of First Nation Communities in the Chilliwack area to access a
number of sockeye for FSC purposes from the Chilliwack River. As you
know in 2012 the department authorized First Nation opportunities on the
Chilliwack River using a variety of gears in a number of locations.
Details of the 2013 request are still being established. However, we
would liike you to be aware that we are are considering this proposal
and wanted to inform you that discussions are ongoing and there could
potentially be First Nations access to the Chilliwack/Vedder system.
The mid point of the pre-season forecast for Chilliwack sockeye is 57K,
the in-season test fisheries indicate that the run is tracking somewhat
below this level. Chilliwack sockeye are an early timed component of the
Early Summer run aggregate and generally peak in mid-July in the lower
Fraser River. Fishing opportunities would be in late July / early to
mid-August.
The department has been receptive to First Nations to target more
abundant stocks in terminal areas to alleviate FSC fishing pressure on
the Fraser Mainstem and feel the Chilliwack could provide this
opportunity. Once the department receives a more detailed proposal from
the participating First Nation communities and the proposal is assessed
to be consistent with the direction of well-managed terminal fishing
opportunities, we will inform the SFAC of if there is a decision to
allow this fishery.
That being said, I would like to reiterate, the department recognizes
the importance of the Chilliwack/Vedder River to the recreational
community and we will be considering this fishery when making decisions.
If you have any questions you can contact myself or Debra Sneddon.
Thank you.
Sheldon Evers
Resource Manager, LFA
Phone: 604-666-8049
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Waisting your time, nobody gives a cupcakes unfortunately
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Thanks Chris,
Looks like they are allowed to net them.
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Thanks Chris,
Looks like they are allowed to net them.
No there are not, it's simply a proposal that is being discussed right now. There isn't an official opening currently.
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UFV SFAC and Sox WG Group Members,
Further to my email on July 25th, the Department has received a more detailed proposal and has advised the First Nations that their limited fishery can proceed. The details are as follows:
Timing
- July 30 thru August 1 or until the harvest target is reached
Area
- in the waters of the Chilliwack River above the Chilliwack Hatchery
- in the waters of Chilliwack Lake
Gear
- dip net
- limited number of gill net, both set and drift
Harvest Target
- 1,000 sockeye
Given the size, location and timing of this fishery we don't anticipate any conflict with the recreational users of the Chilliwack system.
Sheldon Evers
Resource Manager, LFA
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What a joke. DFO has lost all credibility and continues to amaze me with their ridiculous decision to allow this fishery. Last year the escapement had to be 100k before they were allowed to fish. This year the goal post have been lowered considerably to 40-50k. So why the big change? It's only a matter of time before you will see set and drift nets in the lower Vedder. I really like the part about using dip nets. Who's monitoring their catch?
I was fishing beside a native fellow the other day and he killed 4 springs and two sockeye. Treble hooks and lead were the lure of choice. As GS said it's a waste of time reporting them as nothing ever happens.
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Buck, This morning I was at the same place you seen that native fellow. There Is now a net suspended across the frog water, from the dike to the log on the other side. I didn't stay more then 20 minutes, and in that time I did not see one sockeye rise.
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vigilante net group?
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What a joke. DFO has lost all credibility and continues to amaze me with their ridiculous decision to allow this fishery. Last year the escapement had to be 100k before they were allowed to fish. This year the goal post have been lowered considerably to 40-50k. So why the big change? It's only a matter of time before you will see set and drift nets in the lower Vedder. I really like the part about using dip nets. Who's monitoring their catch?
I was fishing beside a native fellow the other day and he killed 4 springs and two sockeye. Treble hooks and lead were the lure of choice. As GS said it's a waste of time reporting them as nothing ever happens.
Buck,
One thousand out of a projected 50k is not out of line. From the additional comments you have made I suspect you would not be happy with any decision that allowed a FN fishery. The guy snagging fish has nothing to do with this decision to allow a legit fishery as he is clearly operating in his own. Your condemnation of all FN due to the actions of guys like that is as ridiculous as someone suggesting there should be no recreational fishery or that all recreational anglers are poachers because they saw a group if European guys flossing and bonking sockeye on the Vedder. The guys you see fishing rouge are likely members if the Cheam who are very clear about what they consider to be their rights and their land. This is a band that has opted out of the treaty processes and are more militant in their approach to land claims and aboriginal rights. They do not recognize the DFO's power to "close the river", they hold that they are a sovereign people and have an inherant right to fish. Do not be so hard on DFO guys either as they have tangled with these guys before and did not fare well in the courts.
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Sandman, do you have your head in the sand? The fact that DFO has allowed any sort of First Nations opening on the Chilliwack system is brutal. Its a terrible precedent to set on a system that has never seem a FN fishery before (other than last year). There is no reason for the application to have been approved. DFO is a joke for even considering this. Now that the foot is in the door for the First Nations on the Chilliwack/Vedder, it will be easier and easier for them to gain further access and more opportunities.
Look at last year for example. 100000 escapement before being given the opportunity to fish with dip and seine nets. One year later, 50000 escapement before being able to fish with dip, seine and DRIFT nets. See that pattern?????? Throw in the lack of enforcement of the fishery and the joke credibility of monitoring the number of fish caught, this is not a good scenario.
You wait, the next applications being entered will be for other species on the river, likely in the fall. Enjoy fishing coho above that gill net.
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No there are not, it's simply a proposal that is being discussed right now. There isn't an official opening currently.
I meant in previous years.
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I was fishing beside a native fellow the other day and he killed 4 springs and two sockeye. Treble hooks and lead were the lure of choice. As GS said it's a waste of time reporting them as nothing ever happens.
And you didn't call RAPP?
Why complain?
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Buck, This morning I was at the same place you seen that native fellow. There Is now a net suspended across the frog water, from the dike to the log on the other side. I didn't stay more then 20 minutes, and in that time I did not see one sockeye rise.
I know the frog water you're talking about and it's always like that. Every year.
I find some crap in the water, lines, nets, dead fish etc..
Last year down to the next good run DFO confiscated a lot of gear from FN flossers.
I have never seen it happen during the day and I think they must be doing it at night.
Fish travel at night so it's a good time to do it.
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its no different on the Fraser. went on a guided sturgeon trip in the am yesterday. It was busy on the water as many people were having a go for the springs. After reading the latest sockeye update I thought I might see one or two nets in the fraser as the notice said Limited openings in the upper fraser. It was full out net season. Saw a couple drift nets right at island 22. And between the boat launch and the vedder river had to have seen upwards of 7 plus nets. Really sad as no one follows the rules for how our current system. Everyone to themselves. Our guide mentioned he'd rather see it closed entirely for the season and it just be crappy fishing than know that four years from now it would be even worse than this year.
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Sandman, do you have your head in the sand? The fact that DFO has allowed any sort of First Nations opening on the Chilliwack system is brutal. Its a terrible precedent to set on a system that has never seem a FN fishery before (other than last year). There is no reason for the application to have been approved. DFO is a joke for even considering this. Now that the foot is in the door for the First Nations on the Chilliwack/Vedder, it will be easier and easier for them to gain further access and more opportunities.
The reasoning is sound: give a limited opening on a terminal fishery like the upper chilliwack (above any recreational fishing) and you reduced the impact on other fisheries. It sounds like you would actually rather they have their nets on the lower river or the Fraser where their nets would intercept endangered Thompson steelhead and other endangered runs.
Look at last year for example. 100000 escapement before being given the opportunity to fish with dip and seine nets. One year later, 50000 escapement before being able to fish with dip, seine and DRIFT nets. See that pattern?????? Throw in the lack of enforcement of the fishery and the joke credibility of monitoring the number of fish caught, this is not a good scenario.
Was the target for the opening 1000 last year or was it more?
You wait, the next applications being entered will be for other species on the river, likely in the fall. Enjoy fishing coho above that gill net.
The Slippery Slope is a logical fallacy and has no weight in the debate.
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I agree with the Bucks. It seems year after year DFO makes worse and worse decisions on managment of fish stocks. I understand that they are extremely understaffed and its only getting worse but when is enough going to be enough. If they keep managing stocks this way, its not going to be long before there is only a FN opening and no recreational. IMO, the target limits should reflect everyones abilitity to fish not just one group. If the numbers are too low, then close it for all. Don't pick and choose special openings here and there. I really dont think you would have many rec anglers complaining if DFO said, no openeing for anyone, the only real complaints you get are they waffle on decisions.
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I just seen a tote full of sockeye the guy was fueling his truck at the gas station where I used to work. I asked what he had. and he confirmed he had 540 sockeye from the vedder/chwk and that they are 10 bucks a fish. I reported his plates to DFO and got the usual. no one is available and they will look into it....
So I wonder, if they harvested 540 already then they are almost done their 1000 fish limit. But why offer to sell them to me if there used for foodstuff.....
This is why I have problems with their "right to fish"....
Feed your communities and fulfill your cultural obligations no problem. but sell for profit..... bull****
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First Nations will be proceeding with the following fisheries in the upper Chilliwack River (above Chilliwack River Hatchery) and Chilliwack Lake. The Chilliwack Lake Sockeye fishery started this morning (6am) with a dip net fishery. This fishery was also designed by First Nations, DFO and the input of the UFV SFAC (from previous discussions or concerns delivered through email) to avoid overlap fisheries with the recreational community by specific areas and timing of these fisheries to eliminate all potential conflict along the river.
A couple of key important messages
· There are registered dip netters and registered drift and set net fishers. Only those that are on the licence are able to fish at this time.
· Drift and Set net fishers are limited to 1 fisher per community with their names or alternates on the licence.
· The target is for 1400 sockeye. And will be closed once target has been met.
· Dip nets start at 6am and go until 9pm both Tuesday and Wednesday of this week. (Daylight only)
· Drift and set nets go from 8pm until 8am both Tuesday and Wednesday night this week. (Late evening through to following morning, no fishing during the day).
· Drift and set nets will be fishing at the outlet of the lake, in the lake, and the mouth of Dolly Varden Creek into the lake.
· FVAFS (Catch Monitoring program for First Nations Fisheries) will be stationed at key locations above the hatchery and around the lake to monitor all gear types.
· C&P have been notified about the opening. As well as DFO catch monitoring staff to assist in monitoring this fishery.
· Any fishery in the Chilliwack system may encounter radio/acoustic/conventional tagged sockeye from lower river tagging projects. Fishers have been informed to advise the FVAFS monitoring crew if they encounter and submit any of these tags.
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I don't believe the dip netters will be successful but I can see a gillnet at the outlet (or in) Dolly Varden catching a few ... Hope this is monitored properly, and I hope DFO is studying this system to determine why returns are increasing, and if the lake can actually rear the many juveniles that are in the lake now from last years record escapement.
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Dave, which escapement are you talking about? is there a link I can read about this?
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Dave, which escapement are you talking about? is there a link I can read about this?
Sorry, just back from watching the Blue Jays in Seattle. I don't have the link but should be easy to find on the DFO website - or Rod will help us out- but I believe it was something near 120k. This lake is considered not as productive as say Cultus or most interior lakes that rear sockeye, so if a good egg to fry survival from these Chwk L fish, most of which spawn in or near Washington State, resulted in lots of fry, that could deplete the low plankton populations, the grits sockeye eat for a year or two in a lake. And that means that the fry that will enter the lake this spring 2014 may find very little to eat.
Unless the water chemistry has changed in the last 5 years, or the egg to fry survival is minimal, I doubt the lake can support this many fry to migrant size. It may well be that DFO is checking on this and is monitoring the lake as they did in the past, staff based from the Cultus Lake Laboratory.
Perhaps some people more in the loop from this forum can chime in.
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Yes, Dan and the boys from the lab have been working up on Chilliwack Lake this year.
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Thanks nibs; great opportunity for some serious research here.
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Thanks nibs; great opportunity for some serious research here.
Looking for a virus I am sure. ;D ;D
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Looking for a virus I am sure. ;D ;D
American salmon viruses.
So why is it that Chilliwack Lake may be increasing in productivity? Don't know, but there's been a few other lakes in the Fraser that have seen recent increases in productivity. Chilko, Seton/Anderson, Pitt. Name the common thread??
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Poop from campers.