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[chris gadsden]

btw- I believe there was a email address added at the end of this proposal in the reg's (The set I grabbed are in my bro's car...opps should of got 2) and asked for any commnets and input. So may I suggest we all do exactly that. Unless someone gets it first...I'll try and post the email address tomorrow.

fish.web@gems9.gov.bc.ca

[Steelhawk]

Fired off emails to the two email addresses provided by C.G.  The letter explains my position on this subject.

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Dear fishery minister,

As a member of some of the most popular fishing web sites in BC, and an avid sport angler for many years, I am concerned about the proposed regularion changes for BC rivers.  It is rumoured that there is a total bait ban on all BC rivers in upcoming regulation changes.

My opinion, like many among sport fishing communities, is that government should definitely protect the wild & C/R systems with this regulation, but leave the hatchery enhanced systems alone.  A blanket bait ban will be seen as biased and unnecessary.  Considering the impact of illegal nets fishery, bad forestry practices, commercial fisheries, environment degradation, the use of bait in hatchery-enhanced systems will have very little impact on fish stocks.

Every year the hatchery-enhanced systems like the Capilano, the Chehalis, the Chilliwack/Vedder, the Stamp etc have surplus returns, and these surpluses end up in fish fertilzer plants for pennies a lb. Why not leave them to anglers who pay ever increasing premiums to fish. There is no need to reduce catching efficiency in these hatchery enhanced systems. Unreasonable restrictions will be seen as bias, and perhaps causing one fishing group pitting against another.

The drift fishing group already starts questioning if the government is yielding to the flyfishing elitists who are more vocal and better at lobbying the government.  Their opinion is that the government is increasing fishing license premiums every year, but reducing fishing and catching opportunities at the same time.

In this time of general mistrust towards the government due to fishery's inability to enforce rule of law with the natives in regard to the Fraser fishery, the sport fishing community in general are waiting to see if they are getting a better deal from the government this time.

[rln]

when thinking about the bait ban, how about considering those people that fish for other things besides steelhead and trout. Those that fish Thompson jack springs and many more of the other river salmon fisheries can kiss those all away. How about guys fishing for carp and other creatures like carp? All those fisheries will disappear. This bait ban will do nothing to bring back more fish of any type. There is no guarantee that sturgeon will be exempt. People need to realize there is more than just steelhead and trout to fish for in streams and this blanket type of regulating does nobody any good. The east coast of vancouver island has had a bait ban, catch n release and now for the last how many years? (7 plus) a fishing closure and still there are no steelhead only less people fishing and nobody caring about what happens in those streams. WLAP is just trying to manage the people fishing and not the fish. I would like to see any examples, if there are any ,of how this is going to create any more fish of any type. All it's going to do is put more people off of fishing and at this time when WLAP needs license sales for the revenue to help run the ministry. Even guys like Brian Chan and Nick Basok were shocked when they found out this was proposed for 2006-07.

[keithr]

what I sent:

Before adding new regulations, how about making a serious attempt at enforcing the ones already on the books, like those against drift net fishing, commercial sale of sport fish taken in fresh water, harvesting of undersized crabs?  What's the use of heaping on more regulations when you're not willing to enfore those already in place?  This only tends to make people cynical about the whole process.

Thank you.  Keith Ramsay (concerned neighbor and sports fisherman who spends money when fishing in BC waters.)

[chris gadsden]

Excellent posts rln, funfish and keithr, very good points for WLAP to considerand I am sure they will be swamped with emails when they arrived to work this morning. I am sure a lot more will follow in the next few days. I am sure this topic will have one of the the most posts on FWR that we have every seen. It will be great if a number of members post their thoughts as a number have already as it gives us alll good information that some of us may not think of. Please keep them coming.

The Thompson jack fishery in the late Summer is one that I certainly have enjoyed over the last 25 years. With a bait ban that fishery will be all but gone, they will most likely close it all together as well.

 It will be left to some other user group who in the last few years have started to harvest the adult chinooks as well by rod and reel with no enforcement that I have seen to curtail it.

Once again time to stand up and be counted before it is too late.

[Sterling C]

 It will be left to some other user group who in the last few years have started to harvest the adult chinooks as well by rod and reel with no enforcement that I have seen to curtail it.

Um Chris, don't you barfish? do you never keep any fraser chinook? If both answers are no then I will stop. If you do in fact bar fish the fraser for chinook than your previous statment is rather sanctimonious.

[chris gadsden]

 It will be left to some other user group who in the last few years have started to harvest the adult chinooks as well by rod and reel with no enforcement that I have seen to curtail it.

Um Chris, don't you barfish? do you never keep any fraser chinook? If both answers are no then I will stop. If you do in fact bar fish the fraser for chinook than your previous statment is rather sanctimonious.

I should have been clearer in my post. I was talking about the harvest of adult chinooks in the Thompson River in an area were nothing over 50cm. can be retained.

[Rieber]

I don't like the idea of a bait ban in the rivers but personally it would only somewhat affect me for Steelhead. But even then, I don't need bait to catch Steelies either. It would sure keep our hands a lot cleaner. Quite frankly, I'm surprised the Chilli/Vedder is not a fly only river. If it ever went that way I know I would certainly still be there. Guys, you'll still catch fish. Just learn to adapt.

[Sterling C]

Thanks for clairifying Chris

[Steelhawk]

Rieber, the Chilliwack/Vedder has not gone flyfishing only because there are all walks of life fishing the river, with varying skills, styles and knowledge.  There has to be room for every one, not only a special group fishing a certain way.  It is a hatchery-enhanced river, so there are surpluses.  Why are we always responding in such a way that if other people are catching a fish legally but using a different approach, it is just not acceptable.  The river is a public domain for every one to enjoy.  Personally, bait ban does not affect my catching efficiency too.  None of my steelies were caught on baits. None of my coho too, as I just cannot get up that early for the early morning roe fishing.  But we cannot force others to fish a certain way, as long as fish stock is not in danger. Freedom of choice is paramount in a free society like ours.

[blueback]

Ya know guys, while the effects of bait/artificials fishing has long been debated here and on other sites, I can't help but think that the effort wlap is making regarding this proposal is simply 'moving deck chairs on the Titanic' . Even if not using bait made a whole lot of difference (which I don't beleive it does) to fish survival, who will enforce it and how? As mentioned earlier by someone else, seems a whole lotta distraction from the real issues, which if not addressed soon, will leave nothing to be hooked and it won't matter if you use bait or not . My 2 cents. E-mail has been sent.

[Rodney]

While it is great to see many of you voicing your opinion on a possible drastic change, I just want to caution you that this is simply a proposal and its outline is very generic in the regulation synopsis. It's best to find out who is behind the proposal first. The generic write-up in the regulation synopsis indicates that they have probably already made up their mind on what changes are going to be made, making it hard for the public to provide feedbacks as we have to second-guess.

Once we track down what exactly is going on, we'll let you all know. If it turns out to be a change that is as drastic as we perceived, then be prepared to see one of the biggest petition launching off this year.

[Harps]

Ya know guys, while the effects of bait/artificials fishing has long been debated here and on other sites, I can't help but think that the effort wlap is making regarding this proposal is simply 'moving deck chairs on the Titanic' .

I agree.

[FF]

Then watch out for the biggest anti bait petition you've ever seen. It's going to happen. And the fish will finally get the break they deserve. Because the issue here is to many anglers are hooking to many fish and if you think about it were are doing more damage as a sport anglers by targeting fish in the last stages of there life (on there spawning run) in the rivers they spawn in. Specially on the vedder the fish just dont get a break anymore. Better no bait then nothing at all because something has to change before it is to little to late AGAIN. I think they should move the boundry on the vedder down to tamihi bridge to increase the "safe" zone for Steelhead because that upper river is where they really get beat on. Ban Bait on all wild rivers!! Thompson should be the first to go. CG times are changing you and I will have to give up some fisheries we enjoy but when it puts the fish first in any sort of way your sefish not to agree and accept. Lastly bait will catch more fish which increases the % of mortality weather you like it or not its not bS its called math.

[sassyboy]

Sorry FF I cant entirely agree with you, first off conservation starts out at sea including overfishing and the bycatch, then you have the habitat destruction issue, illegal poaching, netting in the rivers and the flossing thing including Flyflossing. Bait may be a great attractor but I have fished many a day with bait and have been skunked while wool ties were picking up the fish. As I've said before, I can live without bait but do I want to. NO! not while there are people fishing with floats put on upside down ( because they don't even know how a rig is put together) and then snagging them with eight to twelve foot leaders. (under the Veddder bridge is a great example of this during the coho run) Taking fish that are not actually caught in the mouth and so on. You could go on forever about all the ways fish are injured or overcaught, I would like to wager a hundred times more fish are injured or die through foul hooking than through being taken by bait, this seems to me, more of pressure being applied by some self interest groups than a valid way to protect the fish stocks. I strongly believe that "most" of the anglers using bait are ethical fishermen who care deeply about the resource and the handling of fish with extreme care. 
Just one mans opinion