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[younggun]

This is note a joke... Take a look at what is being proposed for the province.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=UgvY6zBc3q4#!

[Matt]

Thanks for putting this up.  It sickens me that BC is even contemplating this risk.

This issue is much bigger than a fish-related issue, Skeena steelhead and salmon are just a drop in the bucket relative to what will be lost should a spill occur.  

It isn't good enough to merely frown and go back to what you were doing.  I implore you to get involved, write a letter, get your friends and family to write letters and get involved in any way possible.

Ralf Kroning of the Steelhead Society of BC has put together a good letter sample letter and provided quite a bit of information about the pipeline.  It can be found here: http://www.steelheadsociety.org/news/enbridge-northern-gateway-pipeline-brief.

If you're better in economics than I am, perhaps economist former CEO of ICBC Robyn Allan's report on why the Northern Gateway pipeline will increase the price of oil in Canada will provide you fodder for a letter.  http://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=robyn%20allan%20northern%20gate&source=web&cd=4&ved=0CDQQFjAD&url=http%3A%2F%2Fafl.org%2Findex.php%2FDownload-document%2F566-2012-January-Allan-Northern-Gateway-Assessment.html&ei=HcIwT_ToMebQ2wWBxfTkBw&usg=AFQjCNGW94pwK1KR-EI9FnlWBVQDUeQpEA

[Sandy]

El Presidente Harper is over in China getting some coaching on how to deal with The Environmentalist, ecologists or other nay sayers right now;or is it is he's their guaranteeing that Foreign owned oil companies will have their oil pumped across BC. to Kitimat and to China.

[Fish Assassin]

Despite what Enbridge says, an oil spill is inevitable as death and taxes. Just a question of when

[Tadpole]

Simple question. Do you use vehicles or boats in your daily life? Yeah....... everyone want to go to heaven but nobody wants to die.

[hotrod]

Good post! I'm sharing with everyone and hope that everyone else will! Think of all the steelie and salmon waters that will be affected on the way!

[firebird]

Simple question. Do you use vehicles or boats in your daily life? Yeah....... everyone want to go to heaven but nobody wants to die.

Well, I'm sure all the environmentally conscientious outdoors people are hopping in their big, electric 4x4's as they head out to the Chilliwack  A common theme that I'm noticing is "Why don't they refine the oil where they find it? Then we don't need the pipelines." Then how will they get the refined product to the market?

[Matt]

Simple question. Do you use vehicles or boats in your daily life? Yeah....... everyone want to go to heaven but nobody wants to die.

I don't think this is a valid argument.  Nobody is or will debate the need for oil at the present date.  I'm not even sure I'm against the tar sands, as dirty as tar sand oil extraction is.  I'm definitely not against oil pipelines in general, there is an obvious need.  However, that oil is leaving Canada at discount prices to go to China.  That in no way can benefit me by providing me with oil for my boat or truck.

I am strongly against a pipeline that runs such a risky route through major watersheds (773 water crossings IIRC), pumps it into large tankers which have to make at least three hairpin turns then on their route out to sea and traverse very treacherous storm-prone water to do so before the oil is shipped at discount prices to China.

I think you should reed Robyn Allan's economic analysis of the project and why the Northern Gateway Project will drive the price of oil up $2 to $3/ barrel.  http://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=robyn%20allan%20northern%20gate&source=web&cd=4&ved=0CDQQFjAD&url=http%3A%2F%2Fafl.org%2Findex.php%2FDownload-document%2F566-2012-January-Allan-Northern-Gateway-Assessment.html&ei=HcIwT_ToMebQ2wWBxfTkBw&usg=AFQjCNGW94pwK1KR-EI9FnlWBVQDUeQpEA

[firstlight]

Reminds me of all the barges heading to Japan with raw logs and my buddy isnt working because they dont have any logs.
Just doesnt make sense.

[firebird]

I'm sure Enbridge will find economists willing to shoot down the Allan report easily enough ... the quick quote from their rep. indicates they're working on their rebuttal ... "Enbridge representative Paul Stanway said the company can’t comment in detail about the report because it is evidence tabled before the NEB-CEAA at its pipeline hearings, but it will have a chance to rebut the report in September.

Stanway confirmed, though, the projected price increase in the application.

“The price of oil in Canada is estimated to increase as a result of market diversity and exposure to global pricing,” he said. “That’s correct, but that is taken into account in our estimation of an overall benefit of about $270 billion to the Canadian economy.”"

I think in the end it will simply be a case of whether the army of opponents becomes large enough. Statements like "an overall benefit of about $270 billion to the Canadian economy" will surely draw plenty of supporters so it promises to be a huge battle.

[Sandy]

 I doubt society (Canadian in general and BC in particular ) will see a net gain?  All this will serve is, as has been pointed out a direct route to China of Oil that would otherwise be on the market and subject to the ups and downs of the rules of supply and demand. Nothing more!

The tar will also be processed without responsible environmental guidelines and used to power industries that are also less than environmentally responsible making goods that will then compete on the open market with goods produced under stricter legislation. In affect we are supporting the lowering of environmental standards and the welfare of working people. Instead of forcing the Chinese or? to raise their standards, we are rewarding them for not doing so.
Not to say anything of removing this oil from the NA market and therefore the localised rules of supply and demand will allow for Big oil to reason price hikes.
This will be also a way for the US, to have some control and/or have leverage over China. China is making private deals worldwide for it's commodities and is bypassing the system of fair market demand. Akin to the Log situation and coal of the eighties.
when or if this pipeline is built and hope not, The US will add it to the list of Strategic needs and use all the power required to control it. Do not kid yourself that WE Canadians will have any say on it's use.
http://www.strategicstudiesinstitute.army.mil/pdffiles/pub705.pdf

[Sandy]

Simple question. Do you use vehicles or boats in your daily life? Yeah....... everyone want to go to heaven but nobody wants to die.

Yep, and therefore should have the right in demanding that the fuel used is processed in as enviromentaly safe manner as possible.
 

I am also Canadian and a BC resident and my input or opinion should count in the desicion making process, only one voice but never the less I'm entitled to an opinion. Some look at it as, this is a couple of years of work building the thing. I see the likelyhood of decades of work repairing the damage done. Not an equitable situation!

[Burbot]

Simple question. Do you use vehicles or boats in your daily life? Yeah....... everyone want to go to heaven but nobody wants to die.

yet anything made from oil can be made with hemp and hemp has actually more uses.

[Matt]

So the Northern Gateway pipeline is sending raw bitumen to China at today's prices...  Oil prices will only rise as time goes on and supply dwindles, why dump our supply on the market now, especially in raw form, when it could be processed in Canada by Canadians?  No refinery big enough?  Build one.  The pipeline hasn't been built yet either.

This project will (if it proceeds) benefit China greatly and Enbridge shareholders.  The rest of us are SOL if this goes through, AND we'll be paying more for petroleum products to boot.

[fisher man]

Hey matt, you mention "if it proceeds", but in my opinion the handshake has already been made. I hope I'm wrong, but i also now that they are already building the holding tanks in Kitimat, so that can't be good.