Fishing with Rod Discussion Forum
Fishing in British Columbia => Fishing-related Issues & News => Topic started by: chris gadsden on May 06, 2014, 09:05:37 PM
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http://www.courierislander.com/news/local/campbell-river-north-island-aquaculture-on-60-minutes-sunday-1.1023784
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60 Minutes news program normally does a good job on exposing the bare bones facts.
Wonder what spin or edit or what side the show will major on.
Big audience & definitely will watch the up coming program or at least record it should there be a NHL play off game on.
Got more than 1 tv.
Thanks for the heads up.
( I will not eat a farm salmon, nor a wild one. The ocean is the world's garbage dump. Chemicals plastics & nuclear wastes plus spilled oil. Heard something that floating plastics / garbage is swirling in the N Pacific. If my ears did not trick me, it is the size of Alberta. But catch & release is fun & fish in fresh water lakes may be better to consume)
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http://www.salmonfarmers.org/bcs-salmon-farmers-be-featured-60-minutes
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After reading the "backgrounder" I , 2x will not eat farm salmon.
Slice & peroxide to control lice.
Only done by a lic. vet.
( sounds kinda like Elvis & Michael Jackson's doctors )
By the spin or the guidelines of the 60 Minutes backgrounder read, the program seems to promote farm salmoning.
We'll see on Sunday.
Wonder if moms will be having a farm salmon dinner? ( Mother's Day )
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http://alexandramorton.typepad.com/alexandra_morton/2014/05/60-minutes-on.html
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Great the Dr spent some quality time with Alexandra.
Sure do not want to miss recording this up coming 60 Minutes program.
Miss Morton speaks calmly & volumes. Think the Dr. Has a good brain & character to see the true facts.
Is it New Zealand & Australia that have banned farmed salmon.
Right there raises a billion red flags for the world to see.
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http://alexandramorton.typepad.com/alexandra_morton/2014/05/60-minutes-on.html
Seems like Dr. Gupta does house calls.
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Definitely must watch TV. From the clips I saw, Roberts seemed hopefully confident his message got across ... Almo, not so much.
Looking forward to this.
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Wonder why they did not trace Fisherbob down and interview him or her. ;D ;D ;D
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http://hosted.verticalresponse.com/636112/2ce07d9b1f/281429185/de0e6bc9f8/
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--Just finished watching the show... OK... but not much there to draw conclusions either way.
--I like the farm... its not like the bad old days... spin. I thought when they first went in there were no problems and even if there were we were state of the art.
--I'm not overly excited about the Alaska model either with the rancher analogy.. I think we have lots of evidence of over grazing in the good old days of ranching as well.
--I had a salad for supper with some grilled chicken...after watching food inc. last night... not so sure that was a good choice either. Probable pesticides on the spinach and the chicken may only have been 59 days old.
--Our garden is planted with heirloom veggies...and with a bit of selective harvest from local area we should get a month of decent food but are stuck for the rest of the year
--Off on a tangent there.. but I doubt the show would change anyones mind.
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From Alex
"60 Minutes did a great job. It was incredible to me that Brian Wallace, senior lawyer with the Cohen Commission was SO flustered by the question about whether ISA virus is in BC."
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For those that missed it.
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/saving-wild-salmon/
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From Alex
"60 Minutes did a great job. It was incredible to me that Brian Wallace, senior lawyer with the Cohen Commission was SO flustered by the question about whether ISA virus is in BC."
Not surprising at all Alex .. what was incredible to me was 60 Minutes would interview a lawyer about ISA ... why didn't they talk to a non partial scientist?
Nothing gained for either side with this 20 minutes, imo.
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Not surprising at all Alex .. what was incredible to me was 60 Minutes would interview a lawyer about ISA ... why didn't they talk to a non partial scientist?
Nothing gained for either side with this 20 minutes, imo.
x2
I thought it was interesting that AM stated that she did not know if salmon farms were or were not causing harm. A tough question indeed.
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-2, pretty well showed that there are some major concerns about pumping dirty salmon full of antibiotics. It is crazy how the rivers in Alaska are still doing well with ranching and down here with poor fish farming practices were on a continual decline.
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Fish farms have unhealthy fish.
Viruses & fish lice are going into our coastal waters from these pens.
Wild salmon are dying before spawning.
Many wild salmon are sickly. Gills,mushy hearts,ISA is it called? ( flu )
Farm salmon sold in stores looking thin & sickly.
Fish farms putting slice & antibiotics in the farms because of problems.
Not natural to have salmon in the 1000s to be in cramped spaces.
DFO instead of looking at problems instead want to sweep findings under the rug.
What more is there to say? There's a problem Big time. Have to be totally blinded not to have any other conclusion.
Is it because in the past when there were big runs our increased population rushes to the river & want their take?
Commercial boats in the chuck,gill netters,sports fishers,natives, & it's impossible for the DFO to stop the greed.
So they concluded fish farms are the way to go,hell or high water.
The other natural method is too hard to police.
Plus as the " Good Book " says " The love of $ is the root of all evil".
Sell farm salmon to the USA to Europe wherever & make $.
Feel the frustration of all the warnings & it is falling on deaf ears.
Is it just the sign of the times.
Accept more air & water pollution,accept our food to have concerns & accept a lesser quality salmon to eat.
World gov's are concerned with major conflicts around the world & our food & salmon are way down the list of importance possibly.
Well a lot of us try to be healthy.
Excercise,eat fruits vegs. low fat milk, etc.
Surely the health conscious public should be demanding answers.
Guess there are so many problems,people are just taking the attitude " eat drink & be merry".
So do not bug me with facts, just no time for facts.
If there was no such thing as fish farms & someone decided to open one & fry got lice,viruses were found,lots of sickly fish,sold fish in stores looked unhealthy to eat...the "powers that be" would come down big time & shut that farm down in a snap of your finger.
But the fact is the farms are all set up & there's big $$$$ suddenly DFO looks the other way & is ignoring all the red flags.
Totally like evil had become good & good has become evil.
Makes ya wonder Who can we trust?
Well I know. But this is a fish site so let's not go there.
Thanks to all those who are doing the job DFO should be doing.
I'm sticking to beef & chicken & those products have their problems as well. What can ya eat ?
Hope the answer is not humans are the only thing good to eat.
Head hunters will come back in big numbers :o
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x2
I thought it was interesting that AM stated that she did not know if salmon farms were or were not causing harm. A tough question indeed.
Well we know they have caused harm in other countries as the story related.
The positive of the story is, 60 Minutes did the story and took Alex's concerns serious enough to do the story as they did not spend the time and resources to send a person like Dr. Gupta to our province to cover a story.
I think the lawyer summed up the situation as it presently is and that is why our government should have come up with answer by now but I guess they really donot want to find the truth.
A real plus for Alex after the evening's showing in my mind. ;D
I just saw Global played some clips from the program including the quote from the lawyer. :-\ :-\
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I also found it interesting that AM used the term "amongst abundant salmon stocks" when speaking about salmon farms in bc. AM also looked disappointed when her underwater camera showed the bottom under a farm covered with prawns. Im pretty sure she thought they were dead zones. Apparently not.
I just listened to a good interview with Ian Roberts on CBC radio. Would you have that link Chris?
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As expected they have Ms Morton combing the river banks looking at decomposing salmon carcasses which have been dead for an undetermined amount of time. At this point, there can be many pathogens in the fish and it is very difficult to isolate a cause of death in this circumstance. That is fact. A fish pathologist or virologist should have been interviewed for clarification, but instead Ms Morton is relied upon for this knowledge. Well you get what you pay for...and it this case it is poor knowledge. Seems like this is a caveat not mentioned in the interview.
Ms Morton never mentions the actual findings of the Cohen Commission Report on ISA and ISAv during her interview with Gupta. Not surprising seeing as though Morton's claims run contrary to the those actual findings. Hence the creation of the propanganda film her and Roscovich created.
I agree with Dave that a lawyer shouldn't have been interviewed for this type of subject. They should have been talking to someone else with actual experience on this. For instance, the lawyer never mentioned the ISAv and ISA testing that the Canadian and US governments have done since the conclusion of the inquiry which have all been negative for the presence of the virus. He should have referred more to the actual findings of fact from the inquiry. The final report doesn't say that there is no risk, this can never happen or we shouldn't do anything research. It also doesn't say that fish diseases like ISA are out of control either. It lays out what we know and what we don't know about ISAv and ISA. Actual experts on the subject provided testimony on this. The facts - not conjecture. Justice Cohen outlines recommendations to look into this further; however, seeing as though who the employer is I am not surprised by the lawyer's reluctance to engage further. This is also not his expertise so it was kind of a pointless interview. In addition, it is never mentioned that a Fish Health Initiative is going to be started involving DFO, PSF and industry.
Ranched salmon are wild? Lol Funny how it is not mentioned during the interview how much of a proportion ranch salmon make up now in comparison to actual "wild" salmon.
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Seems like a few think as we do ss, aqua ...
http://salmonfarmscience.com/
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Seems like a few think as we do ss, aqua ...
http://salmonfarmscience.com/
A few people thought like Jim Jones too Dave. ::)
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I also found it interesting that AM used the term "amongst abundant salmon stocks" when speaking about salmon farms in bc. AM also looked disappointed when her underwater camera showed the bottom under a farm covered with prawns. Im pretty sure she thought they were dead zones. Apparently not.
I just listened to a good interview with Ian Roberts on CBC radio. Would you have that link Chris?
Lots of interviews here on the pro Fish Farm site.
http://www.farmfreshsalmon.org/radio-programs-salmon-farming
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Fish farms have unhealthy fish.
Viruses & fish lice are going into our coastal waters from these pens.
Wild salmon are dying before spawning.
Many wild salmon are sickly. Gills,mushy hearts,ISA is it called? ( flu )
Farm salmon sold in stores looking thin & sickly.
Fish farms putting slice & antibiotics in the farms because of problems.
Not natural to have salmon in the 1000s to be in cramped spaces.
DFO instead of looking at problems instead want to sweep findings under the rug.
Do you actually know what you are talking about or are you just reaching for conclusions? Ever been on the spawning grounds and conducted enumeration and biological sampling? Ever performed biological sampling of live or fresh dead Pacific Salmon? Does a "mushy" heart necessarily mean that the fish died of some suspicious, foreign pathogen or could it be caused by other factors associated with putrefaction and cellular breakdown? Do you know why scientists prefer to sample live (most preferred) or fresh dead salmon instead of salmon carcasses that have been on the banks, exposed to the elements for an undetermined amount of time? How many fish pathologists, virologists and histologists have you talked to on the subject? What do you know about antibiotic use on BC fish farms? What do you know about prespawn mortality in Pacific Salmon - its prevalence from year to year, during the duration of the run, or between Conservation Units. What do you know about prespawn mortality and how it relates to pathogens and environmental factors such as water discharge and water temperature? What do you know about endemic viruses (i.e. IHNv) and diseases (i.e. IHN) off our coast - it's distribution and pathology? What do you actually know about salmon farming in BC other than what you get from Morton's blog? What do you actually know about fish health on BC fish farms and the monitoring conducted. Have you read the Cohen Final Report? What did the report say about the presence of ISAv and ISA in BC waters in Volume 2?
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As expected they have Ms Morton combing the river banks looking at decomposing salmon carcasses which have been dead for an undetermined amount of time. At this point, there can be many pathogens in the fish and it is very difficult to isolate a cause of death in this circumstance. That is fact. A fish pathologist or virologist should have been interviewed for clarification, but instead Ms Morton is relied upon for this knowledge. Well you get what you pay for...and it this case it is poor knowledge. Seems like this is a caveat not mentioned in the interview.
Ms Morton never mentions the actual findings of the Cohen Commission Report on ISA and ISAv during her interview with Gupta. Not surprising seeing as though Morton's claims run contrary to the those actual findings. Hence the creation of the propanganda film her and Roscovich created.
I agree with Dave that a lawyer shouldn't have been interviewed for this type of subject. They should have been talking to someone else with actual experience on this. For instance, the lawyer never mentioned the ISAv and ISA testing that the Canadian and US governments have done since the conclusion of the inquiry which have all been negative for the presence of the virus. He should have referred more to the actual findings of fact from the inquiry. The final report doesn't say that there is no risk, this can never happen or we shouldn't do anything research. It also doesn't say that fish diseases like ISA are out of control either. It lays out what we know and what we don't know about ISAv and ISA. Actual experts on the subject provided testimony on this. The facts - not conjecture. Justice Cohen outlines recommendations to look into this further; however, seeing as though who the employer is I am not surprised by the lawyer's reluctance to engage further. This is also not his expertise so it was kind of a pointless interview. In addition, it is never mentioned that a Fish Health Initiative is going to be started involving DFO, PSF and industry.
Ranched salmon are wild? Lol Funny how it is not mentioned during the interview how much of a proportion ranch salmon make up now in comparison to actual "wild" salmon.
This happens as you well know, in most news stories, they film for days and so much is edited out.
The good part it raises the awareness of this issue and more people know what fish farming is all about and the possible dangers that was shown last night and what has happened in other countries, over time.
If we could only get the government to let their scientists to do their job properly which is very difficult with the gag orders of the day we may get some proper answers. Dave is finding it difficult to get the size of some steelhead smolts released last week, a very minor issue in the whole scheme of things.
One can not blame the scientists as they face so much pressure and funding cutbacks it is hard for them to do a proper job these days let alone keep their jobs. Those of you that work or worked for FOC know that first hand.
With a change of government possible in 2015 one could hope for better in the future but I am not holding my breath. It will take many people in the environmental movement including Alex to try and preserve what we have and should have for future generations but it will be tough going as there is so many people that put dollars as the number 1 priority over preserving what many of us hold dear.
I know my simple thoughts here will not change you and others but so be it, well maybe some are changing, where is Fisherbob?
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Do you actually know what you are talking about or are you just reaching for conclusions? Ever been on the spawning grounds and conducted enumeration and biological sampling? Ever performed biological sampling of live or fresh dead Pacific Salmon? Does a "mushy" heart necessarily mean that the fish died of some suspicious, foreign pathogen or could it be caused by other factors associated with putrefaction and cellular breakdown? Do you know why scientists prefer to sample live (most preferred) or fresh dead salmon instead of salmon carcasses that have been on the banks, exposed to the elements for an undetermined amount of time? How many fish pathologists, virologists and histologists have you talked to on the subject? What do you know about antibiotic use on BC fish farms? What do you know about prespawn mortality in Pacific Salmon - its prevalence from year to year, during the duration of the run, or between Conservation Units. What do you know about prespawn mortality and how it relates to pathogens and environmental factors such as water discharge and water temperature? What do you know about endemic viruses (i.e. IHNv) and diseases (i.e. IHN) off our coast - it's distribution and pathology? What do you actually know about salmon farming in BC other than what you get from Morton's blog? What do you actually know about fish health on BC fish farms and the monitoring conducted. Have you read the Cohen Final Report? What did the report say about the presence of ISAv and ISA in BC waters in Volume 2?
Just a small tip, please break a post like this into paragraphs as it makes it easier to read . Thanks
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http://www.huffstrategy.com/MediaManager/release/Department-of-Wild-Salmon/12-5-14/Canadian-eco-heroine-and-wild-salmon-advocate-featured-on-CBS-60-/2966.html
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Just a small tip, please break a post like this into paragraphs as it makes it easier to read . Thanks
The post works as a paragraph for me ;)
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The post works as a paragraph for me ;)
A long one then. ;D ;D
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S steve
DFO staff gagged.
Fry full of lice caught in waters near the farms.
Slice & antibiotics .
Farm fish sold in stores that look so bloody sickly.
( maybe fell on the production floor & found the next day & packaged )
Labs have found viruses & instead of a "let's get to the bottom of this" it's more like a mafia sneaky sweep it under the rug" attitude.
It's all about $$$$$ & as long as idiots eat farm salmon & the $$$$ keeps rolling in the powers in charge will be like those 3 monkeys.
I see nothing
I hear nothing
I say nothing.
The Thompson River had crystal clear waters like Lake Louise color.
Today it's far from that.
Point being everything in BC is not as natural & unpolluted as it once was.
Same goes with our coastal waters & beautiful wild salmon.
Last 40-60-70-90 years MAN has used the BC waters as a garbage dump.
At 6:55 pm on the nightly news DFO heads & owners of fish farms should be filmed live eating dinner together.
Menu farm salmon.
The population will tune in like an experiment & see if the eaters after time look more & more healthy OR do does their health get worst & worst. :o
DFO gags their staff & in my books ....something is going on.
Where there's smoke there's fire.
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http://voices.suntimes.com/arts-entertainment/the-daily-sizzle/sues-morning-stretch-shouldnt-we-worry-more-about-our-food-sources/#.U3DvoS_UX6B
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S steve
DFO staff gagged.
Fry full of lice caught in waters near the farms.
Slice & antibiotics .
Farm fish sold in stores that look so bloody sickly.
( maybe fell on the production floor & found the next day & packaged )
Labs have found viruses & instead of a "let's get to the bottom of this" it's more like a mafia sneaky sweep it under the rug" attitude.
It's all about $$$$$ & as long as idiots eat farm salmon & the $$$$ keeps rolling in the powers in charge will be like those 3 monkeys.
I see nothing
I hear nothing
I say nothing.
The Thompson River had crystal clear waters like Lake Louise color.
Today it's far from that.
Point being everything in BC is not as natural & unpolluted as it once was.
Same goes with our coastal waters & beautiful wild salmon.
Last 40-60-70-90 years MAN has used the BC waters as a garbage dump.
At 6:55 pm on the nightly news DFO heads & owners of fish farms should be filmed live eating dinner together.
Menu farm salmon.
The population will tune in like an experiment & see if the eaters after time look more & more healthy OR do does their health get worst & worst. :o
DFO gags their staff & in my books ....something is going on.
Where there's smoke there's fire.
You're hilarious.
Thompson River crystal clear like Lake Louise? Lake Louise is a glacial lake. Do you know what that means?? Think about it. Why is the water that blue-green colour? Obviously you haven't been on the North Thompson River much. Give your head a shake.
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This happens as you well know, in most news stories, they film for days and so much is edited out.
Yes, and in this case they edited out the material that was important clarifying what has been done in regards to testing and detection. Why not mention the testing already done (and continuing) on ISAv by the US and Canada? What about the fact that ISA has never been detected on BC fish farms or that if ISA was present there would be a massive loss of farmed fish - similar to Chile? Why not mention the findings by the Cohen Commission in regards to ISA? The audience can still be for or against, but at least they will know the facts to date.
I didn't think it was a bad news story. In fact, it was more balanced than many I have seen to date. Having the lawyer talk about ISA was really dumb. Of course he sounded flustered because that is not his expertise. He is a lawyer - not a scientist. He questioned scientists during the inquiry but it doesn't make him an expert. Similarly, it was a bad idea to have Ms Morton acting like some fish pathology expert while combing the river banks for salmon carcasses. Morton believes that a "mushy" heart is automatically suspicious for a foreign pathogen that is devastating wild salmon; however, if you were to ask an actual expert in that area he/she could provide a more objective opinion. Admittedly, these days it is hard to access those individuals from government for these interviews, so unfortunately we default to the unknowledgeable activists who take advantage of the situation and the spotlight. In both examples, it shows how the public can easily get misled if the best information is not provided.
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Just a small tip, please break a post like this into paragraphs as it makes it easier to read . Thanks
I usually do, but didn't in this case. Thanks for reading at least.
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http://voices.suntimes.com/arts-entertainment/the-daily-sizzle/sues-morning-stretch-shouldnt-we-worry-more-about-our-food-sources/#.U3DvoS_UX6B
Where do you find this stuff? Atlanta sockeye? Did Almo really say there are no wild salmon left in Chile?
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Where do you find this stuff? Atlanta sockeye? Did Almo really say there are no wild salmon left in Chile?
Have to find things for you to read each day. ;D ;D ;D
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Yes, and in this case they edited out the material that was important clarifying what has been done in regards to testing and detection. Why not mention the testing already done (and continuing) on ISAv by the US and Canada? What about the fact that ISA has never been detected on BC fish farms or that if ISA was present there would be a massive loss of farmed fish - similar to Chile? Why not mention the findings by the Cohen Commission in regards to ISA? The audience can still be for or against, but at least they will know the facts to date.
I didn't think it was a bad news story. In fact, it was more balanced than many I have seen to date. Having the lawyer talk about ISA was really dumb. Of course he sounded flustered because that is not his expertise. He is a lawyer - not a scientist. He questioned scientists during the inquiry but it doesn't make him an expert. Similarly, it was a bad idea to have Ms Morton acting like some fish pathology expert while combing the river banks for salmon carcasses. Morton believes that a "mushy" heart is automatically suspicious for a foreign pathogen that is devastating wild salmon; however, if you were to ask an actual expert in that area he/she could provide a more objective opinion. Admittedly, these days it is hard to access those individuals from government for these interviews, so unfortunately we default to the unknowledgeable activists who take advantage of the situation and the spotlight. In both examples, it shows how the public can easily get misled if the best information is not provided.
The thing that would put this to rest would be for the government to have their people or better still truly independent scientists do a proper analyzes with no interference.
Until they do it makes what is going on very suspicious and it looks like they are trying to do a cover up. It happens all the time these days including all the gag orders which is not good in our democratic process.
I wish I was 40 or 50 years younger and had the knowledge what it takes to do proper testing and I would give the answers, better still if I was the PM I would get it done but I know that will not happen.
Lets hope the next PM cares enough to get the job done and we can all go fishing and not spend hours on this subject, that is if there is any wild fish left for us to angle for.
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The thing that would put this to rest would be for the government to have their people or better still truly independent scientists do a proper analyzes with no interference.
If you are really following this you would know this science is happening now. Drs. Brian Riddell and Kristi Miller, the independent and government scientists you asked for (along with many more DFO collaborators), are busy with genome sequencing diseases in Pacific and farmed Atlantic's. The results of these studies will not be available for several years as much data needs to be collected and correlated; be patient, and enjoy the predicted large salmon runs coming our way, and remember the fact there is no data to implicate farmed salmon to the declines of Pacific's.
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S-steve. I'm 99.999% sure that in the early 1960s the Thompson R had a pure looking river color. A far cry from what it looks today. The river was not polluted as it is today.
Here's my assumption on the nightly tv news live report at 6:55pm to 7pm.
The Dfo heads & fish farm owners smile as they are told they are on air.
They chuckle & dig in to the baked farm salmon.
Next night we all tune in to watch them eat fried farm salmon.
The audience increases to record numbers & the other channels nearly have zero viewers.
Smoked farm salmon.
Canned farm salmon.
On & on...
After a few short years some of the Dfo heads & fish farm owners are being replaced by others,from their respective departments.
Now the talk of the town & rumours is they must of got replaced because of failing health.
Facts are the science department of either SFU or UBC came out in a major local newspaper, like 2 full pages & spelled out that the public should eat only one farm salmon per month.
Eating anymore the article stated would be bad for your health !!!
Think it was back about 15-20 years ago when I read it.
I do not forget certain things in life.
Hate to put bad food in my mouth that will go in, drop into my digestion area & into my bloodstream & into my cells.
Only eat 1 per month or else tells me the fish must be full of crap that will harm my body.
& I'm to hand over $$$ & enjoy the meal ? :o
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If you are really following this you would know this science is happening now. Drs. Brian Riddell and Kristi Miller, the independent and government scientists you asked for (along with many more DFO collaborators), are busy with genome sequencing diseases in Pacific and farmed Atlantic's. The results of these studies will not be available for several years as much data needs to be collected and correlated; be patient, and enjoy the predicted large salmon runs coming our way, and remember the fact there is no data to implicate farmed salmon to the declines of Pacific's.
Of course I know this but still a bit concerned that there still is a FOC connection all around and I believe you would know how KM was handled before.
Also I know you hold BR in high estem as do I but it still worries me in what the out come will be and years to wait may be too long to get the answers we need before we are at a point of no return, I hope I am wrong on all counts.
Also could you give us the results from when you tested the sockeye at the creek mouths and on the Harrison when I did the feature for Global TV (BC TV then) with you I donot think I every heard what the results where, although I know you were checking for the Parvicapsula virus.You should be free to talk now being retired for some time since we did the story, I should review my tape too.
One final note I wonder what new results will be by KM and BR and hope not just a rehash of this.
http://www.watershed-watch.org/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/Exh-1512-CAN464339.pdf
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Of course I know this but still a bit concerned that there still is a FOC connection all around and I believe you would know how KM was handled before.
Also I know you hold BR in high estem as do I but it still worries me in what the out come will be and years to wait may be too long to get the answers we need before we are at a point of no return, I hope I am wrong on all counts.
Also could you give us the results from when you tested the sockeye at the creek mouths and on the Harrison when I did the feature for Global TV (BC TV then) with you I donot think I every heard what the results where, although I know you were checking for the Parvicapsula virus.You should be free to talk now being retired for some time since we did the story, I should review my tape too.
One final note I wonder hat new results will be by KM and BR and hope not just a rehash of this.
http://www.watershed-watch.org/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/Exh-1512-CAN464339.pdf
I understand where you are coming from, but you can't complain DFO isn't doing anything then criticize them when they are doing something. Cohen even said in his recommendations that DFO needs to be the authority and lead in these circumstances. I believe your issue isn't so much with the department as it is who they report to. In that case a change of the guard might have the desirable result you are looking for or it may not. To be clear, it was the Privy Council that directed who Dr. Miller was to talk to - not DFO. If you look at the report and the testimony from the inquiry you will see.
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Also could you give us the results from when you tested the sockeye at the creek mouths and on the Harrison when I did the feature for Global TV (BC TV then) with you I donot think I every heard what the results where, although I know you were checking for the Parvicapsula virus.You should be free to talk now being retired for some time since we did the story, I should review my tape too.
That was a long time ago, Chris. If memory serves we were sampling sockeye that had entered freshwater earlier than normal. This happened very frequently about 10-15 years ago, and almost always resulted in high pre spawn mortalities from Parvicapsula minicornis, a myxosporean parasite (not a virus) that basically shut down the fish's kidney function. This work was published, probably by Dr. Sophie St. Hilaire, or Dr. Simon Jones
The fact you filmed me shows I was not muzzled and in fact, I was encouraged to speak to the public regarding fishery issues, especially those involving Cultus Lake sockeye.
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That was a long time ago, Chris. If memory serves we were sampling sockeye that had entered freshwater earlier than normal. This happened very frequently about 10-15 years ago, and almost always resulted in high pre spawn mortalities from Parvicapsula minicornis, a myxosporean parasite (not a virus) that basically shut down the fish's kidney function. This work was published, probably by Dr. Sophie St. Hilaire, or Dr. Simon Jones
The fact you filmed me shows I was not muzzled and in fact, I was encouraged to speak to the public regarding fishery issues, especially those involving Cultus Lake sockeye.
Right on, too bad they donot allow their people to do that now a days. Should try and find that tape and somehow figure out how to get it up on u tube but that would be like trying to get the answers to the FF issue. :D :D :D
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I understand where you are coming from, but you can't complain DFO isn't doing anything then criticize them when they are doing something. Cohen even said in his recommendations that DFO needs to be the authority and lead in these circumstances. I believe your issue isn't so much with the department as it is who they report to. In that case a change of the guard might have the desirable result you are looking for or it may not. To be clear, it was the Privy Council that directed who Dr. Miller was to talk to - not DFO. If you look at the report and the testimony from the inquiry you will see.
Points taken but these days it seems anything connected to government can be deemed to be very suspicious in what is going on, they need to be more open so the public trust can once again be gained.
Maybe I am being too cynical because of my advanced age as that can happened to us pensioners. ::)
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http://vimeo.com/95472618
If nothing else listen to around the 10 minute mark and you will hear someone else that I believe is held in high esteem how scientist in government are muzzled these days, including FOC.
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"S-steve. I'm 99.999% sure that in the early 1960s the Thompson R had a pure looking river color. A far cry from what it looks today. The river was not polluted as it is today."
--I moved to Kamloops in 1964... I think thats early 60's
--The city of kamloops was basically dumping their effluent into the river with some primary treatment from settlement ponds.
--Ecology students of the then Cariboo college were collecting water samples from kamloops lake to establish baseline data before the addition of Weyco water discharge
--Weyco built the pulp mill in 1972 again adding nutrient to the river however at the time it was aerated and under stricter cotnrol than the city water.
--It was convenient at the time to blame Weyco for the problems of the Thompson however the City of Kamloops was a major contributor being one of the largest growing cities of the time
--People noticed changes to the river downstream and Kamloops lake started to show signs of increased nutrient load.
--The City embarked on a program to modify the treatment of water but still had to dump under permit at some times as did North Kamloops even after the city waste was intergrated.
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Someone should give his head a shake..........
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"S-steve. I'm 99.999% sure that in the early 1960s the Thompson R had a pure looking river color. A far cry from what it looks today. The river was not polluted as it is today."
--I moved to Kamloops in 1964... I think thats early 60's
--The city of kamloops was basically dumping their effluent into the river with some primary treatment from settlement ponds.
--Ecology students of the then Cariboo college were collecting water samples from kamloops lake to establish baseline data before the addition of Weyco water discharge
--Weyco built the pulp mill in 1972 again adding nutrient to the river however at the time it was aerated and under stricter cotnrol than the city water.
--It was convenient at the time to blame Weyco for the problems of the Thompson however the City of Kamloops was a major contributor being one of the largest growing cities of the time
--People noticed changes to the river downstream and Kamloops lake started to show signs of increased nutrient load.
--The City embarked on a program to modify the treatment of water but still had to dump under permit at some times as did North Kamloops even after the city waste was intergrated.
You are comparing treatment done back in the 60s to what is done now? Is the car you drove in the 60s less or more fuel efficient than the one you drive now? What about the emission controls? The City of Kamloops is made many improvements over the years in waste water treatment - likely better than most places. However, the comment about the Thompson having "pure looking" river colour is silly if one were to look at the headwaters of the North Thompson for example. When it rains like it did tonight (especially spring run-off) that river is going to look like chocolate milk. It's called suspended material. A-boater is a funny dude.
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--I wasn't making a point about treatment today... only that.. I'm 99.9% sure the Thompson wasn't so pure back in the 60's.
--The North Kamloops water intake.. (don't know where it is today) was in the North Thompson... cooler water than the South Thompson.
--The North Thompson water system was often shut down during run off due to the turbitity of the North Thompson and the odd Cow that would float down after winter ice off and get stuck near the intake.
--I would hope that the sewer water treatment is much improved now...
Is the car you drove in the 60s less or more fuel efficient than the one you drive now?
-- My 64 falcon got I think 15 mpg my 09 tacoma gets about 29 mpg... but I bet there are more than double the amount of cars on the road so the total amount of fuel being consumed now is likely much more than it was in the 60s.