Fishing with Rod Discussion Forum
Fishing in British Columbia => The Fish Kitchen => Topic started by: kosanin kosher salt on August 11, 2014, 12:28:42 PM
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I got 12 fillets of sockeye currently in the smoker , I checked up on it after an hour and I noticed maybe a dozen white worms squiggling around on the fish . Obviously I want to kill these parasites without discarding the fish , what temperature is adequate you think to kill these ?
I was trying to go low and slow but I guess that ain't happening now , here's a video I found relating to thee exact same worm
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=GkeLTIl3oLo
I didn't freeze these fish , but they were brining for a full day
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-35C for a day or -20C for a week.
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Parasites are only a problem with flossed sockeyes, or ones purchased off the back of a pickup truck, or from Craigslist.
You won't find them in commercially caught fish or ones caught by sport fishermen trolling off the mouth of the river.
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Parasites are only a problem with flossed sockeyes, or ones purchased off the back of a pickup truck, or from Craigslist.
You won't find them in commercially caught fish or ones caught by sport fishermen trolling off the mouth of the river.
Haha! I like your scare tactics, but his linked video contradicts your statement as the fillet is from Costco (Commercially caught). These look pretty gross and I would not be too stoked in finding them crawling around on my fish. Go for a good freeze next time as Rod has suggested. This is the exact reason that sushi is always frozen before being thawed and served. Death to parasites and worms is always a good thing before ingestion.
That being said, Kosanin, I believe the process of smoking them as you are doing would draw them out as it seems to be doing so far. Go back with some tweezers ever couple of hours and skim off any fresh ones that pop out. Hopefully that will do it.
We picked a bunch of blackberries a couple years back and put the ones we didn't gorge on in a container with some water in the fridge. Came back a couple hours later to find dozens of tiny white worms floating. As a gentleman of the outdoors, I shudder to think how many worms I have ingested accidentally in my time.
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Don't take any chances with Anisakis spp..... I'd freeze it after the fish are smoked.
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Don't take any chances with Anisakis spp..... I'd freeze it after the fish are smoked.
Yup! and it'll still taste great after thawing out.
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I concur with Rodney and DragonSpeed - just be certain the freezer used is cold enough because if not, they will survive.
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Before you eat it you have to watch discoveries Monsters inside me :)
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Most home freezers are barely cold enough. Cook your fresh water fish, including salmon, until they are completely dead.
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Most home freezers are barely cold enough. Cook your fresh water fish, including salmon, until they are completely dead.
I usually make sure my fish are completely dead before I cook them. Keeping live ones in the fry pan was just too damn difficult!
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I had that happen as well. Cold smoking lox and tiny white worms were on the surface on my filets. Another thing I heard is when the fish is alive, the worms live in the stomach. When they die the worms migrate to the flesh. So gut your fish after you have bled it. I also freeze it for a couple of weeks before I cold smoke it. Hot smoking should be Ok since you are cooking the fish in the smoker.
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I'll second cooking freshly caught fish as well unless you have a commercial grade freezer! Haven't encountered Anisakis in salmon but I've seen them in some of the bottom fish I catch, particularly greenlings.
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Anisakis spp are not the same as the larger nematodes found in the stomach of the fish when you gut it. Gutting it and removing those bigger ones does not guarantee the flesh of your fish is free of Anisakis spp… There's also no difference between the abundance of parasitic nematodes in freshwater and saltwater fish. If you're going to eat your fish smoked, raw, or cured, again, freeze it at -20C for a week or -35C overnight… Or don't, if you enjoy the possibility of having nematodes burrowing through your stomach wall and migrating into your flesh eventually.
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I got 12 fillets of sockeye currently in the smoker , I checked up on it after an hour and I noticed maybe a dozen white worms squiggling around on the fish . Obviously I want to kill these parasites without discarding the fish , what temperature is adequate you think to kill these ?
I was trying to go low and slow but I guess that ain't happening now , here's a video I found relating to thee exact same worm
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=GkeLTIl3oLo
I didn't freeze these fish , but they were brining for a full day
Think I'm gonna puke!
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Thanks for the replies , once it's done I'll vaccum pack and freeze for a couple weeks
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From the Centre for Disease Control: http://www.cdc.gov/parasites/anisakiasis/faqs.html
How can I prevent anisakiasis?
Do not eat raw or undercooked fish or squid.
The FDA recommends the following for seafood preparation or storage to kill parasites.
Cooking (Seafood in General)
Cook seafood adequately (to an internal temperature of at least 145° F [~63° C]).
Freezing (Fish)
At -4°F (-20°C) or below for 7 days (total time), or
At -31°F (-35°C) or below until solid, and storing at -31°F (-35°C) or below for 15 hours, or
At -31°F (-35°C) or below until solid and storing at -4°F (-20°C) or below for 24 hours.
hot smoking should be adequate to kill the parasite. Cold smoking may be inadequate.
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RalphH, those guidelines are good. Same as used to prepare commercial grade sashimi. My wife is Japanese and we eat sashimi all the time. I can get -23c in my home freezer. Just set it to max and make sure you've got good air circulation. I also put my fish on a baking sheet to help conduct the freezing for a fast freezer, which gives you better meat.
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FYI The baking sheet it pre-chilled.
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What?? wild salmon have parasites?? Chris, please pass this on to Almo ::)
Sorry, couldn't resist and I'm nearly sorry :D
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I hot smoked some salmon this week using a dumb tech "Big Chief" smoker. I put an oven thermometer in and checked the temp. It got over 170F just from the burner and the smoking chips. Like some folks I put a cover to increase the heat in the last few hours and it hit 210. Nine hours in the smoker - after the same time in the brine so I don't think there is any kind of parasite left alive.
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Watched that video...Gonna be sick. Why didn't I know about this before. Going to check my freezer temperature now.
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I have been checking all my sockeye since reading this post. The parasites have been in every sockeye! They look like clear worms, and move when I take them out of the meat. Is this normal in all salmon? Never noticed it before. Just freeze it and make sure it's cooked? Then its fine for consumption?
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Bcdrock - yes it's common in all salmon, trout and especially bottom fish like halibut and ling (last I was aware, anyhoo). I consulted with a popular restaurant chain years ago and their cooks thought it nouveau cuisine to serve seafood skewers (complete with fresh salmon and halibut) medium-ish... At this point you could see the parasites dancing out of the fish while under the heat lamp. Sometimes people mean well but are simply ignorant, which is one thing to do to yourself but quite another to do for others. I had the staff educated and the chef working with suppliers to use frozen product if they weren't going to fully cook their fish. After my tenure, who knows what happened with procedure for the chain, but we must inquire when dining out, regardless of the restaurant calibre.
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The worm in my Sockeye did not like the flavour of seasoning salt so it crawled out. The ones that did not mind seasoning salt are getting bbq'd.
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Bcdrock - yes it's common in all salmon, trout and especially bottom fish like halibut and ling (last I was aware, anyhoo). I consulted with a popular restaurant chain years ago and their cooks thought it nouveau cuisine to serve seafood skewers (complete with fresh salmon and halibut) medium-ish... At this point you could see the parasites dancing out of the fish while under the heat lamp. Sometimes people mean well but are simply ignorant, which is one thing to do to yourself but quite another to do for others. I had the staff educated and the chef working with suppliers to use frozen product if they weren't going to fully cook their fish. After my tenure, who knows what happened with procedure for the chain, but we must inquire when dining out, regardless of the restaurant calibre.
This reminds me of an episode of Top Chef that I saw a few years ago. The finalists were in Alaska and were given a selection of fresh caught salmon to choose from to butcher and prepare. The judges complained that one contestant had "overcooked" the salmon because it was cooked through! I just laughed.
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WAfishboy, sounds right lol
Back in '93 I had the pleasure to cook with John Bixxxx and Pierre Dexxxxxx to host the Presidential Summit of Clinton and Yeltsin, I believe, (just gave my presidential smarties to my young chef cousin). Guess what we cooked him? Sockeye salmon with buerre blanc :) Clinton had his own chefs check everything, sometimes switching complete courses. The salmon was medium well, FYI, and fresh. I'd rather be safe than hip, though. He did ok after, so guess all is well.
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I really wish I had not read this post, ignorance is bliss (sometimes).
However saying that my dad was an animal virologist and there are worms cysts and other horrible parasites in most meats.
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Skagitdreamer , that was a great read from 1st gen renfrew and grandview
I also remember seeing that plaque at queen Elizabeth park , must have been a pleasure .
Btw I cooked some sockeye the other day on the bbq , had it the next day for lunch and pulled out them worms in the cooked flesh , they don't disappear or disintegrate once cooked unfortunately , so cook them well enough ppl
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Thanks, kosanin kosher salt. Good friends and memories between there and 22nd. Changed a lot over the years. I was around a few areas - 1st and commercial, 36th and main, Joyce loop, etc. After JO high school the parents dragged me to poco then clearbrook, but I kept all my friends so it really didn't help hehe.
As a kid we'd play in little mountain area and Riley park. The restaurant was the Quarry house then and never thought I'd be cooking at seasons in the park one day lol yes it's a good memory and I didn't know they had a plaque. :)