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[jetboatjim]

but green wool works so good on a 10 foot leader.

[Fish or cut bait.]

what makes it unethical or ethical?

[/b]

Ethical = The fish takes the hook

Unethical = The hook takes the fish

Since most here know that wool is an acceptable and often successful lure short floated.
(the fish are actually taking it out of hunger, aggression or.....)

Shorten up that leader and see how well your wool works.
doesn't work quite as well does it?
Maybe that's because the fish were never taking the bait to begin with, it was being dragged through their mouths, over their backs, fins and bellies.
Might as well use a barbed treble hook; but that's illegal.
Flossing is just snagging pretending to be fishing.

And yes, I got your sarcasm JBJ

[chris gadsden]

This is another problem this is causing and I feel why our opening for chinook opening was delayed this year. A number of people have predicted a while ago this type of activity would be used against the recreational angler.

http://www.chilliwacktimes.com/will+nets+despite+warning/3286649/story.html

[bbronswyk2000]

This is another problem this is causing and I feel why our opening for chinook opening was delayed this year. A number of people have predicted a while ago this type of activity would be used against the recreational angler.

http://www.chilliwacktimes.com/will+nets+despite+warning/3286649/story.html

In the grand scheme of things flossing is just a dent in the bucket compared to the commercial fishery and native fishery. Makes no difference to me if someone flosses fish. I dont think many get the meaning of ethics. If a doctor is unethical he is doing something either against the law or is breaking a doctors code of conduct. When it comes to sport fishermen it seems the flossing debate is pretty much a 50/50 split. Because of the split their is no real "Code" among fishermen in regards to this. If it was 90/10 than yes. So since their is no true code you go to the law. The law has nothing against people flossing as long as its hooked properly. Than you have your own ethics. If you can live with the fact that you are catching fish that are not willing biters than do what you want. If your conscience gets to you when you do it than dont do it.

[chris gadsden]

In the grand scheme of things flossing is just a dent in the bucket compared to the commercial fishery and native fishery. Makes no difference to me if someone flosses fish. I dont think many get the meaning of ethics. If a doctor is unethical he is doing something either against the law or is breaking a doctors code of conduct. When it comes to sport fishermen it seems the flossing debate is pretty much a 50/50 split. Because of the split their is no real "Code" among fishermen in regards to this. If it was 90/10 than yes. So since their is no true code you go to the law. The law has nothing against people flossing as long as its hooked properly. Than you have your own ethics. If you can live with the fact that you are catching fish that are not willing biters than do what you want. If your conscience gets to you when you do it than don't do it.

I have agree with you it is a dent in the bucket but because of it this is used as a leverage to keep us out of the river. I have said before the impact of the recreational angler in most cases is minimal in the whole scheme of things but we loose the argument the follwing statement when we have BB going on. If we were only bar fishing during the early part of the season, when the river is so turbid the success rate is very small. (Saying this the BB ing crowd take a lot of chinooks over the season, Scale Bar is a prime example but maybe once again it is a lot less than Ocean, F/N and commercial guys do and the recreational angler sure pours a lot more money into the economy, you would think the government would like this, especially with the HST now in effect. Right AF

Even now with conditions fairly good for bar fishing one bar over the weekend, with a fair number of anglers on it had no success while on the other hand one BB er was into 4 chinooks.  (Not the same bar)

Talk about another topic which is unfair. I was told a angler got a 79 cm fish, 2 cm over the size limit and it cost him $150 fine while F/N had a 12 hour opening, I saw one boat unload 38 chinooks into a tote with fish approaching 30 pounds, is this unfair to the recreational angler, I would say yes.

Is there an answer to all of this I donot think so but I feel we will now continue to loose ground in opportunities for salmon in a lot of fresh water rivers. Time to take up lake fishing, head to the ocean or as some say, take up golfing.

It is easy to make lots of comments like I have, but real concrete ideas are few and far between if any at all.

[marmot]

4 yr trial period with FN at the helm of our west coast fishery.  Since the institution that is DFO can't seem to get its head out of its as$ maybe somebody else should get a kick at the cat.

[blaydRnr]

This is another problem this is causing and I feel why our opening for chinook opening was delayed this year. A number of people have predicted a while ago this type of activity would be used against the recreational angler.

http://www.chilliwacktimes.com/will+nets+despite+warning/3286649/story.html

the claims on this article is a crock...i've watched FN fish off island 22 during pink/sockeye season and indiscriminately net/drown unwanted fish, only to have them thrown over board...unwanted pinks and even sturgeon.

[chris gadsden]

the claims on this article is a crock...i've watched FN fish off island 22 during pink/sockeye season and indiscriminately net/drown unwanted fish, only to have them thrown over board...unwanted pinks and even sturgeon.

You are correct but how do we change things or can we so the recreational anglers gets their share many organizations? The SDA, FVSS, Drift Fishers and the BCWF etc. keep trying but appear to be losing ground. The allocation allocation process, conservation, F/N food and ceremonial before the rec angler. The government's policy follows this and seem backed up by the courts of the land.

[Weatherby]

would using a circle hook reduce the chances of fowl hooking a fish when bottom bouncing?

[blaydRnr]

You are correct but how do we change things or can we so the recreational anglers gets their share many organizations? The SDA, FVSS, Drift Fishers and the BCWF etc. keep trying but appear to be losing ground. The allocation allocation process, conservation, F/N food and ceremonial before the rec angler. The government's policy follows this and seem backed up by the courts of the land.

i think if anything, we need to follow suit with FN... regardless of band, they seem to unite when it comes to their so called traditions and so called inherited rights (albeit misguided)... the problem with organizations formed to represent the recreational sector is the lack of co-operation and  co-ordination amongst  its many bodies...if anything personal agendas and priorities dilute key issues.

[chris gadsden]

i think if anything, we need to follow suit with FN... regardless of band, they seem to unite when it comes to their so called traditions and so called inherited rights (albeit misguided)... the problem with organizations formed to represent the recreational sector is the lack of co-operation and  co-ordination amongst  its many bodies...if anything personal agendas and priorities dilute key issues.

Yep

[skaha]

would using a circle hook reduce the chances of fowl hooking a fish when bottom bouncing?

--not much... if flossed through mouth.. circle hook might even be more effective in holding the fish from the outside of the mouth...especially one that is siwashed to a greater degree.

--some jurisdictions attempt to restrict the degree of siwash.. as with to much the circle hook will also  deep hook just the same as a regular siwash J hook.

--gear restrictions aren't the cure.
--In many instances only the fisher knows for sure if they flossed or snagged so it up to them and their conscience wether to release.

[andychan]

--In many instances only the fisher knows for sure if they flossed or snagged so it up to them and their conscience wether to release.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fisher_%28animal%29

[liketofish]

You are correct but how do we change things or can we so the recreational anglers gets their share many organizations? The SDA, FVSS, Drift Fishers and the BCWF etc. keep trying but appear to be losing ground. The allocation allocation process, conservation, F/N food and ceremonial before the rec angler. The government's policy follows this and seem backed up by the courts of the land.

All these organization failed to move the government because they don't have political influence or power. Politicians only listen when they see the votes. They go to or pay lips service to the cultural functions of ethnic groups because they know these groups can collectively lean towards a party or a candidate. If they are perceived as hostile or not attentive to an ethnic group, the whole group can mobilize to influence the outcome of the election of a party or some of its candidates. Such is the power of united groups. Want to learn from the NRA (national rifle association) of the States? Or some powerful unions? They can mobilize their members politically. I can confidently predict that UNLESS FISHING GROUPS ARE UNITED AND ENERGIZED POLITICALLY WITH THE STATED GOAL OF VOTING OUT POLITICIANS UNFRIENDLY TO THEIR CAUSE, NO PROGRESS WILL BE MADE TO ANY RECREATIONAL FISHING ISSUES/AGENDAS.

If site such as this pouplar forum posts candidates' view on fishing issues and have its members gang up on the 'unfriendly candidates' and can prove it in the votes, then we have something going. But Rodney will have to be politically active himself to allow such to happen to his site.    Perhaps we need another 'fishing Vander Zalm' to unite the troup. But I think the ultimate problem is the fishermen themselves - too much division and in fighting for small issues such as this kind of debate and failure to unite for the bigger cause. 

[skaha]

--Sports Anglers contribute nearly $1.2 billion annually to BC's economy according to recent report on Go fish BC site. No political party embraces this neither does the none fishing public. We have to get this message out. I write a column in a local paper... its not a hard thing to do... just keep submitting articles and use some poetic license to ad in items like the $1.2 billion.

--Oh yah this thread is supposed to be about flossing... just because it is not usually enforced doesn't make it legal  and it is fodder to those that think sport fishing is barbaric.  In a regulated select harvest fishery where ( I haven't seen this anyware yet) flossing is specified as legal then fill your boots.