Fishing with Rod Discussion Forum
Fishing in British Columbia => Fishing-related Issues & News => Topic started by: chris gadsden on November 03, 2015, 07:40:47 PM
-
Hoping it will now be implemented with the new government and will help deal with the FF issue as well. Of course the Conservatives just left it and the many millions spent on it on the shelf.
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/british-columbia/millions-of-bc-salmon-mysteriously-disappear-in-troubling-year/article27089342/
-
here is a video i just came across, hope to see changes as well
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TVUAzVpFTiw
-
http://www.farmfreshsalmon.org/how-dishonest-fictional-%E2%80%9Cdocumentary%E2%80%9D-salmon-confidential
-
You beat me to it Bob ;D
-
You beat me to it Bob ;D
Hehe :)
This part says a lot
http://blog.farmfreshsalmon.org/?p=269
-
Thanks guys
-
http://www.farmfreshsalmon.org/how-dishonest-fictional-%E2%80%9Cdocumentary%E2%80%9D-salmon-confidential
It's interesting how people who critique Morton rarely address the issues just her character and credentials.
Dave and FarmerBob are you hoping the Cohen recommendations are enacted? That is what this topic is about no?
-
Yes
-
yes. I was not the first to bring Mortons myths up. Btw, I find it funny you feel the need to call me farmerbob. Typical crusader style I guess. :)
-
It's interesting how people who critique Morton rarely address the issues just her character and credentials.
Dave and FarmerBob are you hoping the Cohen recommendations are enacted? That is what this topic is about no?
Interesting how you just did the same thing you criticize others for.
While I do read posts where people just attack Morton's character and her credentials there are many more that take a closer look at the issues, specifically her theories, her science, and her conclusions. I should add that there are those that subscribe fully with Morton's views who rarely address the issues either - instead just calling those that disagree as hacks, lobbyists, shrills and crooks. As for Morton's credentials, she is the one that is misusing her honorary doctorate degree and as a result opens herself up to fair criticism. She is also not a Fisheries Biologist, so when she makes public comments about Pacific Salmon biology which are incorrect she opens herself up to criticism. You should remember that Morton herself has gone after others more qualified than her for their education and professional credentials, even suggesting that Dick Beamish's Order of Canada should be reconsidered. So, if I don't have much sympathy for her in that respect. If she plays that game then she shouldn't cry when it comes back at her.
http://blog.farmfreshsalmon.org/?p=294
As for the Cohen Report, I hope all the recommendations are enacted; however, the recommendations with enhancement facilities could be a bit outdated and/or not focused where they should be.
-
--I've read parts and also read comments from others on the report.
--A report is just that... a conscidered oppinion, based on the evidence presented, thus as I believe credible people gave evidence, some even complained that they did not give all the they could. Others dropped out of the process.
--Given all that, I accept that many reccomendations should be accepted and acted upon. New evidence and continued science must conscidered.
--So generally for implementation of recommendations but not 110% sold on any one opinion.
-
I can't recall a single statement by anyone associated with J Trudeau or the Liberal campaign that concerned the Cohen Report. JT wasn't even leader if the Party when the report was issued. Given that most observers note their agenda so huge and the list of promises so long I think there isn't a snow ball's chance the report will be taken from the dusty shelf Harper assigned it to. The best we can expect from the Trudeau government is the roll back of Harper's gutting of the fisheries act that left little ability to protect fisheries habitat. Likewise that they return Canada to active participation in the dealing with climate change and global warming both of which are the biggest threat to BC's salmon resource.
-
Interesting that this link (http://blog.farmfreshsalmon.org/?p=269) states:
After the largest recorded return of wild pink salmon in an area of BC known as the Broughton Archipelago occurred in 2000, a weak return followed in 2002. A David Suzuki Foundation-commissioned report concluded it was likely the previously high brood year that over-populated rivers and reduced the out-migrating juveniles
yes when I looked at the executive study it says no such thing and notes numerous factors including the observation of
Several local residents in the study area observed high
numbers of dead and moribund pink juveniles carrying
lethal levels of sea lice in the spring of 2001.
Consequently, sampling of pink juveniles was carried out
from June through early August in near-shore areas
where pinks would be expected to rear.
•
Experimental evidence indicates that a sea lice burden
of over 1.6 lice per gram of fish is always lethal and
burdens as low as 0.75 sea lice per gram of fish can
be lethal.
•
Biologist Alexandra Morton reported that the infection
rate of the sea louse, Lepeophtheirus salmonis, ranged
from 68% to 99% based on samples captured by dip net.
She also reported that sea lice burdens ranged from
13% to 81
and local salmon farms in the Archipelago denied the study access to sea lice data they had collected.
So who is distorting what?
here is the link to the A David Suzuki Foundation-commissioned report executive summary: http://www.davidsuzuki.org/publications/downloads/2004/Salmon_Report.pdf
-
Here's some more reading for you on this subject Ralph
http://fairquestions.typepad.com/rethink_campaigns/ten-reasons-why-some-sea-lice-research-claims-are-false.html
http://www.pac.dfo-mpo.gc.ca/science/people-gens/beamish/PDF_files/ICES%202006%20salmon%20lice.pdf
I'm sure you can find stuff by Volpe and Morton to refute these papers but ask yourself how the pink populations there and close by are doing recently ;D
-
You missed my point by at least 10 miles Dave. But if I elaborate Milo will snap noisily at my ankles while you coo "nice doggy " so I'll just let it rest. :D
-
yeah, probably just as well, Milo has large teeth ;D
-
The study commissioned by the Suzuki Foundation reviewed a number of possible factors that could have contributed to the low productivity of the 2000 brood year. When I read the executive summary I did find that the authors concluded that one of the factors was the high spawner densities. This is also found in the abstract of the main report. However, the authors said that although this egg to fry survival was low – it was not devastating. Now it was not the only factor, but it was suggested by the authors. The authors of the study also discuss the role of environmental impacts (sea surface temperatures, air temperatures, and stream discharge) and conclude that low survival was not the result of this although measurements in the study were based on the closest surrogate site (Port Hardy) and not direct stream measurements from the key study streams. They also suggest that with large number fish farms in the immediate area that sea lice had a serious impact on the survival of the 2000 brood and they go into reasons behind that hypothesis such as low rainfall, high salinities, lice burden levels, and juvenile residency in the area. However, they also conclude that there is no direct evidence of a causal link between sea lice on farmed salmon in the area and mortality of wild juvenile salmon. This also goes for the other factors in the study – there is no direct evidence to determine what caused this mortality. In a nutshell, they conclude this low survival is the result of cumulative impacts throughout the life history of this Pink Salmon brood year.
They also suggest that there is no evidence to indicate that sea lice are the primary invader (primary cause of death) or the secondary invader (opportunistic parasite on an already weakened host with a compromised immune system). In my opinion, this is where it was important at the time to do the proper fish pathology on these juvenile Pink Salmon to rule in or out any bacterial or viral infection. This was not done. How do we know if these juveniles were already compromised before they were infected with sea lice? We don’t. I don’t fully agree with the author’s contention that the lack of fish farm cooperation was the cause of not being able to find out if sea lice were the primary or secondary invader. The authors say that primary invaders (such as bacterial and viral pathogens) are not unusual in the sea farm industry so given that there is overlap between farmed and wild fish in the immediate area then lateral transmission is possible. I agree having knowledge of any bacterial or viral outbreak at those fish farms in the vicinity could have been helpful; however, that should not have prevented the necessarily sampling of juvenile Pink Salmon and subsequent diagnostic investigation (i.e. bacteriology, virology, and histology) at the time. In my opinion, the authors basically assumed that any bacterial and viral infections would have come from near by fish farms, but this ignores that fact that these pathogens are endemic and already exist in wild populations in BC. Cohen Technical Report #1 reviews all these endemic pathogens. That same report says that most of our current knowledge of salmonid diseases at the time of that technical report was based on research from cultured fish from either government hatcheries or aquaculture. There is an absence of this data from wild population because historically most this effort has been put into cultured fish (This is one of the Cohen recommendations. Studies like the Fish Health Initiative between DFO and Genome BC will hopefully shed more light on this.). When you look at a subsequent report (Marty et al 2010) on that same issue years later they conclude that this proper diagnostic work should have been done to the wild fish to rule in or out other compromising conditions. The role of this potential mortality in 2001 is unknown.
Relationship of farm salmon, sea lice, and wild salmon populations
http://faculty.vetmed.ucdavis.edu/faculty/gdmarty/2010PNAS107_52_22599-22604.pdf
-
I've fished beside Milo a couple of times. The best I recall he had big hands & clumsy feet. I had to ask him to avoid stepping on the fish since he kept trying to wade out beyond them. Funny you link to one of Krause's 'columns'. A former PR person in the salmon farming industry she was rather infamously told to FO by D.S. after she tried to introduce herself in a Vancouver coffee bar. She put considerable effort into whining about it in public. Poor girl. I just love how people use previously paid and obviously biased sources or those that are just distorted to the point of all but lying to 'prove' someone else is either lying or distorting data or information. It proves the old adage that one should never wrestle with a pig.
Oh and just to add, to the best of my recollection salmon pens were pulled out of the area of emptied in subsequent years when outbound pink salmon were moving through the area plus the industry adopted measures to greatly reduce lice infestation in and around the pens. While the reasons for the collapse of salmon runs are numerous and complicated and we don't understand them (no thanks to DFO re: that mystery) the industry must have had it's doubts. This too is the history of the industry - reacting after the fact to public outcry to massive escapes of salmon, massive waste under salmon pens and the over use of antibiotics and other medications directly into open ocean waters. First they hire PR spin doctors and after that doesn't work then act. Why not act responsibly in the 1st place?
For that matter why has DFO, which once had a prime mandate to conserve wild salmon been converted into a paid shill for the salmon farming industry?
-
http://www.financialpost.com/m/wp/blog.html?b=business.financialpost.com//fp-comment/fp-letters-money-trail-gets-fishy
-
I can't recall a single statement by anyone associated with J Trudeau or the Liberal campaign that concerned the Cohen Report. JT wasn't even leader if the Party when the report was issued. Given that most observers note their agenda so huge and the list of promises so long I think there isn't a snow ball's chance the report will be taken from the dusty shelf Harper assigned it to. The best we can expect from the Trudeau government is the roll back of Harper's gutting of the fisheries act that left little ability to protect fisheries habitat. Likewise that they return Canada to active participation in the dealing with climate change and global warming both of which are the biggest threat to BC's salmon resource.
"Act on recommendations of the Cohen Commission on restoring sockeye salmon stocks in the Fraser River. - See more at: http://pm.gc.ca/eng/minister-fisheries-oceans-and-canadian-coast-guard-mandate-letter#sthash.9pNOvZ7F.dpuf
an exert from JT's mandate letter to the new DFO minister
-
Another great rally today in Abbotsford,I have put my pictures on Salmon are Sacred FB page. Will have video up for Dave there later. ;D ;D
-
http://salmonconfidential.com/skewering-sacred-salmon/
-
Another great rally today in Abbotsford,I have put my pictures on Salmon are Sacred FB page. Will have video up for Dave there later. ;D ;D
if you really want me to see it post it here; you know I don't do Facebook.
-
if you really want me to see it post it here; you know I don't do Facebook.
Just click here. https://www.facebook.com/#!/groups/111365508874859/
Also you can get alot of facts you are missing these days.lol
-
As I said, I don't do FB
Can't be that important I guess ;D
-
As I said, I don't do FB
Can't be that important I guess ;D
In the dark ages one could say, it will not bite you. ;D ;D
-
"Act on recommendations of the Cohen Commission on restoring sockeye salmon stocks in the Fraser River. - See more at: http://pm.gc.ca/eng/minister-fisheries-oceans-and-canadian-coast-guard-mandate-letter#sthash.9pNOvZ7F.dpuf
an exert from JT's mandate letter to the new DFO minister
excellent