Fishing with Rod Discussion Forum
Fishing in British Columbia => Fly Fishing Cafe => Topic started by: FlyNut on July 14, 2004, 04:54:42 PM
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How far are you supposed to cast, before you are considered good.
Without hauling: 50 feet? (ALL wind conditions)
With double-hauling: 90-100 feet? (hello surf fishin')
Are these reasonable. I am working on reaching 50 feet (not yet). :)
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these are good distances, but you dont need to be a distance caster. you just need to cast to where the fish are. whether it be 50 or 90 feet it really is just for bragging rights. ;D
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these are good distances, but you dont need to be a distance caster. you just need to cast to where the fish are. whether it be 50 or 90 feet it really is just for bragging rights. ;D
True for regular casts. For surf casting, you gotta get there.
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Actually the longer the cast the more water you cover so it does matter how long a line you throw in most fishing situations especially in still water and surf areas.
I am no "expert" but I can consistantly throw about 65-75' in most conditions. A great cast for me CAN go the full 90' but I can only pull that off with the slime line.
Taking the statistic that most fish are caught in the first 10% of the cast retrieval, it just makes sense to have the biggest 10% you can by throwing a longer line. ;)
For still waters especially when the water is glass conditions then the long cast is not only helpful but in some cases essential.
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Actually the longer the cast the more water you cover so it does matter how long a line you throw in most fishing situations especially in still water and surf areas.
I am no "expert" but I can consistantly throw about 65-75' in most conditions. A great cast for me CAN go the full 90' but I can only pull that off with the slime line.
Taking the statistic that most fish are caught in the first 10% of the cast retrieval, it just makes sense to have the biggest 10% you can by throwing a longer line. ;)
For still waters especially when the water is glass conditions then the long cast is not only helpful but in some cases essential.
Floonster, casting effectiveness was driven home for me when I tried to cast in Vedder. The water is way too fast, so you gotta have a great upstream cast, to let the line sink by the time you are way downstream. On Vedder, the fish were caught at the end of the pool where I was standing (just before retrieval).
I am working on my 40 feet cast. There is a guy who is gonna teach me surf casting, but he said to call on him when I can consistently do 50 ft. ::)
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In the situation you descibed, try a well weighted fly combined with a heavy sink tip. In faster flows such as the Chehalis and Vedder I fish a 328 grain sink tip. If I find I am still not getting down to the fish then I will add a fly weighted with a bead or perhaps even bar bell eyes.
Of course with this line I will also use an 8wt to handle all the weight I'm flinging around.
To aid your casting stroke, try while keeping your elbow on an even plane, throwing your back cast "up" and your forward cast straight forward, aiming for about 4' above the water surface. Also watch your line/rod on both the back and forward cast. When the rod begins to bend (load) begin the stroke in the opposite direction. You need to wait until the line in fully straightened to avoid "tailing loops".
There was a casting video on this site that explained the elbow thing quite nicely by Lefty Kreh. He's the man.
Also I found that casting a sink tip really helped me identify when the loading process was happening on my rod too. If you haven't tried one, I suggest you do.
Cheers!
Floon*
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In the situation you descibed, try a well weighted fly combined with a heavy sink tip. In faster flows such as the Chehalis and Vedder I fish a 328 grain sink tip. If I find I am still not getting down to the fish then I will add a fly weighted with a bead or perhaps even bar bell eyes.
Of course with this line I will also use an 8wt to handle all the weight I'm flinging around.
To aid your casting stroke, try while keeping your elbow on an even plane, throwing your back cast "up" and your forward cast straight forward, aiming for about 4' above the water surface. Also watch your line/rod on both the back and forward cast. When the rod begins to bend (load) begin the stroke in the opposite direction. You need to wait until the line in fully straightened to avoid "tailing loops".
There was a casting video on this site that explained the elbow thing quite nicely by Lefty Kreh. He's the man.
Also I found that casting a sink tip really helped me identify when the loading process was happening on my rod too. If you haven't tried one, I suggest you do.
Cheers!
Floon*
Thanks Floon. I am the one putting that casting video up 8) Lefty's technique, which is suited for long casting, requires one to "open up", put the left foot forward, and follow the cast sideways. This is not what I learned initially, but I guess that's where I need to go to cast the heavy stuff and/or long distance.
I did not have the proper set up for Vedder (6 weight) so I was more or less just playing. If I go again, it would have to be with a heavier rod (don't have one), and much heavier set up (extra weights) to get the fly down. But first, practice on land, I guess. I don't have a sink-tip line, but I have a fast-sink leader (not the same from loading standpoint). I should try sink-tip line sometimes (one more spool and line to buy :o).
I am happy to hear that it is possible to fish those fast waters on fly. That gives me determination to work towards that.
Thanks, FlyNut :D
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You don't need to buy a whole new spool of line. You can use the loop system and attach different types of tips to your existing fly line.
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You don't need to buy a whole new spool of line. You can use the loop system and attach different types of tips to your existing fly line.
If you do want to use a tip system with an an existing flyline you will have to cut it at the taper and then loop it as well. I suggest checking with your local fly shop before you try this. ;)
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Floonster is right, cut up to 75% of the front taper off & attach your looped tips to this. Depending on the weight & length of your tips this removal of skinny taper will help to turn over your heaviest tips. No need to buy an expensive new line.
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Floonster is right, cut up to 75% of the front taper off & attach your looped tips to this. Depending on the weight & length of your tips this removal of skinny taper will help to turn over your heaviest tips. No need to buy an expensive new line.
Why would I "maul" my existing fly line. Am I not better off buying a fast sinking tip fly line ($30 on the low side), and then spooling it on the spool I already have (knowing in advance that I am going to a fast water, e.g. Vedder right now).
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FlyNut, what you should do is to spool the " extra Fast sink-tip line" to a spare spool bring that along with your exsiting fly line.. Casue you never know what condiction you will be facing. Yes, you know 95% of time fish will be holding in the deep, fast run. But Once in awhile, fish will be holding in the shallow tailout. If that happen, what you gonna do?? Go home and pick up your line and spool it back on?? No, you can't do that. you have to be prepare of most condiction and work around it. Thats why i often suggest ppl to buy a multi-tip system, cause that you can cover most condiciton by change a different sink tip to get you down tot he fish... Anyway, goodluck fishing.
marco
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The Veddar has many different runs etc. One tip will not cut it. I know cutting up the front taper sounds like mauling but with the loops on there you can now add any tip you like, & with the cutt off taper simply add loops & you have a floating tip. Good luck.
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The Veddar has many different runs etc. One tip will not cut it. I know cutting up the front taper sounds like mauling but with the loops on there you can now add any tip you like, & with the cutt off taper simply add loops & you have a floating tip. Good luck.
Thanks, JP. I will have the people at the fly shop show me how to set it up according to your instructions.
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Funny subject...as long as you can cast where the fish are, you're doin alright i would think. Plus, there are lots of ways to cast to shorter more difficult targets, like rolling and stuff, sidecasting, etc. I think its more about being accurate. Just watch somebody casting into a tiny stream into a little pool while standing behind a boulder so they dont spook the fish and you understand immediately! On lakes too distance is way less important now with the advent of float tubes and the like, at least thats my guess.
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30 to 50 feet with control and accuracy using either hand.
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30 to 50 feet with control and accuracy using either hand.
Of course no hands would be even cooler. :D :-* ;) ;D
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Funny subject...as long as you can cast where the fish are, you're doin alright i would think. Plus, there are lots of ways to cast to shorter more difficult targets, like rolling and stuff, sidecasting, etc. I think its more about being accurate. Just watch somebody casting into a tiny stream into a little pool while standing behind a boulder so they dont spook the fish and you understand immediately! On lakes too distance is way less important now with the advent of float tubes and the like, at least thats my guess.
I agree distance casting is probably not very important in a lake or on a small river. However I think when one is wading a larger river (and fast flowing like Vedder) or ocean casting, then the distance becomes important.
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The distance you cast should be kept in relation to the trees behind you ;D
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these are good distances, but you dont need to be a distance caster. you just need to cast to where the fish are. whether it be 50 or 90 feet it really is just for bragging rights. ;D
I agree. It's not how far, but how close. If you have good aim then you are far better off then if you can haul it off 90 ft. But if you can get it to go 90 ft and land exatly where you aimed it then you are gooooooooood
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I'd say distance, accuracy, consistency and the quality of the loops are all important variables.
You have to be able to throw a forward and a backward loop in the same form, shoot a line 80-100 feet in exactly the place you want it, every time.
When you see Pros like Tom White, Steve Rajeff, etc, you'll know what I mean. Watching the pros cast is like watching art... The elegance is quite something to see.
When Tom White taught me to cast, he stepped things up a notch, and casted a 60 foot line with his finger! Too cool. Or has anyone seen him cast 10 flyrods at the same time? Never saw that, but I heard that was pretty impressive.
Cheers,
Nicole
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I have two Tom White videos for the beginning caster. He is an excellent teacher. They're available for lending if anybody needs them (Langley area) or check your local library.
One thing I noticed - whenever my casting really starts to suck, I dress the line, and that usually improves things about 1000%. It has to slide freely to have any control.
The farthest I've been able to cast so far is about 65 feet with my WF6F setup. I just started a couple of months ago so I think I'm doing OK. :)
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Ya. That's about it for me (65-70' with the same setup) without losing control and acuaracy. I think that practice is what is required and it takes a lot to get really good. I find the double haul is my biggest failure. I think I need more lessons and should stop chewing gum when I cast ::)
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I have no control or accuracy at 65 feet. Maybe one out of 5 casts makes it that far, and of those, maybe one out of 2 or 3 unrolls properly. At 40 or 50 feet my control is a bit better.
I've got a ways to go yet before I'm "accomplished". But nice sunny days like the last few have made practicing a lot more fun. :)
Went out on the Vedder yesterday and tried to cast a heavy homemade sink tip (LC-13) ... now that was a humbling experience. I'm really looking forward to that Anglers West course on fly fishing for salmon on Oct. 23. At this point I really need to watch someone who actually knows what they're doing. ::)
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When I stopped hooking my ear and the back of my head I felt I was accomplished. ;D
When the river gets crowded, I haul out the fly rod to help make some room as Im bit of a flogger with the fly rod. ;)
I have no excuse for my questionable casting ability as I remember when about 8 or so, Nicole introduced me to fly fishing on 'pike minnows' in the Fraser while we bar fished. I was hooked (in several ways) on fly fishing from then on.
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30 to 50 feet with control and accuracy using either hand.
Of course no hands would be even cooler. :D :-* ;) ;D
that's called trolling dude.. heheheh