Fishing with Rod Discussion Forum
Fishing in British Columbia => Fishing-related Issues & News => Topic started by: chris gadsden on July 28, 2009, 10:35:36 PM
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Just received an e - mail with minutes from a meeting held tonight that it is highly unlikely there will be a rec sockeye opening this season.
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thats fine with me. the more to spawn the more to return. I much rather see more get to their native streams so i can chase trout behind them anyways ;D ;D
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thats fine with me. the more to spawn the more to return. I much rather see more get to their native streams so i can chase trout behind them anyways ;D ;D
Of course I will not miss it either and the river will remain calm until the pink start arriving. ;D
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I was looking forward to it as I never tried one, most of my friends say they're the best eating. But I can also live with that decision. But what I don't understand is why is the rec fishing closed while the commercial and first nations are allowed to fish for it? Each Party retains more then all rec - fishermen together! If they really want to save the stocks it should be forbidden to everybody, But that's just another "it's all about the buck" decision! Just look what the superstores or save ons or what ever their name is are selling like nothing at the moment (or trying to sell and dump it after a few days) Just to let you know, i'm not a Canadian. I saw and knew what happend to the Salmon Stocks in Europe, I saw it in Norway as I was fishing a lot up there before I moved to Canada, I've heard about Ireland... Exactly the same thing is happening here and it's almost too late to stop it. It's taking place! Why can't people learn from mistakes of others. Sorry for that, I'm not allowed and I don't want to judge over your government but in that case it's more than obviously.
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There are no commercial openings for Fraser River sockeye salmon. Openings in the commercial sector are only available once it is opened for the recreational sector.
First Nations' openings supercede the other two sectors once escapement requirement is met for each stock.
At this point, if the summer run return reaches the revised estimation at 90% probability (2.8 million fish), there are just enough to meet escapement requirement and First Nation's FSC requirement. The early and late summer runs will be low that the FN's FSC requirement may or may not be met. Based on this information, it is unlikely at this point that the recreational sector will see an opening this August.
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I was talking about the whole situation here,Rod! I know there is no commercial opening but aren't the fish in the ocean the fish that will return to the rivers?
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No.
I'll rephrase the first sentence of my last post.
There are no commercial openings for Fraser River-bound sockeye salmon, in river or ocean.
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Hmm maybe this will free up some more spots to try out barfishing from shore when the river drops. I for one am perfectly ok with the run being closed to sportsfishing as long as they don't net them still.
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It looks like it will be like the last pink run - no sockeyes but you can target pink. ;D Perfectly fine with me. Just make sure DFO is going after each illegal net they can find and prosecute those who dare the closures. It will be sad if we are not allowed a single sockeye but the natives flood the black markets with the precious stock. :(
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It looks like it will be like the last pink run - no sockeyes but you can target pink. ;D Perfectly fine with me. Just make sure DFO is going after each illegal net they can find and prosecute those who dare the closures. It will be sad if we are not allowed a single sockeye but the natives flood the black markets with the precious stock. :(
Write your MP's and a letter to the editor of the big dailiy or local papers.
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No.
I'll rephrase the first sentence of my last post.
There are no commercial openings for Fraser River-bound sockeye salmon, in river or ocean.
I would imagine the Americans will be comercial fishing for them.
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Fine with me. The sockeye harvest is a blast but we have to make this sacrifice. At this point though, DFO really needs to take charge of this fishery. If the sockeye numbers can't withstand a fishery they should be protected by the implementation of a 24" leader length restriction!
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With the way the water temperature is rising in the Fraser, they need to just shut the whole fishery down for all user groups, including first nations.
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This is my response to the e- mail I received from FOC.
Thank you Deb and I think the Fraser Panel has made the correct decision with the low forecast of returning fish to their natal streams. I was out on the Fraser at Chilliwack yesterday and it was 20 c so that will start of have an impact as well as it will get warmer in the days ahead.
I also urge FOC and F/N to do their part as the rec sector as well to preserve the runs for the future. We must not made the wrong decision like happened on the East Coast of Canada a few years ago. We are all accountable to future generations so they can maybe once again see the sockeye and other salmon runs back to historic levels, there is no excuse not to and we all must do our part. It can be done with sound management and the cooperation of all users groups as the fish come first over any other reason why they should be able to harvest them..
Kindest regards,
Chris
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At this point of time when springs and sockeyes are in the river , a leader length restriction is best to avoid catching any sockeyes when going after the springs . I would say a 3 foot leader is sufficient for springs or shut the river down until the sockeyes have gone through or the projected numbers have gone through .
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At this point of time when springs and sockeyes are in the river , a leader length restriction is best to avoid catching any sockeyes when going after the springs . I would say a 3 foot leader is sufficient for springs or shut the river down until the sockeyes have gone through or the projected numbers have gone through .
You can still catch sockeye with a 3 foot leader. Just shut it down to everyone.
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At this point of time when springs and sockeyes are in the river , a leader length restriction is best to avoid catching any sockeyes when going after the springs . I would say a 3 foot leader is sufficient for springs or shut the river down until the sockeyes have gone through or the projected numbers have gone through .
The best method at this time is just to bar fish as you will catch very few sockeye or none at all.
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Head down to Washington. I've limited every time I've been out on the Columbia River and Lake Wenatchee opens next week. Quick limits for a boat full in 45 minutes.
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Head down to Washington. I've limited every time I've been out on the Columbia River and Lake Wenatchee opens next week. Quick limits for a boat full in 45 minutes.
How are they catching them? :-\ :-X
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slow trolling with a dodger, 14" leader and 2 red octopus hooks tied like a herring rig, but with only 1" of space between hooks.
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socks are farily small (avg. 4 lbs with an occasional 7-8 lb fish), but very fresh considering how far they've travelled. Limits are 4 fish per day. We're also catching springs (AKA, Chinook for us Americans).
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FYI. Below email received from Ms. Morton.
Hello
This week the Fraser River sockeye run was critically downgraded. This was no surprise to me as I looked at this generation of Fraser sockeye and they were infected with sea lice near the fish farms from Campbell River to eastern Johnstone Strait. While they are bigger than pink and chum salmon when they enter the sea, they are damaged by the lice, you can see an image on the website www.adopt-a-fry.org The pattern keeps repeating. If they caught farm lice when they were young, they never come home. As soon as the farm salmon are removed, they do come home.
Actor William Shatner is lending his star power to our efforts and wrote to Prime Minister Stephen Harper. His letter is on our website.
One of the signatories on our letter to the Minister of Fisheries generously donated his services to produce a full page information ad on salmon farms. You can see Gary Dunham, of Mercury Graphics in Langley BC's work on the "Action" page at www.adopt-a-fry.org Thank you Gary for your patience and talent.
Many people have heard about the salmon farming controversy, but they don’t know the specifics. I have included some of the many issues that are causing the problems with this industry. I would really like to hear from you about which local newspapers this should appear in. If you could send me a link to the paper that would be really great. Any financial assistance in running this ad in your community would also be welcome.
The downgrade of the Fraser sockeye is a warning we can choose to ignore or react to. Alaska is seeing huge sockeye returns and they do not allow Atlantic salmon to be penned on their salmon migration routes. We can make many guesses as to what happened to our sockeye, but it does not make sense to ignore the one that has been researched and published and seen worldwide. Commercial, sport and tourism operators are taking losses to protect our wild salmon and yet the fish farms just keep getting bigger and more numerous.
There is something very wrong here and if we want our wild salmon we need to speak now or forever lose our fish.
Standing by,
Alexandra Morton
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FYI. Below email received from Ms. Morton.
Hello
Actor William Shatner is lending his star power to our efforts and wrote to Prime Minister Stephen Harper. His letter is on our website.
Well we're saved now.
(http://www.lifeemerging.com/files/images/captain-kirk.jpg)
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yesterdays seine test at blinkhorn area 12 was pretty good for socks,huge for pinks. the next 7-14 days will tell if things are as bad as forecast. dont write off the sockeye yet. fish dont have a watch and can delay migration for various reasons.
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You can still catch sockeye with a 3 foot leader. Just shut it down to everyone.
Very true. My original 24" suggestion was because that would pretty much eliminate the flossers. Yeah, you could still floss with a two foot leader, but I think your catches would be pretty limited. Most flossers would probably give up, or better yet, get out the bar gear. Maybe a restriction to 18" would be better.
I think that shutting the river down to all rec fishing would be a bad decision. Spring are pink returns this year are strong. They can be caught without snagging and intercepting sockeye. These fisheries have large economic benefits to the guide industry, and the province as a whole. Also, it is important to have the recreational sector on the river to keep an eye on the First Nations fishery.
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Also, it is important to have the recreational sector on the river to keep an eye on the First Nations fishery.
And this would be the reason to shut it down. Then there will be no calls to answer and return regarding illegal fishing going on. The chief in the chilliwack area always lobbies to keep the rec fishermen off the river as the rec fishermen are the ones that phone his band in.
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At this point of time when springs and sockeyes are in the river , a leader length restriction is best to avoid catching any sockeyes when going after the springs . I would say a 3 foot leader is sufficient for springs or shut the river down until the sockeyes have gone through or the projected numbers have gone through .
its easier to just say.....barfishing only.....plunkin' only
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with this heat wave that we're experiencing, water temps are through the roof. NOT GOOD NEWS!
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Ref Rod's earlier post - when fishing the ocean, how do you know whether a salmon is Fraser-bound? Is it to do with a specific area in the seas?
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Well we're saved now.
(http://www.lifeemerging.com/files/images/captain-kirk.jpg)
hahhahahahah, good one. Shatner is the man!
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2001 saw most of the sockeye come in late augest , 2005 saw 80% of sockeye in september this run is just late thats all . 11 million is coming through and ill catch my 2sox. cant wait 2009 banner year!
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KKS I like your attitude
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ishery Notice - Fisheries and Oceans Canada
Subject: FN0569-Salmon: Fraser River Sockeye Update - July 28 - Areas 11 to 29
The Fraser River Panel met July 28 to receive an update on the migration of the
Fraser River sockeye runs and review the status of migration conditions in the
Fraser River watershed.
Test fishing catches of sockeye in Johnstone Strait and Juan de Fuca Strait as
well in the Fraser River indicate continued low migration of Fraser River
sockeye. The migration of Early Summer-run sockeye through marine assessment
areas continues to be much lower than expected to-date. The Panel adopted a run
size recommendation further down grading the Early Summer run from 264,000 fish
to 150,000. The escapement of Early Summer-run sockeye past Mission through
July 27 is approximately 45,000 fish.
Summer-run sockeye have been entering the marine assessment areas over the past
couple of weeks and have also been well below expectations. It is too early to
make an in-season run size estimate for Summers however they are tracking
consistent with Early Summer stock group. The estimated escapement of Summer-
run sockeye past Mission through July 27 is approximately 28,000 fish.
Migration conditions for sockeye entering the Fraser River are deteriorating.
On July 27 the Fraser River discharge at Hope was approximately 4,100 cms,
which is approximately 15%-20% lower than normal. Water temperatures are the
larger issue. Temperatures at Qualark Creek were 19.8 C on July 27th, which
more than 20C higher than average for this date. Fraser River water
temperatures are forecast to reach approximately 21.7 C by August 5th, which
would set all time record highs. Water temperatures exceeding 20 C may cause
high enroute mortality of Fraser River sockeye.
There are no directed recreational and commercial fisheries for Fraser River
sockeye at the present time. First Nations sockeye fisheries have been
curtailed and DFO is planning meetings with First Nations groups to review
current information.
Next Panel meeting is July 31st.
FOR MORE INFORMATION:
Barry Rosenberger 250-851-4892
Fisheries and Oceans Canada Operations Center - FN0569
Sent July 29, 2009 at 16:12
Visit us on the Web at http://www.pac.dfo-mpo.gc.ca
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First Nations sockeye fisheries have been
curtailed and DFO is planning meetings with First Nations groups to review
current information.
Next Panel meeting is July 31st.
Wow! This is unprecedented, isn't is? In the past DFO has always just recommended that the Natives stop fishing, haven't they?
Serious stuff...
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Test fishery numbers are starting to look good - we may have a chance yet.
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Agreed I think they are late.....
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Test fishery numbers are starting to look good - we may have a chance yet.
Not if our weather does not change. If it continues to stay hot then the water temps will be too high and they will need as many sockeye getting threw as possible.
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Agreed I think they are late.....
maybe they know its too hot and hanging around in the ocean
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The number of salmon visible on the incoming tides has really increased the last little while. The test fishery is also showing more, but not really like the large catches in the good years.
http://www.psc.org/info_testfishing_summaries.htm
Interesting that the test fisheries alone have already caught over 10,000 sockeye already this year!
With all the information posted above it doesn'y sound like it will open any time soon. I guess there is hope that if the numbers continue to improve, and the weather changes enough to allow better river conditions for fish they might decide on an opening later. If we get the usual rains that start with the PNE in mid-late August maybe they will open it then?
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yesterdays seine test at blinkhorn area 12 was pretty good for socks,huge for pinks. the next 7-14 days will tell if things are as bad as forecast. dont write off the sockeye yet. fish dont have a watch and can delay migration for various reasons.
Area 12 is near the North end of Vancouver Island, on the inside. Looks like quite a few sockeye, and a huge amount of pinks are on their way down through Campbell River and eventually the Fraser. Interesting for those of us planning Campbell River trips this August! ;D
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I would imagine the Americans will be comercial fishing for them.
Only if they violate the Pacific Salmon Treaty. The Pacific Salmon Commission is responsible for the joint interests of American and Canadian commercial fisheries.
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I also believe that many sockeye will be sitting in the ocean.
Why would these fish come up the river when the water is warm, when they can sit in the ocean and fuel up on food and energy.
If we know these temps are strefful to the fish, don't you think they would figure out they are going to die if they keep going?
Hopefully the temps drop and the run is just late like it probably is.
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As much I like to fish for sockeye, they have been in decline for a number of years now. I think iit's best the don't open it, the fraser water temperatures are way too high at present and that's the biggest concern right now. Keep it shut down to everyone, including first nations.
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As much I like to fish for sockeye, they have been in decline for a number of years now. I think iit's best the don't open it, the fraser water temperatures are way too high at present and that's the biggest concern right now. Keep it shut down to everyone, including first nations.
but what if the decline has nothing to do with natives or commercial guys; but squarely on fish farms devastating juvenile sockeye?
turning a blind eye and just closing the sockeye fishing will do nothing to fix the fish farm as the problem.
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but what if the decline has nothing to do with natives or commercial guys; but squarely on fish farms devastating juvenile sockeye?
turning a blind eye and just closing the sockeye fishing will do nothing to fix the fish farm as the problem.
While i do agree that fish farms are a problem to our fish stocks and the problem does need to be fixed the reasons for our declining fish stocks goes allot farther than just the fish farms and unfortunately there is no quick fix to the problems that need to be dealt with and the easiest solution to allow some form of sustainability to our stocks would be to close it down to all groups until we can correct some of the man made detriments our salmon are facing.
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Sure is nice to see the Albion test nets getting way more sockeye and yes they are still using the bigger mesh nets for chinook.
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So why were the boats out yesterday and today???Dont get it.
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Because they are natives. Who's in tune with nature.
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So why were the boats out yesterday and today???Dont get it.
There are likely boats on the river because the Kwikwitlem First Nation has a 48 hour drift net opening for Chinook from the 1st to the 3rd.
"Curtailed" means to cut back or reduce. It does not mean suspended or terminated as I suspect some are reading it to mean in the Fraser River update notice.
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The test fishery numbers have improved substaintually in all areas over the past few days, which is good to see. Too bad the Fraser is so warm.
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Finally some cooler weather and at least a bit of rain in the next few days!
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